Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
On Wed, Feb 06, 2008 at 11:37:41PM +0100, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote: On Feb 6, 2008 10:45 PM, Marco van de Voort [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There already is FPC on mobile devices. For the rest, the FAQ mostly applies: http://www.hu.freepascal.org/faq.var#dotnet I think this is a little bit too intransigent. Many mobiles run only Java, so there is no other path to support them. Nobody says there _should_ be a path then. My experience with Symbian makes me think I should have instead started a Java port. The Symbian is such a mess that a Java port would maybe be easier to do and achieve support for a hugely superior number of devices. There is even a Java assembler out there. I'm not 100% convinced that it can't be abstracted just like if it was just another platform. The question is not if you can't shoehorn FPC into something it wasn't designed for, but if the result is more than an academic exercise. IOW, is a FPC that has parts of the language removed, where datatypes change meaning, possible extensions that don't work on native etc still a FPC as we know today ? The Delphi.NET experiment of Borland shows this perfectly. Superficially everything is ok, but practically you see each after the other halt the shared codebases and do a proper new framework based on .NET classes and types. In Borlands case, the shared source between classic and .NET was mostly temporary, for transition purposes, but how do you see this for FPC? _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
On Wed, 6 Feb 2008, Marco Alvarado wrote: 2008/2/6, Wanderlan Santos dos Anjos [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Options for a Pascal compiler which targets Java: 1. http://www.mhccorp.com/pasjvm.shtml 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIDletPascal. Dead product? Download: http://www.softlookup.com/display.asp?id=157709 I know MIDletPascal, and it's a perfect example. It suffers the same problem that Delphi has now, it's not Open Source. You have to wait for it's development team to fix bugs, and the most important is that if the team takes a different path (or vanishes), you will have to jump to another compiler to keep on track, maybe a compiler for another language as it is the case with Pascal. I'd rather give my engine support for an unperfect compiler that anyone can continue developing (reminds me of Lazarus), than a compiler that can die unexpectedly. Well, what stops you from getting started ? Many people have asked the questions you asked, none have actually contributed. The FPC team has no direct interest in this, but that doesn't mean we will not offer help in the form of explanations to whoever wants to try anyway... Michael. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
[lazarus] Who is the controlling 'native' widget set in LCL?
Hi, I'm not trying to start a flame war, I would simply like to understand the thinking and decision process of the core lazarus developers regarding the LCL features. I'm sure any developer using LCL would like the following answers as well. For more background on this issue see the mantis bug report: http://bugs.freepascal.org/view.php?id=9285 In summary. TButton.Color is not available in LCL because Win32 doesn't allow a button face to change color without custom drawing. Yet other widget sets do like Qt and GTK1. Comments from Paul: Kylix = qt = library that draw widgets itself Win32 = library that also has some mids about widget drawing Why LCL should invent hacks to force win32 draw color buttons? If win32 does not want to do that why LCL should have ability to override designed by ms devels way of button drawing? LCL is library of native widgets = library that uses abilities of underlying libraries. If they (win32 or other) doesnot support something then LCL should not invent own ways. My opinion - this issue should be closed. Comments from Me: -- Ok, so LCL uses native widgets - I get that. Well, Qt is a supported widget set of LCL. So Qt should in all respects be consider 'native'. So now, because Win32 doesn't allow Button.Color, Qt may not use Button.Color either! That's a bit unfair. The LCL now limits developers only to what Win32 can do! What happened to LCL being cross-platform? What about the features of other underlying native widget sets? Is Win32 the controlling widget set for LCL. If Win32 doesn't support something, neither may the other widget sets? So, my question again: Is Win32 the controlling widget set in LCL? Is Win32 the deciding widget set for what is allowed in the LCL? If Win32 doesn't support it, it's not going to be supported in the LCL - even if the other native widget sets support a function? How do the core developers decide what is allowed in the LCL and what isn't? What criteria do they use? As a extra argument to Paul: MS developers decided not support MouseEnter and MouseLeave OS level events in Win32. Other widget sets do. Borland even had to hack their own support for it in the VCL. Then in Windows XP and Vista the Microsoft developers show that a 'hot' state over buttons are cool, yet the underlying Win32 still doesn't support MouseEnter and MouseLeave OS events! I wouldn't stake my life on what MS developers decided is good! They sometimes come up with pretty shitty ideas of what they think is right! Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Who is the controlling 'native' widget set in LCL?
Graeme Geldenhuys schrieb: So, my question again: Is Win32 the controlling widget set in LCL? Is Win32 the deciding widget set for what is allowed in the LCL? If Win32 doesn't support it, it's not going to be supported in the LCL - even if the other native widget sets support a function? I guess in case of doubts, the VCL is the reference. If one wants to explore all features of a certain widget set, he has simply to use a direct interface to the widget set. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Who is the controlling 'native' widget set in LCL?
Graeme Geldenhuys wrote: Hi, I'm not trying to start a flame war, I would simply like to understand the thinking and decision process of the core lazarus developers regarding the LCL features. I'm sure any developer using LCL would like the following answers as well. For more background on this issue see the mantis bug report: http://bugs.freepascal.org/view.php?id=9285 In summary. TButton.Color is not available in LCL because Win32 doesn't allow a button face to change color without custom drawing. Yet other widget sets do like Qt and GTK1. That problem has been havily discussed in lazarus-dev list and we came to the conclusion that such properties should be in LCL, but on the other hand they must be marked some way in object inspector as non cross platform. Best regards, Paul Ishenin. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
[lazarus] Open URL in a browser
Hi all, I'm trying to create an hyperlink component but I'm having some difficult to catch default browser under Linux. In Windows it has to be easier but I would like to find an elegant cross-platform way. I saw the Lazarus Ide has Help - OnLine help menu which I can get a look. Any suggest to better understand the code ? I saw there are THelpViewer class and THelpDatabase and their containers but I cannot be able to understand deeply how this code is working. Thanks Antonio -- Antonio Sanguigni alias slapshot -- GioveLUG (Linux User Group) - http://www.giovelug.org Edupup (Educational distro) - http://www.edupup.org
Re: [lazarus] Behavior of ClientToScreen in scrolling windows across different widget sets
Luiz Americo Pereira Camara wrote: While debugging scrolling bugs in LCL i found that ClientToScreen acts differently according to the widget set. These are the behaviors: 1) The returned value is related to the actual position, i.e., it does not consider the scroll offset. If you pass Point(0,0) the value will be the same regardless of the scroll position. (Gtk1) 2) The returned value is related to the virtual position, i.e, it takes into account the scroll offset. If you pass Point(0, 0) the value changes inversely to scrollbar position. (Gtk2) 3) The returned value is related to the virtual position, i.e, it takes into account the scroll offset. If you pass Point(0, 0) the value changes the same amount of scrollbar position. (Win32) 4) Nothing. Qt has no visible scrollbars so... Notes: Delphi does the same as (1)/Gtk1 Not really, internally Delphi does it like 2. All controls are moved. (3) is clearly buggy. Between (1) and (2) is a design decision. We started like delphi, move controls and report corrected values when asked. However this aproach is very inefficient on all widgetsets except win32. So the new approach is that controls stay at their position and only the virtual parent gets an offset. This means that the top/left of a control on a say scrollbox are allways the same, an offset to the virtual parent top/left. So now ClientToScreen. The top/left of a scrolled control needs to get a scrolled offset, so that is reflects the real position relative to the real parent of the control. Marc Attached is a patch that makes win32 acts like (2)/gtk2. It changes the offset signal when calculating the LCL bounds. With the change it becomes consistent with the TCustomGroupBox signal convention (LCL bounds at Right/Down of win32 +, at Left/Up -). It also fixes the scrolling paint and setcursor of non TWincontrol. Luiz _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
Hi, On Debian bases system (I don't know on others) there is an alternative that known as x-www-browser that holds the default web browser. On Feb 7, 2008 12:18 PM, Antonio Sanguigni [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, I'm trying to create an hyperlink component but I'm having some difficult to catch default browser under Linux. In Windows it has to be easier but I would like to find an elegant cross-platform way. I saw the Lazarus Ide has Help - OnLine help menu which I can get a look. Any suggest to better understand the code ? I saw there are THelpViewer class and THelpDatabase and their containers but I cannot be able to understand deeply how this code is working. Thanks Antonio -- Antonio Sanguigni alias slapshot -- GioveLUG (Linux User Group) - http://www.giovelug.org Edupup (Educational distro) - http://www.edupup.org Ido -- http://ik.homelinux.org/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Who is the controlling 'native' widget set in LCL?
On 07/02/2008, Paul Ishenin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In summary. TButton.Color is not available in LCL because Win32 doesn't allow a button face to change color without custom drawing. Yet other widget sets do like Qt and GTK1. That problem has been havily discussed in lazarus-dev list and we came to the conclusion that such properties should be in LCL, but on the other hand they must be marked some way in object inspector as non cross platform. My apologies. I didn't know of a 'lazarus-dev' mailing list. When was this decided, in the last 7 days? Because from your comment in he mantis bug report dated 2008-02-01 (7 days ago), your clearly stated that it _shouldn't_ be supported. Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
See also environnement variable $BROWSER under linux -- Laurent. My Components: http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Wile64 French Forum : http://lazforum-fr.tuxfamily.org/index.php
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
On 07/02/2008, wile64 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See also environnement variable $BROWSER under linux there is also the sensible-browser script that makes things easy (at least on debian). henry _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
On 07/02/2008, wile64 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See also environnement variable $BROWSER under linux Wow, I never knew about that. It's available in Ubuntu 7.10 as well. Is that a LSB standard? I see the /etc/alternatives directory is full of such files... :-) Nice one, it's about time Linux helped developers detect favoured applications. Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
On 07/02/2008, ik [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, On Debian bases system (I don't know on others) there is an alternative that known as x-www-browser that holds the default web browser. Wow, I never knew about that. It's available in Ubuntu 7.10 as well. Is that a LSB standard? I see the /etc/alternatives directory is full of such files... :-) Nice one, it's about time Linux helped developers detect favoured applications. Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
Oops, I meant the reply to Ido's email On 07/02/2008, Graeme Geldenhuys [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 07/02/2008, wile64 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See also environnement variable $BROWSER under linux Wow, I never knew about that. It's available in Ubuntu 7.10 as well. Is that a LSB standard? I see the /etc/alternatives directory is full of such files... :-) Nice one, it's about time Linux helped developers detect favoured applications. Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ -- Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
Antonio Sanguigni schreef: Hi all, I'm trying to create an hyperlink component but I'm having some difficult to catch default browser under Linux. In Windows it has to be easier but I would like to find an elegant cross-platform way. I saw the Lazarus Ide has Help - OnLine help menu which I can get a look. Any suggest to better understand the code ? I saw there are THelpViewer class and THelpDatabase and their containers but I cannot be able to understand deeply how this code is working. See also lazarus\examples\openbrowser Vincent _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
I've been investigating, and came to the conclussion that the best compiler I can do IS NOT a compiler, BUT an specialiced translator. I could use customizable templates to transform Pascal code into each VM's natural language, then take advantage of the command-line compilers for those VMs. There are open-source compilers that will fit perfectly on this project. At least MTASC, is a much faster and optimal compiler than the actual Macromedia/Adobe Flash compiler. Crappy and cheaty, maybe, but will output the best optimal code possible, and also will save myself from the HUGE task of creating real compilers, since I must keep focused on my game engine. If we remove pointers, goto's (...what else?), there is almost a one-on-one correspondence between Object Pascal and ECMA's scripts (javascript and actionscript), Java and .NET. But will require some cheating with the class frameworks (thinking on FPC's RTL and the LCL), like converting TBitmap into MovieClip, as an example. As said it's a language mutilation, but it's something a programmer can live with if he/she wants to target those virtual platforms, Delphi .NET shows that as you mentioned. -Marco _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
2008/2/7 wile64 [EMAIL PROTECTED]: See also environnement variable $BROWSER under linux On my machine it is not set (Kubuntu 7.10 amd64)... -- Laurent. My Components: http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Wile64 French Forum : http://lazforum-fr.tuxfamily.org/index.php Ido -- http://ik.homelinux.org/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
2008/2/7, Graeme Geldenhuys [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On 07/02/2008, wile64 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See also environnement variable $BROWSER under linux Wow, I never knew about that. It's available in Ubuntu 7.10 as well. Is that a LSB standard? This is Debian, I have on my Ubuntu 7.10 and others are also I see the /etc/alternatives directory is full of such files... :-) Nice one, it's about time Linux helped developers detect favoured applications. I Found it but I do not know where :) Regards, - Graeme - ___ fpGUI - a cross-platform Free Pascal GUI toolkit http://opensoft.homeip.net/fpgui/ _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives -- Laurent. My Components: http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Wile64 French Forum : http://lazforum-fr.tuxfamily.org/index.php
RE: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
Orpheus has a TOvcURL component for hyperlinks. http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/OrphPort Thanks. -Phil From: Antonio Sanguigni [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 5:19 AM To: lazarus@miraclec.com Subject: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser Hi all, I'm trying to create an hyperlink component but I'm having some difficult to catch default browser under Linux. In Windows it has to be easier but I would like to find an elegant cross-platform way. I saw the Lazarus Ide has Help - OnLine help menu which I can get a look. Any suggest to better understand the code ? I saw there are THelpViewer class and THelpDatabase and their containers but I cannot be able to understand deeply how this code is working. Thanks Antonio -- Antonio Sanguigni alias slapshot -- GioveLUG (Linux User Group) - http://www.giovelug.org Edupup (Educational distro) - http://www.edupup.org
Re: [lazarus] Linux Journal Poll: Pascal does not exist
Quoting Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Working with an underground language gives a cool feeling :D Please see attached image ;-) Cheers (with a tequila) mramirez attachment: Black-T-Shirt-Lazarus.JPG
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
The guys at mhccorp, did the same:
http://www.mhccorp.com/java.shtml
But, its a closed source project.
In their pages, they said, they made an Object Pascal To Java translator,
and later a Object Pascal to JVM assembler translator.
Yes the idea is having it Open Source, and for at least three VM's:
J2ME, Actionscript2, .NET
Whoever needs another platform can add the templates, and an
implementation of the Virtual Machine Library.
I'll take it to the point when I can display bitmaps and play sounds.
Then I'll drop the project, so I can work porting my engine on top of
it using the {$IFDEF} machete! :D
Regards!
-Marco
_
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Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
But, how knows ? Maybe the games you want to migrate to JVM-based phones, can be fun and even profit !!! ;-) Many games can be migrated to VM's that don't need a lot of processing power, think about the best selling Tetris ;D Also, what happens if a compiler maker or chipset builder finds out that developers are using Pascal on mobile devices... they might get interested since there is a visible market. They could make a real compiler or even better a chip with a Pascal Virtual Machine!! If there is a market, there is always a chance for these things to happen, if no one migrates applications the possibility is just zero. -Marco _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
I'm building right now a translator of Object Pascal to ECMAscript. I just need a common run-time library, which I'm building on top of FPC's RTL and the LCL. If someone wants to have a portable application, they just have to use the classes of the Virtual Machine Library (VML, not to confuse with VCL). Later, the translator will just change the syntax from Object Pascal to the VM's natural language using a template, then compile the application with an open-source or SDK's compiler, and integrate everything with a version of the VML for the target platform. From the programmer's point of view, it work exactly as an optimal Pascal command line compiler. That's my strategy. -Marco 2008/2/7, mramirez [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Quoting Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho [EMAIL PROTECTED]: My experience with Symbian makes me think I should have instead started a Java port. The Symbian is such a mess that a Java port would I read somewhere that Symbian was rebuilding its OS from scratch, because of the mess. There is even a Java assembler out there. I'm not 100% convinced that it can't be abstracted just like if it was just another platform. There is a JVM assembler: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jasmin_%28Java_assembler%29 But, the main problem with the Java ENVIROMENT/FRAMEWORK (Virtual Machine + Standard Library + Programming Language + else), is that is 100% CLASS/OBJECT oriented. Even the JVM assembler works with objects and classes, you can't work with global functions, records, or variables like many of the LCL functions does. As mentioned in other replies, you'll have to mutilate the object pascal version of the language to make it run in a JVM. Trying to migrate the Free Pascal Compiler (FPC) used by the Lazarus could be possible, but with weird, unexpected, poor performance results... Borland/CodeGear make an experimental Pascal for JVM compiler, and both this version and its .NET compiler had pitfalls. Anyway, virtual machines are slow, don't matter how much optimization they have, and require more resources. And mobile devices don't have as many resources that a P.C. does. I suggest you should go for the native development, whether is FPC+Lazarus or other development set of tools. Just my 2 cents... mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
On Feb 7, 2008 9:32 PM, Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm doing it now!! Once I get a hello-world translated, I'll start releasing the source code. Please create a source forge project for it and add the code to subversion. That guarantees the project can be continued on the future. thanks a lot, -- Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
2008/2/7, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Unfortunately I don't have time to build that, but I would try to help if someone starts such a project. I'm doing it now!! Once I get a hello-world translated, I'll start releasing the source code. Regards! -Marco _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
RE: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
Can I suggest you also look at the Alma project on freshmeat.net Sam -Original Message- From: Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 07 February 2008 17:37 To: lazarus@miraclec.com Subject: Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines? I'm building right now a translator of Object Pascal to ECMAscript. I just need a common run-time library, which I'm building on top of FPC's RTL and the LCL. If someone wants to have a portable application, they just have to use the classes of the Virtual Machine Library (VML, not to confuse with VCL). Later, the translator will just change the syntax from Object Pascal to the VM's natural language using a template, then compile the application with an open-source or SDK's compiler, and integrate everything with a version of the VML for the target platform. From the programmer's point of view, it work exactly as an optimal Pascal command line compiler. That's my strategy. -Marco 2008/2/7, mramirez [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Quoting Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho [EMAIL PROTECTED]: My experience with Symbian makes me think I should have instead started a Java port. The Symbian is such a mess that a Java port would I read somewhere that Symbian was rebuilding its OS from scratch, because of the mess. There is even a Java assembler out there. I'm not 100% convinced that it can't be abstracted just like if it was just another platform. There is a JVM assembler: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jasmin_%28Java_assembler%29 But, the main problem with the Java ENVIROMENT/FRAMEWORK (Virtual Machine + Standard Library + Programming Language + else), is that is 100% CLASS/OBJECT oriented. Even the JVM assembler works with objects and classes, you can't work with global functions, records, or variables like many of the LCL functions does. As mentioned in other replies, you'll have to mutilate the object pascal version of the language to make it run in a JVM. Trying to migrate the Free Pascal Compiler (FPC) used by the Lazarus could be possible, but with weird, unexpected, poor performance results... Borland/CodeGear make an experimental Pascal for JVM compiler, and both this version and its .NET compiler had pitfalls. Anyway, virtual machines are slow, don't matter how much optimization they have, and require more resources. And mobile devices don't have as many resources that a P.C. does. I suggest you should go for the native development, whether is FPC+Lazarus or other development set of tools. Just my 2 cents... mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
On Feb 7, 2008 2:11 AM, Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know MIDletPascal, and it's a perfect example. It suffers the same problem that Delphi has now, it's not Open Source. I think an open source project that works about the same as MIDLetPascal would be really excelent. It doesn't need to be a clone, but something with which I could write Pascal programas for J2ME, even if the language needs to be modified. Unfortunately I don't have time to build that, but I would try to help if someone starts such a project. -- Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
2008/2/7, Sam Liddicott [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Can I suggest you also look at the Alma project on freshmeat.net Sam Yes, but it's not only about language translation, indeed this is the easiest part. The real problem is creating a virtual machine library that is common between the different platforms. -Marco _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
Quoting Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I've been investigating, and came to the conclussion that the best compiler I can do IS NOT a compiler, BUT an specialiced translator. I The guys at mhccorp, did the same: http://www.mhccorp.com/java.shtml But, its a closed source project. In their pages, they said, they made an Object Pascal To Java translator, and later a Object Pascal to JVM assembler translator. One thing is the compiler, and another the development environment. If you want to extend the Free Pascal Compiler to work as a translator for Free (Object) Pascal to Java (Programming Language), you are welcome. If you achieve this, and later want to extend the Lazarus development environment for your FPC extension, you are also welcome. Visual Studio has a .NET mobile emulator where you can make a mobile application, and run it in the emulator. We don't want to discourage you of your idea, but seems complicated, and some of us think, there are other ways of doing the same. But, how knows ? Maybe the games you want to migrate to JVM-based phones, can be fun and even profit !!! ;-) Good Luck mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
Quoting Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho [EMAIL PROTECTED]: My experience with Symbian makes me think I should have instead started a Java port. The Symbian is such a mess that a Java port would I read somewhere that Symbian was rebuilding its OS from scratch, because of the mess. There is even a Java assembler out there. I'm not 100% convinced that it can't be abstracted just like if it was just another platform. There is a JVM assembler: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jasmin_%28Java_assembler%29 But, the main problem with the Java ENVIROMENT/FRAMEWORK (Virtual Machine + Standard Library + Programming Language + else), is that is 100% CLASS/OBJECT oriented. Even the JVM assembler works with objects and classes, you can't work with global functions, records, or variables like many of the LCL functions does. As mentioned in other replies, you'll have to mutilate the object pascal version of the language to make it run in a JVM. Trying to migrate the Free Pascal Compiler (FPC) used by the Lazarus could be possible, but with weird, unexpected, poor performance results... Borland/CodeGear make an experimental Pascal for JVM compiler, and both this version and its .NET compiler had pitfalls. Anyway, virtual machines are slow, don't matter how much optimization they have, and require more resources. And mobile devices don't have as many resources that a P.C. does. I suggest you should go for the native development, whether is FPC+Lazarus or other development set of tools. Just my 2 cents... mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Linux Journal Poll: Pascal does not exist
Nice shirt heheh :D 2008/2/7, mramirez [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Quoting Alexsander Rosa [EMAIL PROTECTED]: http://www.linuxjournal.com/node/1006101 18. What is your favorite programming language? OBJECT Pascal. Not your parents' pascal ;-) Cheers. mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Linux Journal Poll: Pascal does not exist
Quoting Alexsander Rosa [EMAIL PROTECTED]: http://www.linuxjournal.com/node/1006101 18. What is your favorite programming language? OBJECT Pascal. Not your parents' pascal ;-) Cheers. mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Linux Journal Poll: Pascal does not exist
Quoting Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Nice shirt heheh :D Thanks. Alexsander said that he liked use an underground programming language. Found a T-Shirt for that underground attitude ;-) _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Open URL in a browser
Orpheus has a TOvcURL component for hyperlinks. http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/OrphPort Thanks all, guys. I'll have a look at your suggests. Antonio -- Antonio Sanguigni alias slapshot -- GioveLUG (Linux User Group) - http://www.giovelug.org Edupup (Educational distro) - http://www.edupup.org
Re: [lazarus] Who is the controlling 'native' widget set in LCL?
Zitat von Graeme Geldenhuys [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On 07/02/2008, Paul Ishenin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In summary. TButton.Color is not available in LCL because Win32 doesn't allow a button face to change color without custom drawing. Yet other widget sets do like Qt and GTK1. That problem has been havily discussed in lazarus-dev list and we came to the conclusion that such properties should be in LCL, but on the other hand they must be marked some way in object inspector as non cross platform. My apologies. I didn't know of a 'lazarus-dev' mailing list. When was this decided, in the last 7 days? Because from your comment in he mantis bug report dated 2008-02-01 (7 days ago), your clearly stated that it _shouldn't_ be supported. Here is a small abstract about the current state of the discussion: Some properties can not be supported on some widgetsets, because it would require a lot of work, which no laz devel wants to do. OTOH some native features are so great, that the LCL should support them, but only on a subset of the widgetsets. The main problem is how can the programmer see, what property/method is available on what platform. The documentation is a good place, but not sufficient. It should be marked in the OI and identifier completion as well. The information can not be stored in the LCL alone and must be readable when cross designing. So one solution could be a xml file in each widgetset. This kind of information is needed by other libs as well. For example database front/backends. So maybe a more generic solution is needed. Mattias _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] Behavior of ClientToScreen in scrolling windows across different widget sets
Marc Weustink wrote: Luiz Americo Pereira Camara wrote: While debugging scrolling bugs in LCL i found that ClientToScreen acts differently according to the widget set. These are the behaviors: 1) The returned value is related to the actual position, i.e., it does not consider the scroll offset. If you pass Point(0,0) the value will be the same regardless of the scroll position. (Gtk1) 2) The returned value is related to the virtual position, i.e, it takes into account the scroll offset. If you pass Point(0, 0) the value changes inversely to scrollbar position. (Gtk2) 3) The returned value is related to the virtual position, i.e, it takes into account the scroll offset. If you pass Point(0, 0) the value changes the same amount of scrollbar position. (Win32) 4) Nothing. Qt has no visible scrollbars so... Notes: Delphi does the same as (1)/Gtk1 Not really, internally Delphi does it like 2. All controls are moved. I'm not referring to position of controls after scrolling. I'm referring to ClientToScreen return results. Say you query the ClientToScreen with 0,0 will return value x, y. Now scroll vertically amount n. Under Delphi the returned value will still be x, y and not x, y-n that is the virtual position. The example shows this clearly. Move the window to position 0,0. Get the ClientToScreen result of 0,0 = 0,0. Now scroll vertically 10 (Notice that part of the client area is offscreen). Get again the value of 0,0. You will get Win32: 0,10 Gtk1: 0,0 Gtk2: 0, -10 Delphi: 0,0 The patch makes win32 behaves like Gtk2 each makes more sense. (3) is clearly buggy. Between (1) and (2) is a design decision. We started like delphi, move controls and report corrected values when asked. However this aproach is very inefficient on all widgetsets except win32. So the new approach is that controls stay at their position and only the virtual parent gets an offset. This means that the top/left of a control on a say scrollbox are allways the same, an offset to the virtual parent top/left. See above. So now ClientToScreen. The top/left of a scrolled control needs to get a scrolled offset, so that is reflects the real position relative to the real parent of the control. The behavior described here is generic to any point, not control position related. Luiz _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
[lazarus] How is docking support coming?
Hi all, I need docking support for a project and I would prefer to write it Lazarus if I can. I know there was some headway made, but is docking support stabilized? Thanks ;) -- Warm Regards, Lee Everything I needed to learn in life, I learned selling encyclopedias door to door. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] How is docking support coming?
Lee Jenkins wrote: Hi all, I need docking support for a project and I would prefer to write it Lazarus if I can. I know there was some headway made, but is docking support stabilized? No. Some things works, some things we are doing, some things still doesnot have decision about way of implementation. Best regards, Paul Ishenin. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
Re: [lazarus] FPC compiler for virtual machines?
Quoting Marco Alvarado [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I'm building right now a translator of Object Pascal to ECMAscript. Good Luck ;-) mramirez _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
[lazarus] GTK2 Help [OT]
Hi all, Sorry for off topic request, but I'd like to see what an app looks like on gtk2 and I'm having a dickens of a time trying to upgrade my current gtk2 on Centos 4.4. Can someone suggest a simple way to upgrade this? I've tried yum, but it doesn't seem to think there is a new version of gtk2 than my current 2.4.13-22 version. Thanks and sorry for OT post. -- Warm Regards, Lee Everything I needed to learn in life, I learned selling encyclopedias door to door. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
[lazarus] My first GUI Application
I've written several console/daemon apps with Lazarus/Freepascal, but this is my first GUI app that really does anything and aside from some gotchas getting it to run on Linux (developed on WinXP), it seems to be running very well. http://leebo.dreamhosters.com/images/guiApp.png There's a few idiosyncrasies with the fonts (size, etc) between Win32 and GTK, but all in all, I'm very happy with results thus far. Kudos to the developers and community. I'm hooked. -- Warm Regards, Lee Everything I needed to learn in life, I learned selling encyclopedias door to door. _ To unsubscribe: mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe as the Subject archives at http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailarchives
