RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
Sounds good to me. I completely forgot about Abandonware in PC terms. I think we should make all these unknown status programs available in a site for download, labelled abandonware, and on the head of the downloader be it. God, we're talking about 10-15 year old QL programs here. Hardly a market for em, and nobody is going to get rich. There is a lot of decent software in this category, and it's a shame to see it sit idle when people could be getting some use from it. Cheers, Darren. -Original Message- From: Duncan Neithercut [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 22 May 2005 20:57 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software It bugs me also. See rest of world : Computer Active computer magazine 12th to 25th May feature on how to find and play vintage PC games. They mention ww.abandonia.com a site for freeware, shareware and so called abandonware == programs no longer sold or supported by its developer. They note that abandonware is technically illegal but that the copyright holders are not harmed financially by this distribution of discontinued software. It happens in PC land where the market money amd lawyers are so much bigger and agressive. Why then are the theoretical rights of absentee copright holders in the QL world where the market is zip according to all our traders such a mega issue? No one can be harmed when sources/modifications are released where there is no market. How about this - even in a PC 100% of zero is always zero. When will the upgrade of Perfection be release in DWJ web site. Duncan Neithercut -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of gwicks Sent: 17 May 2005 22:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software - Original Message - From: Darren Branagh To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software This is one of the many things that bugs the hell out of me. I wish there was a statute of limitations or similar on software, whereby after x years the stuff became free. I'm sure freddy would agree to releasing it as freeware, or certainly for a giveaway price. I mean, what real use is a piece of 10 year old QL Software other than retro/curiosity value? You're hardly gonna run the world with it... There is so much good usable software out there and nobody knows its user status - is it freeware, charityware, commercial, or what? And if we had some certainty on a lot of this, a lot of users may be attracted back or stay with the QL to use them, purely as tinkerers. I can pick up a copy of PC World, Computer Shopper, PC Pro or any other PC Magazine and find a pile of software (often once costing hundreds of pounds) stuck to the front cover for the 4.99 cover price, and much of this is less than 2-3 years of age. You usually find v.3 or whatever on the cover disc with an offer to get the new v.4 inside at a reduced cost - yet here we are debating the status of software that hasn't been sold at all, never mind updated, for over a decade. Why are people so reluctant to give this stuff away? There is no money in it anymore. Just ask any trader :-) END RANT/ Don't forget Freddy V. may have sold the software, but that does not mean he is the copyright holder. I have said this many times before on this list. There are doubts about the copyright position of several of the ancilliary programs that formed part of the total Perfection package. When I enquired many years ago, no one was sure of the exact copyright status of Spellchecker, for example. If my memory serves me correctly when Turbo became PD permission had to be sought not just from Freddy V., but also the various authors, Best Wishes, Geoff ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
It bugs me also. See rest of world : Computer Active computer magazine 12th to 25th May feature on how to find and play vintage PC games. They mention ww.abandonia.com a site for freeware, shareware and so called abandonware == programs no longer sold or supported by its developer. They note that abandonware is technically illegal but that the copyright holders are not harmed financially by this distribution of discontinued software. It happens in PC land where the market money amd lawyers are so much bigger and agressive. Why then are the theoretical rights of absentee copright holders in the QL world where the market is zip according to all our traders such a mega issue? No one can be harmed when sources/modifications are released where there is no market. How about this - even in a PC 100% of zero is always zero. When will the upgrade of Perfection be release in DWJ web site. Duncan Neithercut -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of gwicks Sent: 17 May 2005 22:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software - Original Message - From: Darren Branagh To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software This is one of the many things that bugs the hell out of me. I wish there was a statute of limitations or similar on software, whereby after x years the stuff became free. I'm sure freddy would agree to releasing it as freeware, or certainly for a giveaway price. I mean, what real use is a piece of 10 year old QL Software other than retro/curiosity value? You're hardly gonna run the world with it... There is so much good usable software out there and nobody knows its user status - is it freeware, charityware, commercial, or what? And if we had some certainty on a lot of this, a lot of users may be attracted back or stay with the QL to use them, purely as tinkerers. I can pick up a copy of PC World, Computer Shopper, PC Pro or any other PC Magazine and find a pile of software (often once costing hundreds of pounds) stuck to the front cover for the 4.99 cover price, and much of this is less than 2-3 years of age. You usually find v.3 or whatever on the cover disc with an offer to get the new v.4 inside at a reduced cost - yet here we are debating the status of software that hasn't been sold at all, never mind updated, for over a decade. Why are people so reluctant to give this stuff away? There is no money in it anymore. Just ask any trader :-) END RANT/ Don't forget Freddy V. may have sold the software, but that does not mean he is the copyright holder. I have said this many times before on this list. There are doubts about the copyright position of several of the ancilliary programs that formed part of the total Perfection package. When I enquired many years ago, no one was sure of the exact copyright status of Spellchecker, for example. If my memory serves me correctly when Turbo became PD permission had to be sought not just from Freddy V., but also the various authors, Best Wishes, Geoff ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
First of all welcome to the group - I hope you choose to stay. You'll find we're a friendly bunch, eager to help, and the only stupid question is the one you don't ask. Do you intend to use your QL more often now or are you just going to tinker for curiosity value? The DP QL Collection ceased being sold many years ago. There was a recent debate here regarding the status of many of the programs, and one, The Perfection Word processor, is (I think) due to be released as freeware. A namesake, Dilwyn Jones, recently made contact with the Owner of Digital Precision - Freddy Vaccha. Dilwyn - when you spoke to Freddy, did you mention any of the other programs in the collection, with a view to maybe making most or possibly all of them freeware? No, only Perfection word processor was mentioned. He indicated he'd be willing to allow that to be distributed as long as any changes made by the likes of David Gilham were to improve compatibility with emulators and modern QL hardware rather than adding any new commands etc to it, which I think is what David intended to do anyway. Other than that, no positive news. Phoebus did ask me to ask him about Conqueror, but not got a reply on that one yet. Stuart - I could probably get a free WANTED ad into QL Today magazine for you (if publisher Jochen Merz agrees and space permits) to see if anyone wishes to sell their copy of the DP bundle. Let me know if you'd like to try this. Dilwyn Jones ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
Dilwyn Jones wrote: Stuart - I could probably get a free WANTED ad into QL Today magazine for you (if publisher Jochen Merz agrees and space permits) to see if anyone wishes to sell their copy of the DP bundle. Let me know if you'd like to try this. Of course, anyone who did sell or otherwise pass on their DP bundle would be breaching the licence conditions but, 10 years on, I doubt if even Freddy V. would be too concerned :-) John ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
This is one of the many things that bugs the hell out of me. I wish there was a statute of limitations or similar on software, whereby after x years the stuff became free. I'm sure freddy would agree to releasing it as freeware, or certainly for a giveaway price. I mean, what real use is a piece of 10 year old QL Software other than retro/curiosity value? You're hardly gonna run the world with it... There is so much good usable software out there and nobody knows its user status - is it freeware, charityware, commercial, or what? And if we had some certainty on a lot of this, a lot of users may be attracted back or stay with the QL to use them, purely as tinkerers. I can pick up a copy of PC World, Computer Shopper, PC Pro or any other PC Magazine and find a pile of software (often once costing hundreds of pounds) stuck to the front cover for the 4.99 cover price, and much of this is less than 2-3 years of age. You usually find v.3 or whatever on the cover disc with an offer to get the new v.4 inside at a reduced cost - yet here we are debating the status of software that hasn't been sold at all, never mind updated, for over a decade. Why are people so reluctant to give this stuff away? There is no money in it anymore. Just ask any trader :-) END RANT/ Darren. -Original Message- From: John Hall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 17 May 2005 15:26 To: QL Users Subject: Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software Dilwyn Jones wrote: Stuart - I could probably get a free WANTED ad into QL Today magazine for you (if publisher Jochen Merz agrees and space permits) to see if anyone wishes to sell their copy of the DP bundle. Let me know if you'd like to try this. Of course, anyone who did sell or otherwise pass on their DP bundle would be breaching the licence conditions but, 10 years on, I doubt if even Freddy V. would be too concerned :-) John ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
- Original Message - From: Darren Branagh To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 3:43 PM Subject: RE: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software This is one of the many things that bugs the hell out of me. I wish there was a statute of limitations or similar on software, whereby after x years the stuff became free. I'm sure freddy would agree to releasing it as freeware, or certainly for a giveaway price. I mean, what real use is a piece of 10 year old QL Software other than retro/curiosity value? You're hardly gonna run the world with it... There is so much good usable software out there and nobody knows its user status - is it freeware, charityware, commercial, or what? And if we had some certainty on a lot of this, a lot of users may be attracted back or stay with the QL to use them, purely as tinkerers. I can pick up a copy of PC World, Computer Shopper, PC Pro or any other PC Magazine and find a pile of software (often once costing hundreds of pounds) stuck to the front cover for the 4.99 cover price, and much of this is less than 2-3 years of age. You usually find v.3 or whatever on the cover disc with an offer to get the new v.4 inside at a reduced cost - yet here we are debating the status of software that hasn't been sold at all, never mind updated, for over a decade. Why are people so reluctant to give this stuff away? There is no money in it anymore. Just ask any trader :-) END RANT/ Don't forget Freddy V. may have sold the software, but that does not mean he is the copyright holder. I have said this many times before on this list. There are doubts about the copyright position of several of the ancilliary programs that formed part of the total Perfection package. When I enquired many years ago, no one was sure of the exact copyright status of Spellchecker, for example. If my memory serves me correctly when Turbo became PD permission had to be sought not just from Freddy V., but also the various authors, Best Wishes, Geoff ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
On Tue, 17 May 2005 17:17:20 -0400, gwicks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't forget Freddy V. may have sold the software, but that does not mean he is the copyright holder. I have said this many times before on this list. There are doubts about the copyright position of several of the ancilliary programs that formed part of the total Perfection package. When I enquired many years ago, no one was sure of the exact copyright status of Spellchecker, for example. If my memory serves me correctly when Turbo became PD permission had to be sought not just from Freddy V., but also the various authors, It all depends on the agreements. If an author was acting as an agent (legalese of course) of DP then DP *IS* the copyright holder, unless their contract stated otherwise. For example when it comes to Rich's software I do not hold any copyright over the pictures and sounds that I created nor the packaging of the software. Copyright for those was transfered to Rich when I agreed to the compensation scheme :-) Similarily, Microsoft retains copyright of its software regardles of who is writing it (unless of course they steal it like Spyglass' software ;-) ) Ffibys P.S. I am back ;-) ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
Re: RE: [ql-users] Digital Precision Software
On Tue, 17 May 2005 10:43:50 -0400, Darren Branagh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can pick up a copy of PC World, Computer Shopper, PC Pro or any other PC Magazine and find a pile of software (often once costing hundreds of pounds) stuck to the front cover for the 4.99 cover price, and much of this is less than 2-3 years of age. You usually find v.3 or whatever on the cover disc with an offer to get the new v.4 inside at a reduced cost - yet here we are debating the status of software that hasn't been sold at all, never mind updated, for over a decade. Why are people so reluctant to give this stuff away? There is no money in it anymore. Just ask any trader :-) One of course would argue that QL Software (and indeed DP software would classify since it never had significant problems) is so good that it doesn't need to be updated ;-) As for the PC world, recapturing investment may not be that important... we are talking about economies of scale here Ffibys ___ QL-Users Mailing List http://www.q-v-d.demon.co.uk/smsqe.htm
