I'm very thankful for your explanation. Saludos. Guillermo. --- In [email protected], "ryhorikawa" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], "pipaclub_sanluis" < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Of cours, you are right about the korean monks. But what you say > > about zen, means that it began in China, right? Any how, Zen has taken > > their different ways acording to the country that adopted it, and that > > enriches it. Saludos. > > Guillermo. > > > Hi Guillermo, > > I totally agree with you that the Dharma is like water and takes the shape of > the cultural container in which it is "poured". :-) > > I also did mean to say that Zen began in China (although Zen tradition would > maintain that Mahakashyapa received a "special tradition outside of tradition" > from the Buddha Shakyamuni in India and that Bodhidharma, the revered > "transmitter" of Ch'an or Zen Buddhism to China was the 28th Zen patriarch in > an Indian lineage that stretches back to Mahakashyapa). What I meant to say > was that the establishment of the two schools of Japanese Zen by Eisai and > Dogen occured in the 12th century (over 500+ years after the alleged > beginnings of Ch'an in China). > > In Japan there is this saying" The seed of Zen was planted in India, it sprouted > in China and flowered in Japan." .... I personally would say that it first flowered > in China... and then later in Japan and Korea. :-) > > One quick final note: It is common to maintain that Zen represents the > confluence of two rivers: Indian meditational practices and Taoist philosophy. > While I certainly don't disagree with this, I think it is a broad paint brush stoke > and perhaps a bit simplistic :-). For example, Ch'an or Zen certainly employs > Taoist terminology but by the time Hui-neng (638-713) and his successors > began laying down the "doctrinal" teachings of Ch'an, these "Taoist" terms > had been reconceptualized and reframed. "Wu" ("nothingness" or "emptiness" > as used in Ch'an writings is not identical to "Wu" in the "Tao Te Ching" - to cite > one example. The early Ch'an writers were not the ones who laid this > groundwork. Chi-tsang (549-623) and his Sanlun school had already > reworked and reframed "Taoist" terms decades before Hui-neng. In addition, > many of the metaphors that are now associated with Zen - e.g., the "finger > pointing to the moon" - first appeared in the writings of Sanlun. I think it is > more "accurate" to say that Zen represents the confluence of two rivers: Indian > meditational practices and the reconceptualized Taoist terminology (now > clearly Mahayana Buddhist in orientation) of Chinese Sanlun Buddhism. > > Gassho, > ryhorikawa >
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