> I think Eliza will be pronounced in English, regardless of the > singer's hipness Given the context that "Eliza" should be valued over "Maria"..., it probably be.. :D
>"Ave Maria" must rhyme with "emulari", meaning that you must drop the > final "a" of Maria. Yes, I had to drop it...! I misread it, being distracted by the intention of the line .. (sing out "Eliza" instead of catholic "Maria".. ) Thank you for thorough explanation! > At the queen's coronation the acclamation sung by the boys of Westminster > School as she arrived at the Abbey was "Vivat regina Elizabetha" pronounced > vyvat regyna as I recall. Thank you! so it was. I found the recording of the coronation: https://youtu.be/aGLN1kREJ2Q?t=3m8s > book that was published a few years ago by Indiana University Press entitled > 'Singing Early Music'. Thank you all again for very informative answers! Tomoko -----Original Message----- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk Sent: Monday, April 24, 2017 10:31 PM To: lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com Cc: LutList <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vivat Eliza I should have asked 'received pronunciation' (?) of Laten in Anglican church of today.. There is no received pronunciation of Latin in the Anglican Church of today. Latin is not the language normally used in the Anglican church today. Nor was it in the Elizabethan era. If it is used it is entirely a matter for whoever is conducting the service to decide how it is pronounced. At the queen's coronation the acclamation sung by the boys of Westminster School as she arrived at the Abbey was "Vivat regina Elizabetha" pronounced vyvat regyna as I recall. Monica (paid up Anglican) I am not sure about "Eliza" in latin. "Vivat" is to be pronounced like vee-vat as far as I know... ( other Latin phrases appear in the song didn't sound that English-like in the Rooley's recording.) Tomoko 2017/04/24 0:48 "David van Ooijen" <[1]davidvanooi...@gmail.com>: HIP 2.0 (?!) Wa chotto hen desu, yo! ******************************* David van Ooijen [1][2]davidvanooi...@gmail.com [2][3]www.davidvanooijen.nl ******************************* On 23 April 2017 at 17:44, Jerzy Zak <[3][4]jurek...@gmail.com> wrote: Dear Tomoko, Try GoogleTranslate. Put your fraze in the space on the left, choose a language you think it is in, and press the little speaker underneath. Then keep changing languages until you think it rhymes best with âAve MarÃa'. Stupid but works ;) Jerzy â > On 23 Apr 2017, at 17:02, lutenist.mumin.koide gmail <[4][5]lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Dear lute-list, > > Could anyone help me clarify pronunciation of "Vivat Eliza" in Dowland's composition > to Sir. Henry Lee's poem "Time's Eldest Son"? > > I thought it could be " viÃvà ¦t ("Vivat" read in ecclesiastical Latin?) and " ÃiÃzÃ" (with this pronunciation it rhymes with "Ave Maria" ) though many sang it " vaà ªvà ¦t Ãlà ¬Ã ªzà " for which I couldn't find any reason... > > Tomoko > > > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > [5][6]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:[7]davidvanooi...@gmail.com 2. [8]http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/ 3. mailto:[9]jurek...@gmail.com 4. mailto:[10]lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com 5. [11]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 2017/04/24 0:48 "David van Ooijen" <[12]davidvanooi...@gmail.com>: HIP 2.0 (?!) Wa chotto hen desu, yo! ******************************* David van Ooijen [1][13]davidvanooi...@gmail.com [2][14]www.davidvanooijen.nl ******************************* On 23 April 2017 at 17:44, Jerzy Zak <[3][15]jurek...@gmail.com> wrote: Dear Tomoko, Try GoogleTranslate. Put your fraze in the space on the left, choose a language you think it is in, and press the little speaker underneath. Then keep changing languages until you think it rhymes best with âAve MarÃa'. Stupid but works ;) Jerzy â > On 23 Apr 2017, at 17:02, lutenist.mumin.koide gmail <[4][16]lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Dear lute-list, > > Could anyone help me clarify pronunciation of "Vivat Eliza" in Dowland's composition > to Sir. Henry Lee's poem "Time's Eldest Son"? > > I thought it could be " viÃvà ¦t ("Vivat" read in ecclesiastical Latin?) and " ÃiÃzÃ" (with this pronunciation it rhymes with "Ave Maria" ) though many sang it " vaà ªvà ¦t Ãlà ¬Ã ªzà " for which I couldn't find any reason... > > Tomoko > > > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > [5][17]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:[18]davidvanooi...@gmail.com 2. [19]http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/ 3. mailto:[20]jurek...@gmail.com 4. mailto:[21]lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com 5. [22]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com 2. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com 3. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/ 4. mailto:jurek...@gmail.com 5. mailto:lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com 6. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 7. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com 8. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/ 9. mailto:jurek...@gmail.com 10. mailto:lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com 11. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 12. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com 13. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com 14. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/ 15. mailto:jurek...@gmail.com 16. mailto:lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com 17. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 18. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com 19. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/ 20. mailto:jurek...@gmail.com 21. mailto:lutenist.mumin.ko...@gmail.com 22. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
