Hi Ian, --- Ian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi Alex, Francisco, and all > > When I posted that, I wanted to show that while, as > Alex says, no > determinations can ever do it justice, the Buddha > still used a simile - > "like a vast and mighty ocean" "profound, > immeasurable, of a nature > difficult to penetrate" > > I think this simile of the ocean can help allay > concerns about Nirvana as > some kind of "absolute nullity" nada, zippo, state > of nonexistence.
I think that realizing that nirvana is indeterminate is the best way to allay concerns that is is "absolute nullity", as you say, or state of nonexistence. This is because "absolute nullity" or state of nonexistence are determinations that are easily understandable and graspable by everyone. Being indeterminate, nirvana is not qualifiable by absolute nothingness, nihilism, or any such determinants. Thus, it is free from even a trace of nihilism or nullity. As such, it is not graspable by anyone, and hence it is a hallmark of freedom. > Nirvana is not actually "indeterminate" in the sense > of "undefinable". It > is precisely defined by the Buddha as "the > extinction of desire, the > extinction of hatred, the extinction of illusion." > It's just that this > very precise definition does not give any > descriptive qualities to it. Earlier you have quoted the Heart Sutra in its entirety. I presume that, by doing that, you have tacitly announced that you have read that same sutra. In it, as you will recall, it is explained that desire, hatred and illusion are empty, unreal. Something unreal, that is, unborn, can never become extinct. Thus, the Buddha's explicit definition using these concepts was provisionary, makeshift, and therefore nothing to cling on to. You'd be much better off relinquishing your tendencies to grasp after imagined substantiality of nirvana, and finding final repose in the fact that it is indeterminate. Alex No karma was produced during the composition of this letter __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Would you Help a Child in need? It is easier than you think. Click Here to meet a Child you can help. http://us.click.yahoo.com/0Z9NuA/I_qJAA/i1hLAA/S27xlB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Noble Eightfold Path: Right View, Right Intention, Right Speech, Right Action, Right Effort, Right Mindfulness, Right Concentration, Right Livelihood Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZenForum/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
