******************** POSTING RULES & NOTES ******************** #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. *****************************************************************
*Also, it's apparently published by the mouthpiece of a New York-based thinktank run by the family of one of Russia's oligarchs, namely Mikhail Khodorkovsky's son Pavel. - Amith On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 5:29 PM, A.R. G <amithrgu...@gmail.com> wrote: > This article struck me as a mix of meaningful criticisms and pure smear > tactics. This paragraph in particular is telling: > > >Living in a special, completely parallel universe are leftists from the > United States, who prefer to fight the evil empire directly from within. > In their view, the war in the Donbass started at the instigation of the > United States and, obviously, because of oil. After all, every global > conflict is waged by the United States and always because of oil. And yes, > the “Odessa carnage” was also planned by the United States, in case you had > any doubts on that score. > > The United States and its leftists are not in a "parellel universe". What > happens in Europe -- and the way Americans react to it -- is every bit a > part of American political culture as it is in Europe. That is the nature > of America as an imperial power, let alone one which inherited much of > Europe's history. There is no reason to suggest, in my view, that American > leftists who romanticize or downplay Russian abuses are any different from, > say, French leftists who do the same. > > Moreover, there is no attempt to actually address the Odessa Fire, the > article just writes off anyone who thought it was horrific as some kind of > Stalinist puppet. > > The "left-right collaboration" rhetoric also doesn't strike me as very > convincing. That can be said for just about every dissident cause, from > opposing the Iraq invasion to condemning finance capitalism. > > Also wasn't a fan of this line: > > Leftists mistrust mainstream outlets because the latter, according to > their worldview, are controlled by oligarchs or their puppets. > Far-rightists do so because, in their version of reality, the media are > controlled by Zionist, cultural-Marxist, and homosexual lobbies. > > This is a false dichotomy, especially due to the author's uncritical use > of the term "Zionist". There are plenty of "leftists" who correctly condemn > the extent to which Zionism control/influence media, there is no reason > that that should be seen as dichotomous from believing that "oligarchs or > their puppets" control the media. Writing off Zionist control of the media > as a right-wing conspiracy theory on par with "the homosexual agenda" is > subtle apologism for Zionism. > > Much of the article is simply beyond analysis because it is just > unsubstantiated attack after the next. "Anarchists," "American leftists," > "Maoists," xyz group of people one after the next are accused of some > political crime or the other without any real attempt to cite instances, > groups, etc. The article attempts to paint the left in the US or in Europe > (ignoring the rest of the world) as though there is any sort of consistency > among "leftists". Pretty sure there isn't any. > > - Amith > > On Sun, May 31, 2015 at 11:32 PM, Louis Proyect via Marxism < > marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote: > >> ******************** POSTING RULES & NOTES ******************** >> #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. >> #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. >> #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. >> ***************************************************************** >> >> The annexation of Crimea, the “Novorossiya” project, and the fight >> against the “Kyiv junta” are not supported in Russia alone. There are >> political forces around the world, both marginal and relatively >> respectable, which voice their support for the separatists in the Donbass. >> At times, activists themselves travel to the war zone as volunteers, but >> they mostly hold demonstrations in support of the separatist republics and >> pressure their governments to renounce their support for Ukraine and “stop >> the aggression against Russia.” >> >> These political forces may identify as left-wing, right-wing, or deny any >> conventional political identity (although their “political neutrality” >> usually conceals one ideology or another). Novorossiya’s foreign friends >> who, in 99% of cases, are also friends of Russia and worshippers of Putin, >> may explain their views from various, sometimes incompatible positions. >> Novorossiya can be supported both by a white racist and a communist who >> talks about the fight against “Ukrainian fascism” and “Western >> imperialism.” But despite the apparent differences in their theoretical >> ideological grounding, their political practice is remarkably similar. >> Eventually, they arrive at the same conclusions and stand on the same side >> of the barricade. >> >> Not that long ago, an “antifascist forum” took place in the Donbass, >> which was attended by representatives of not major, but still quite notable >> Stalinist organizations from Europe and the United States. Around the same >> time, a forum of ultra-right, nationalist, and conservative activists took >> place in the Donbass. The fact that these events coincided is more than >> revealing. We will talk about both left-wing and right-wing supporters of >> Novorossiya and attempt to find similarities in their modes of thinking. >> The first text mostly focuses on leftists, but there are certain elements >> which are also relevant to the right-wing camp. >> >> full: http://www.interpretermag.com/novorossiyas-leftist-friends/ >> _________________________________________________________ >> Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm >> Set your options at: >> http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/amithrgupta%40gmail.com > > > _________________________________________________________ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
