i have sobbed in a group whilst meditating... it made me think "oh sweet jesus..what the "f' am i doing this bunch of wankers.. . meditation for me is about becoming lighter and brighter freer and at peace..huh?...
the wankers tried to pin me down... would not let me leave..i had to force my way out the door.. . no they were not christians they were "searching for the pearl of enlightenment..." for christ sake!. ..as if!. .merle Bill! You were working on a koan in shikantaza? Mike ________________________________ From: Bill! <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, 4 August 2012, 2:11 Subject: Re: [Zen] Samadhi Mike and JMJM, I can tell you when I first experienced Buddha Nature (kensho) while working on the koan Mu I broke down and cried. I was sitting in the zendo with many others and started sobbing uncontrollably. Several of the attendant immediately assisted me and took me to another room where I could gather myself; and then I was quickly ushered into dokusan. ...Bill! --- In [email protected], mike brown <uerusuboyo@...> wrote: > > JMJM, > > I could be wrong, but if your colleague broke down and cried after being > filled with the Holy Ghost, then I think at some point his sitting stopped > being shikantaza, if indeed it ever was. My understanding is that there would > be equanimity, awareness and just simple observation of what was happening > if it was shikantaza. I'm sure one of our more experienced members will > clarify the matter for us. > > Mike > > > > ________________________________ > From: 覺妙精明 （JMJM） <chan.jmjm@...> > To: [email protected] > Cc: Bill! <BillSmart@...> > Sent: Friday, 3 August 2012, 16:53 > Subject: Re: [Zen] Samadhi > > >  > Yes, That's exactly how one of our practitioner, John Ip, described his > experience. John is a devoted Christian for over 20 years. Last month, he > shared, instead of words words and words, after enhancing his physical state, > the Holy Ghost comes into him and he broke down and cried. He practices in > our Family Meditation program in our community library for about 5 months. > Now he sits longer and longer everyday. > > I told him, "Holy Spirit is called Dharmakaya in Buddhism. Same > energy, just different names. And that is just the beginning." > > Many of our practitioners witnesses an "explosion" from their heart > chakra. There were no fear. Our Teacher said, "when there is white > light from the Heart Chakra, then you have witness Buddha Nature." > My sister-in-law witnesses white light every time she sits. She > "knows" phenomena of previous generations of other practitioners and > helps them to "resolve" many karma. > > As to Mike's statement that he can recognize but can not express is > a perfect example that when we surpass our skandhas, or regular > senses, we reach a wider state of awareness, far beyond we can > describe by words, logic. It is direct, instant and right. > > Some discussions in this forum mixing up the description for the two > states, one is limited and the other is wider, and initiated some > discussion. Depending on the scope and sensitivity of our > awareness, the languages and dictionary are different. Only when we > abandon our dictionary; experience; then could we witness the state > of being of others. Discussion through words are very dangerous. > Thus Chan is without words and transmitted in addition to teaching. > > When someday, whatever people say, we say "ah, yes." without > analyzing, debating, defense, then we are truly in each moment and > live in sync with the wisdom and life force of the universe. > > Good Day and Thank you for reading this. > _/\_ > JM > > > > > > > > On 8/3/2012 3:24 AM, Bill! wrote: > >  > >Mike, > > > >I would describe it as something similar to being filled > with the Holy Spirit and giving yourself over COMPLETELY > to God's will. > > > >Bill! (not Joe or Bill) > > > >--- In [email protected], mike brown <uerusuboyo@> wrote: > >> > >> Joe, > >> > >> How would you describe shikantaza to someone from a > religion such as Christianity? > >> > >> Mike > >> > >> > >> > >> ________________________________ > >> From: Joe <desert_woodworker@> > >> To: [email protected] > >> Sent: Friday, 3 August 2012, 3:24 > >> Subject: Re: [Zen] Samadhi > >> > >> > >>  > >> Shikantaza is "just keeping empty". In the Zen sect. > >> > >> I'll say no more! > >> > >> --Joe > >> > >> > > >> >"ED" <seacrofter001@> wrote: > >> > > >> > Mike, > >> > > >> > Is shikantaza insight meditation, absorption > meditation or both? > >> > > > > >
