There was no refutation, no saying what samadhi is or isn't, only a
clear warning about mounting a defense of it's value. One you clearly
missed in your rush to defend it.
You may refute all you like, I was simply sharing something.
Your conversation with a dead man, is interesting though...
KG
On 8/2/2012 5:31 PM, mike brown wrote:
Kris,
Quoting Bodhidharma to refute the place of samadhi/dhyana (jhana) is a
bit like cross-examing Mitt Romney in the hope he'll say something
constructive about free health care. Anyway, ...
>Question: "What is a demon mind?" Answer: "Closing the eyes
[in the cross-legged sitting posture] and entering samadhi."
>Question: "[What if] I gather the mind into dhyana so that it does not
move?"
>Answer: "This is bondage samadhi. It is useless.
The sutras attributable to Buddha mention mindfulness about a dozen
times. Loving-kindness about a 100 times. Jhanas over a 1000 times.
Staring at a wall 0 times.
>This holds even for the four dhyanas, each of which is merely one
stage of quiescence from
which you will return to disturbance again.
Yes, exactly like zazen.
>They are not to be valued.
Not in themselves, no. But as a support to insight wisdom they are
almost indispensable.
>These are created dharmas,
It's funny how the 4 jhanas follow the same method for everyone to
enter them, and when they are entered they follow the same pattern
from first into second, from second into third etc. This is true for
everyone (the well-practiced adept can move thru them quicker and
enter them almost at will). Without the hindrances, the mind moves to
an ever still and pure state until the mind disappears all together.
>dharmas that will be destroyed again,
Of course! And this is exactly the insight that wisdom comes from. All
arises and passes. We experience the kind of bliss in jhanas that
cannot be experienced in day to day life. We use mindfulness to
penetrate the meaning of craving experientially - not just intellectually.
>not ultimate Dharma.
Ultimate Dharma just is. Bohdidharma, at least in this quote, seems to
be mistaking the raft for the shore.
>If you can understand that intrinsically there is neither
quiescence nor disturbance, then you will be able to exist of yourself.
I much prefer Dogen's '"To study the way is to study the self; to
study the self is to forget the self; to forget the self is to be
/enlightened by the 10000/ things.".
To study the self is exactly what Vipassana does. If you remember in a
recent post I said that to understand suffering is to realise that it
is not suffering that disappears, but the self that disappears.
>The one who is not drawn into quiescence and disturbance is the man of
spirit." Further: "If one is capable of not seizing on
interpretations, not
creating the mind of delusion, and not esteeming profound knowledge,
then he will be a peaceful person. If there is one dharma to be esteemed
or valued, this dharma will be the one most capable of binding and killing
you, and you will fall into having mind. This is an unreliable state of
affairs.
I was listening to a video talk by the late Ayya Khema and she said
that after teaching hundreds of people the jhanas, she doesn't know of
one person who has become addicted to jhana meditation, or values them
higher than insight wisdom.
- Bodhidharma Antholgy, pg 35.
Buddha rocks!
Mike
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Kristopher Grey <[email protected]>
*To:* [email protected]
*Sent:* Thursday, 2 August 2012, 20:49
*Subject:* Re: [Zen] Samadhi
I'm not one to quote often, but came across this bit on samadhi today:
Question: "What is a demon mind?" Answer: "Closing the eyes
[in the cross-legged sitting posture] and entering samadhi."
Question: "[What if] I gather the mind into dhyana so that it does not
move?"
Answer: "This is bondage samadhi. It is useless. This holds even for the
four dhyanas, each of which is merely one stage of quiescence from
which you will return to disturbance again. They are not to be valued.
These are created dharmas, dharmas that will be destroyed again, not
ultimate Dharma. If you can understand that intrinsically there is neither
quiescence nor disturbance, then you will be able to exist of yourself.
The one who is not drawn into quiescence and disturbance is the man of
spirit." Further: "If one is capable of not seizing on
interpretations, not
creating the mind of delusion, and not esteeming profound knowledge,
then he will be a peaceful person. If there is one dharma to be esteemed
or valued, this dharma will be the one most capable of binding and killing
you, and you will fall into having mind. This is an unreliable state of
affairs.
- Bodhidharma Antholgy, pg 35.
