Jim, I really don't have time for a long debate on the historical psychology of scientists...
To give some random examples though: Newton, Leibniz and Gauss were certainly obnoxious, egomaniacal pains in the ass though ... Edward Teller ... Goethe, whose stubbornness was largely on-the-mark with his ideas about morphology, but totally off-the-mark with his theory of color ... Babbage, who likely would have succeeded at building his difference engine were his personality less thorny ... etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. ... I'm certainly not suggesting we AGi researchers should try to be bigger jerks or less open to constructive criticism .. goodness knows there is already enough egocentricity on this list ;-) ... I'm just pointing out that judging ideas by the personality or openness-to-criticism of their creators is a very dubious heuristic... ben On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 1:17 PM, Jim Bromer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well, how about privately sending me a few of those names. I know > that Wittgenstein was pretty obnoxious after WW1, but I don't think > that he made much substantial progress during that time. I think his > most important work was written during the war, in the trenches I > think. (I may be mistaken.) > Jim Bromer > > On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 12:57 PM, Ben Goertzel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > I agree it is far nicer when advocates of theories are willing to > gracefully > > entertain constructive criticisms of their theories. > > > > However, historically, I'm not sure it's true that this sort of grace on > the > > part of a theorist is well-correlated with the ultimate success of that > > theorist's theories. > > > > I can think of loads of gracious theorists with poor ideas, and loads of > > obnoxious, overly-harsh, self-centered theorists whose ideas have > ultimately > > proved excellent ;-p > > > > -- ben g > > > > On Mon, Oct 13, 2008 at 12:53 PM, Jim Bromer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> > >> We all know that no body of theories has yet solved the major AI > >> problems that confront us at this time. > >> > >> I feel that the discussions about methodologies that may be > >> theoretically sound or reasonable but not proven to be completely > >> effective in application should include discussion about the potential > >> problems that might be associated with them. > >> > >> If there have been some results gathered through testing, then we > >> would all benefit with a discussion of some of the cases where the > >> principles did not work properly. On the other hand, if there have > >> not been enough experimental results from application problems to make > >> insightful criticisms, then the proprietors and enthusiasts should > >> have the intellectual integrity to express some of the reservations > >> they may have had about their theories. This seems like a sensible > >> working principle. > >> > >> That is not to say that an advocate has to accept all possible > >> criticisms as being equal in value. But when an advocate is not able > >> to present or acknowledge any reasonable criticism about his still > >> unsubstantiated theories, it looks like a negative indicator about the > >> generality and efficacy of those theories. > >> > >> I know that we all have to deal with criticisms. But using a critical > >> examination of the theories or criticisms that you are advocating is a > >> step higher than just defending your theories from any criticism. > >> > >> Jim Bromer > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------------------- > >> agi > >> Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > >> RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ > >> Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > >> Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > > > > > > > > -- > > Ben Goertzel, PhD > > CEO, Novamente LLC and Biomind LLC > > Director of Research, SIAI > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > "Nothing will ever be attempted if all possible objections must be first > > overcome " - Dr Samuel Johnson > > > > > > ________________________________ > > agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription > > > ------------------------------------------- > agi > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ > Modify Your Subscription: > https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > -- Ben Goertzel, PhD CEO, Novamente LLC and Biomind LLC Director of Research, SIAI [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Nothing will ever be attempted if all possible objections must be first overcome " - Dr Samuel Johnson ------------------------------------------- agi Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=117534816-b15a34 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
