Since this thread is fraying all over the place, here's a summary post of how I
see the history of Cuba.

1.    The US interfered with Cuba and controlled it since it received nominal
independence from Spain. These interests included industrial (sugar and other
agriculture) interests and organized crime. They were backed up by US military
2.    Cuba tried on a number of occasions to elect truly democratic governments.
These governments were destabilized and fell, thanks to the intervention of the
above-mentioned interests.
3.    Castro (and others) felt that the only way to break this chain was to sever
the link with the U.S. He led a successful revolution and severed ties with the
U.S. He offered compensation for nationalized assets, but the U.S. passed a law
making it illegal for U.S. residents to accept compensation.
4.     Castro's ideology at least after taking power was communism.
5.    Castro may or may not have been a communist since before the revolution,
however, a) it's irrelevant because his true "ideology" was simply anti-US -- he
had seen what he felt to be the rape of his country and wanted to stop it, and
would use whatever means necessary to achieve that aim; b) when witnesses are
trotted forth from JBS literature saying that Castro had always been a communist,
we're supposed to believe them, but when it's shown that these witnesses are
misrepresented, all of a sudden they become "Gadianton Robbers" and aren't to be
trusted -- that is not an objective approach; c) concentrating on the ideology,
and demonizing Castro because of it allows the far right to ignore or divert
issues of how Castro was able to seize power in the first place (by dint of US
interference and proto-imperialism).
6.    That things aren't even worse in Central America and the Caribbean are
thanks to an elder of Zion, J. Reuben Clark, Jr., whose "Clark Memorandum"
diverted early 20th century attempts by the U.S. to become true imperialists like
their British and French predecessors.
7.    I have no idea what Victor is talking about. Where does one get a card that
says one is a liberal democrat? (except in Britain, where there's a Liberal
Democratic party). Also, it's "straitlaced," not "straightlaced." The words have
different meanings. If he means all Democrats are liberal, then I suggest he
discuss his problem with President Faust, a registered Democrat.
8.    An ideological approach is one where one demonizes an opponent by using a
label in such a way as to divert one's attention from what actually happened in
history. One of its particularly obnoxious tools, and the reason I left Zion-L
once, is when they try to claim ecclesiastical/doctrinal authority for their
perverted and hobby horse views.
9.    Pointing out your own history to you doesn't make one "anti-USAmerican". If
you disagree with my reading of history, then prove me wrong, don't attack the
messenger. That's the classic mistake of an ad hominem argument.

I think that covers it all. I'll proceed with any discussion of the topic based
on these points, because I've already addressed them. If others are merely going
to rehash earlier arguments, I'm going to ignore them -- they've already been
addressed. So address the response, don't just repeat yourself.

Marc A. Schindler
Spruce Grove, Alberta, Canada -- Gateway to the Boreal Parkland

“We do not think that there is an incompatibility between words and deeds; the
worst thing is to rush into action before the consequences have been properly
debated…To think of the future and wait was merely another way of saying one was
a coward; any idea of moderation was just an attempt to disguise one’s unmanly
character; ability to understand a question from all sides meant that one was
totally unfitted for action.” – Pericles about his fellow-Athenians, as quoted by
Thucydides in “The Peloponessian Wars”

Note: This communication represents the informal personal views of the author
solely; its contents do not necessarily reflect those of the author’s employer,
nor those of any organization with which the author may be associated.

///  ZION LIST CHARTER: Please read it at  ///
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