Mike, Strange, I don't see any evidence of that "spiritual path" on this forum! All I see is continual cat fights....
Edgar On Jun 25, 2013, at 5:00 AM, [email protected] wrote: > Bill!, > > I'd say the point here is that only Man takes these ultimate issues and have > created paths to follow out of them. Whether these paths are illusions or > delusions is beside the point (in regards to this ongoing thread). No other > animal has created a spiritual or religious path which transcends their basic > instincts. Man alone is unique in this regard. > > Mike > > > Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad > > From: Bill! <[email protected]>; > To: <[email protected]>; > Subject: Re: [Zen] rise above to where? > Sent: Tue, Jun 25, 2013 8:12:28 AM > > > Mike and Edgar, > > I do agree that the concepts of "God, the Absolute and Nirvana" are delusions > (I've decided to switch from 'illusions' to 'delusions', but the meaning is > the same as before). > > The question here is more "Do animals, other than humans, create delusions?" > > I say 'yes'. Any animal that has an intellect that creates dualism creates > delusions - IMO. Animals and other sentient beings that don't have an > intellect that creates dualism - like perhaps bacteria and plants - and only > act on stimulus/response probably don't have delusions. > > This is of course just speculation on my part. I have no way to validate > these statements. > > ...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...> wrote: > > > > Mike, > > > > As I'm sure even Bill would agree "God, the Absolute and Nirvana" are all > > mental illusions. I don't see that humans discussing them does any good or > > has any meaning at all or is any sense of pride.... > > > > Animals don't discuss reality, they live it! > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:26 AM, uerusuboyo@... wrote: > > > > > Edgar, > > > > > > I'm glad you said that not understanding the natural world is not zen. > > > That's your goose cooked then. Humans are unique in the animal kingdom in > > > being spiritual beings. Go on Dr Doolittle, tell us how you communicate > > > with the animals and discuss God, the Absolute and Nirvana. > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad > > > > > > From: Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...>; > > > To: <[email protected]>; > > > Subject: Re: [Zen] rise above to where? > > > Sent: Mon, Jun 24, 2013 12:09:37 PM > > > > > > > > > Bill and Mike, > > > > > > > > > You guys are parroting generations old biology. Not understanding the > > > natural world is not Zen... > > > > > > Statements such as yours demonstrates the lack of intelligence and > > > empathy of humans, not animals... > > > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 24, 2013, at 6:52 AM, Bill! wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> Mike, > > >> > > >> I agree with you that I know of no other animal, or any other sentient > > >> being, that has that ability. But as I've said I'm not sure whether that > > >> is a blessing or a curse. It's a bit of both I guess. > > >> > > >> ...Bill! > > >> > > >> --- In [email protected], uerusuboyo@ wrote: > > >> > > > >> > Merle,<br/><br/>That might be your point, but it's not mine. The tiger > > >> > is doing nothing wrong by following its instincts and eating you: it's > > >> > nothing personal - you're just lunch. I get that. But the tiger has no > > >> > choice - it's blindly following its instinct to survive. It has no > > >> > idea of the suffering it inflicts on you. Humans on the other hand can > > >> > act against self-interest, even if it harms themselves, because of > > >> > they have an awareness of the other's suffering. Just because there > > >> > are more instances of the opposite occurring doesn't negate that we > > >> > *do* have that ability to a much higher degree than any other animal. > > >> > Like I said, it's not because we've been divinely chosen, but because > > >> > of the quirks of evolution affecting human development. We are a > > >> > spiritual animal. We know of no other animal that is > > >> > so.<br/><br/>Mike<br/><br/><br/>Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
