Or the Blind Master from the 1970's Kung Fu series?
________________________________ From: Kristopher Grey <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Friday, 3 August 2012, 2:06 Subject: Re: [Zen] Samadhi There was no refutation, no saying what samadhi is or isn't, only a clear warning about mounting a defense of it's value. One you clearly missed in your rush to defend it. You may refute all you like, I was simply sharing something. Your conversation with a dead man, is interesting though... KG On 8/2/2012 5:31 PM, mike brown wrote: >Kris, > > > >Quoting Bodhidharma to refute the place of samadhi/dhyana (jhana) is a bit >like cross-examing Mitt Romney in the hope he'll say something constructive >about free health care. Anyway, ... > > >>Question: "What is a demon mind?" Answer: "Closing the eyes >[in the cross-legged sitting posture] and entering samadhi." >>Question: "[What if] I gather the mind into dhyana so that it does not >move?" >>Answer: "This is bondage samadhi. It is useless. > > >The sutras attributable to Buddha mention mindfulness about a dozen times. >Loving-kindness about a 100 times. Jhanas over a 1000 times. Staring at a wall >0 times. > > > >>This holds even for the four dhyanas, each of which is merely one stage of >>quiescence from >which you will return to disturbance again. > > >Yes, exactly like zazen. > > >>They are not to be valued. > > >Not in themselves, no. But as a support to insight wisdom they are almost >indispensable. > > >>These are created dharmas, > > >It's funny how the 4 jhanas follow the same method for everyone to enter them, >and when they are entered they follow the same pattern from first into second, >from second into third etc. This is true for everyone (the well-practiced >adept can move thru them quicker and enter them almost at will). Without the >hindrances, the mind moves to an ever still and pure state until the mind >disappears all together. > > > >>dharmas that will be destroyed again, > > > >Of course! And this is exactly the insight that wisdom comes from. All arises >and passes. We experience the kind of bliss in jhanas that cannot be >experienced in day to day life. We use mindfulness to penetrate the meaning of >craving experientially - not just intellectually. > > > >>not ultimate Dharma. > > >Ultimate Dharma just is. Bohdidharma, at least in this quote, seems to be >mistaking the raft for the shore. > > > >>If you can understand that intrinsically there is neither >quiescence nor disturbance, then you will be able to exist of yourself. > > >I much prefer Dogen's '"To study the way is to study the self; to study the >self is to forget the self; to forget the self is to be enlightened by the >10000 things.". >To study the self is exactly what Vipassana does. If you remember in a recent >post I said that to understand suffering is to realise that it is not >suffering that disappears, but the self that disappears. > > > >>The one who is not drawn into quiescence and disturbance is the man of >spirit." Further: "If one is capable of not seizing on interpretations, not >creating the mind of delusion, and not esteeming profound knowledge, >then he will be a peaceful person. If there is one dharma to be esteemed >or valued, this dharma will be the one most capable of binding and killing >you, and you will fall into having mind. This is an unreliable state of >affairs. > > > >I was listening to a video talk by the late Ayya Khema and she said that after >teaching hundreds of people the jhanas, she doesn't know of one person who has >become addicted to jhana meditation, or values them higher than insight wisdom. > > >- Bodhidharma Antholgy, pg 35. > > >Buddha rocks! > > >Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >________________________________ > From: Kristopher Grey <[email protected]> >To: [email protected] >Sent: Thursday, 2 August 2012, 20:49 >Subject: Re: [Zen] Samadhi > > > >I'm not one to quote often, but came across this bit on samadhi today: > >Question: "What is a demon mind?" Answer: "Closing the eyes >[in the cross-legged sitting posture] and entering samadhi." >Question: "[What if] I gather the mind into dhyana so that it does not >move?" >Answer: "This is bondage samadhi. It is useless. This holds even for the >four dhyanas, each of which is merely one stage of quiescence from >which you will return to disturbance again. They are not to be valued. >These are created dharmas, dharmas that will be destroyed again, not >ultimate Dharma. If you can understand that intrinsically there is neither >quiescence nor disturbance, then you will be able to exist of yourself. >The one who is not drawn into quiescence and disturbance is the man of >spirit." Further: "If one is capable of not seizing on interpretations, not >creating the mind of delusion, and not esteeming profound knowledge, >then he will be a peaceful person. If there is one dharma to be esteemed >or valued, this dharma will be the one most capable of binding and killing >you, and you will fall into having mind. This is an unreliable state of >affairs. > >- Bodhidharma Antholgy, pg 35. > > >
