subject:"Softimage \- not going away..."

MPC and PSYOP output some great work with Fabric Engine but in the end I
always felt it was too narrowly aimed at senior TD's with plenty of
programming experience. The success of ICE was fuelled by the compounds
that acted as a gateway drug to the inner workings. I thought maybe that
Kraken would develop into that gateway drug, but after seeing experienced
riggers feeling out of their comfort zone, soon realised it wasn't to be.

When Eric Mootz joined the team I thought maybe that would bring about
tools for technically minded artists who weren't necessarily TD's.

Whatever the reasons I feel for the FE team after all their hard efforts.
But I feel as one door closes others will open for them, folk with that
much talent don't remain jobless for long.

On 27 October 2017 at 22:03, Matt Lind <speye...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> It likely died for the reason you just stated - you 'eventually' wanted to
> learn.  Problem is most people had the same sentiments.
>
> They made the right move initially of targeting the space between the other
> DCCs, but I think staying there long term was a mistake.
>
>
> Matt
>
>
> Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 17:34:02 +
> From: Andres Stephens <drais...@outlook.com>
> Subject: RE: Softimage - not going away...
> To: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>
> This is devastating news!!! WTF!? I was betting on learning this and
> eventually investing in it. I didn?t want to be locked into one software
> the
> more I got into proceduralism.  Why!?
>
> -Draise
>
>
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
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RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Matt Lind

It likely died for the reason you just stated - you 'eventually' wanted to 
learn.  Problem is most people had the same sentiments.

They made the right move initially of targeting the space between the other 
DCCs, but I think staying there long term was a mistake.


Matt


Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 17:34:02 +
From: Andres Stephens <drais...@outlook.com>
Subject: RE: Softimage - not going away...
To: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.

This is devastating news!!! WTF!? I was betting on learning this and 
eventually investing in it. I didn?t want to be locked into one software the 
more I got into proceduralism.  Why!?

-Draise


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Re: Softimage - not going away...

That would be my hope too Mirko.

On 27 October 2017 at 18:39, Mirko Jankovic <mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Well hopefully they will go to SideFX... but yea.. BETA vs VHS all over
> again
> ᐧ
>
> On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 7:37 PM, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com
> > wrote:
>
>> That's really is sad that Fabric Engine couldn't survive commercially.
>>
>> Devastating news for a team exceptional ex-XSI talents.
>>
>> On 27 October 2017 at 18:34, Andres Stephens <drais...@outlook.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> This is devastating news!!! WTF!? I was betting on learning this and
>>> eventually investing in it. I didn’t want to be locked into one software
>>> the more I got into proceduralism.  Why!?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Draise
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From: *pedro santos <probi...@gmail.com>
>>> *Sent: *Friday, October 27, 2017 12:27
>>> *To: *Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=9mxBLhh4wPOue0bitBwrCYYkxfHcpfCbUm6f4wr92aQ=_bZTxzcZolTCFwWrbBaP4VIvviTKvsqFIz24eCZExoM=
>>> <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>>> *Subject: *Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Another hit :(
>>> fabricengine.com
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__fabricengine.com=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aQJibcOU6qnEZIKLRmsqR9Pnljk_nfXVWdFHcLgNbfw=1cDZwCC3mbYEfcpbfOcXQLiUipy4hzlFHDZAYvkHNDg=>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Mirko Jankovic <
>>> mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> It is really sad that years after SI is killed best possible replacement
>>> is still years away
>>>
>>> What are we talking about? Let's kill best software it is not so
>>> profitable as others and push back production workflow and progress 10
>>> years back who needs progress when you can charge subscription for
>>> every day getting close to where Softiamge already is (yes.. AD.. yes...)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [image:
>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mailfoogae.appspot.com_t-3Fsender-3DabWlya29qLmFuaW1hdG9yQGdtYWlsLmNvbQ-253D-253D-26type-3Dzerocontent-26guid-3Debae5a00-2D7061-2D4f8a-2Da8cf-2D0e837e373792=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=9mxBLhh4wPOue0bitBwrCYYkxfHcpfCbUm6f4wr92aQ=lvvQU_1Tz-0pkfye45UegoC_oh6jgxhmJpf-0PGI9o4=]
>>> ᐧ
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Softimage Mailing List.
>>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> [image: 
>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__i.imgur.com_b4wkbKh.gif=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=9mxBLhh4wPOue0bitBwrCYYkxfHcpfCbUm6f4wr92aQ=OZGELL8ALFpEkCgCONqoEQhCByaciFM1MSQmn-wG47E=]
>>>
>>> Pedro Alpiarça dos Santos
>>>
>>>  probiner.xyz
>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__probiner.xyz_=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aQJibcOU6qnEZIKLRmsqR9Pnljk_nfXVWdFHcLgNbfw=CMOwMy8K_N55hFoZnzjlZEJjWpMB6_8flcenMoCOLk0=>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Softimage Mailing List.
>>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Mirko Jankovic
> *https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cgfolio.com_mirko-2Djankovic=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=9mxBLhh4wPOue0bitBwrCYYkxfHcpfCbUm6f4wr92aQ=F3tk6coKQOyyrgxuirbZ9ae_aRk_CIABt0ySnx80Om8=
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Mirko Jankovic

Well hopefully they will go to SideFX... but yea.. BETA vs VHS all over
again
ᐧ

On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 7:37 PM, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> That's really is sad that Fabric Engine couldn't survive commercially.
>
> Devastating news for a team exceptional ex-XSI talents.
>
> On 27 October 2017 at 18:34, Andres Stephens <drais...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>> This is devastating news!!! WTF!? I was betting on learning this and
>> eventually investing in it. I didn’t want to be locked into one software
>> the more I got into proceduralism.  Why!?
>>
>>
>>
>> -Draise
>>
>>
>>
>> *From: *pedro santos <probi...@gmail.com>
>> *Sent: *Friday, October 27, 2017 12:27
>> *To: *Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=q67ZfB9mGzXSdyPWlxoiZWUaxiXI2VE2lcD-NVRHC4c=SlBODTmseToywL8l27vrjJSHD03NY9QcYJgJ9waFB2M=
>> <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>> *Subject: *Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>
>>
>>
>> Another hit :(
>> fabricengine.com
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__fabricengine.com=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aQJibcOU6qnEZIKLRmsqR9Pnljk_nfXVWdFHcLgNbfw=1cDZwCC3mbYEfcpbfOcXQLiUipy4hzlFHDZAYvkHNDg=>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Mirko Jankovic <
>> mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> It is really sad that years after SI is killed best possible replacement
>> is still years away
>>
>> What are we talking about? Let's kill best software it is not so
>> profitable as others and push back production workflow and progress 10
>> years back who needs progress when you can charge subscription for
>> every day getting close to where Softiamge already is (yes.. AD.. yes...)
>>
>>
>>
>> [image:
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mailfoogae.appspot.com_t-3Fsender-3DabWlya29qLmFuaW1hdG9yQGdtYWlsLmNvbQ-253D-253D-26type-3Dzerocontent-26guid-3Debae5a00-2D7061-2D4f8a-2Da8cf-2D0e837e373792=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=q67ZfB9mGzXSdyPWlxoiZWUaxiXI2VE2lcD-NVRHC4c=cAbAAKUhU-yVtkB_Dg9acD_Z2BBSSDR2gpqKxYxqs58=]
>> ᐧ
>>
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> [image: 
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__i.imgur.com_b4wkbKh.gif=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=q67ZfB9mGzXSdyPWlxoiZWUaxiXI2VE2lcD-NVRHC4c=3XmyRHKZuvYiL8GSCCYHObM1FTvR0pqb6Py67A7xi5c=]
>>
>> Pedro Alpiarça dos Santos
>>
>>  probiner.xyz
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__probiner.xyz_=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aQJibcOU6qnEZIKLRmsqR9Pnljk_nfXVWdFHcLgNbfw=CMOwMy8K_N55hFoZnzjlZEJjWpMB6_8flcenMoCOLk0=>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>



-- 
Mirko Jankovic
*https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cgfolio.com_mirko-2Djankovic=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=q67ZfB9mGzXSdyPWlxoiZWUaxiXI2VE2lcD-NVRHC4c=N1FGbU71-svuVzALSEKjJ49KrZWeGy6XOtpf6vzg2xA=
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cgfolio.com_mirko-2Djankovic=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=q67ZfB9mGzXSdyPWlxoiZWUaxiXI2VE2lcD-NVRHC4c=N1FGbU71-svuVzALSEKjJ49KrZWeGy6XOtpf6vzg2xA=>*

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RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Andres Stephens

This is devastating news!!! WTF!? I was betting on learning this and eventually 
investing in it. I didn’t want to be locked into one software the more I got 
into proceduralism.  Why!?

-Draise

From: pedro santos<mailto:probi...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2017 12:27
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIGaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=qqQ9HRxOsEyUZ79MoE3qdMczxpdXTBXa1Eb05OYnHQQ=6MntOerwUui78zQzgGCefA0XVB7mR5xirKPzNZQZ1Tw=<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Another hit :(
fabricengine.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__fabricengine.com=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aQJibcOU6qnEZIKLRmsqR9Pnljk_nfXVWdFHcLgNbfw=1cDZwCC3mbYEfcpbfOcXQLiUipy4hzlFHDZAYvkHNDg=>

On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Mirko Jankovic 
<mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com<mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:
It is really sad that years after SI is killed best possible replacement is 
still years away
What are we talking about? Let's kill best software it is not so profitable as 
others and push back production workflow and progress 10 years back who 
needs progress when you can charge subscription for every day getting close to 
where Softiamge already is (yes.. AD.. yes...)

ᐧ

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Pedro Alpiarça dos Santos

probiner.xyz<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__probiner.xyz_=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aQJibcOU6qnEZIKLRmsqR9Pnljk_nfXVWdFHcLgNbfw=CMOwMy8K_N55hFoZnzjlZEJjWpMB6_8flcenMoCOLk0=>

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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread pedro santos

Another hit :(
fabricengine.com


On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Mirko Jankovic 
wrote:

> It is really sad that years after SI is killed best possible replacement
> is still years away
> What are we talking about? Let's kill best software it is not so
> profitable as others and push back production workflow and progress 10
> years back who needs progress when you can charge subscription for
> every day getting close to where Softiamge already is (yes.. AD.. yes...)
>
> ᐧ
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>



-- 
--

Pedro Alpiarça dos Santos


* probiner.xyz 

 *
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Mirko Jankovic

It is really sad that years after SI is killed best possible replacement is
still years away
What are we talking about? Let's kill best software it is not so profitable
as others and push back production workflow and progress 10 years back
who needs progress when you can charge subscription for every day getting
close to where Softiamge already is (yes.. AD.. yes...)

ᐧ
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

at
>> you don't get very far in motion design without a good understanding of a
>> DCC's particle system and motion paths in general. On that basis the most
>> obvious comparison is the intuitive nature of Mograph and X-Particles in
>> C4D to Particles in Houdini. You won't get far in Houdini particle effects
>> without expressions at the least and Vex Wrangles to match some of the
>> stock effects in X-Particles. C4D & X-Particles both put intuitive UX front
>> and centre; the whole question/answer metaphor used in X-Particles is a UX
>> tour de force. When you couple that with the elegance of C4D's scene
>> manager it makes for a very intuitive workflow.
>>
>> Houdini is without doubt the more powerful and flexible option, but C4D
>> enables a motion designer to get the task done faster and more intuitively.
>>
>> On 27 October 2017 at 09:04, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini
>>> that are wrong or not quite there.
>>>
>>> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
>>>
>>> Jb
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in
>>> Houdini isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer
>>> answer is that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the
>>> exact flavour of motion control you favour.
>>>
>>> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create
>>> bespoke tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>>>
>>> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and
>>>> powerful as it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for
>>>> the most part in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in
>>>> and out at any time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I
>>>> would think that you do much of this in C4D but without the complete
>>>> control you can get with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation
>>>> is there with Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to
>>>> use Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.
>>>> I have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some
>>>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain
>>>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>>>
>>>> *From:* Jonathan Moore
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>>>> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>>>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=9Q6aYm1tPdpCgZbM9fxgY7rTQYGzx4O1CW3TUuWkDqk=0LM5ITESE_mvaTcguQ0b9hFLjOm0QaB7XVupFrkSvzM=
>>>> /forum/#!forum/xsi_list
>>>> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>>>
>>>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff
>>>> in Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the
>>>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other
>>>> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long
>>>> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand
>>>> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who
>>>> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>>>>
>>>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn
>>>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working
>>>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the
>>>> cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite
>>>> is the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini,
>>>> a little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and
>>>> luckily the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread
>>>> friendly (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's
>>>> motion design tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so a suite

Re: Softimage - not going away...

t;>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini 
>>>> isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is 
>>>> that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact 
>>>> flavour of motion control you favour.
>>>> 
>>>> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create 
>>>> bespoke tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>>>> 
>>>> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com 
>>>> <mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com>> wrote:
>>>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful 
>>>> as it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most 
>>>> part in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out 
>>>> at any time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would 
>>>> think that you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you 
>>>> can get with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there 
>>>> with Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to use 
>>>> Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I 
>>>> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some 
>>>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain 
>>>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>>>  
>>>> From: Jonathan Moore <>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>>>> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>>>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=hiZdB_nxUmdWTozFLmw1LA3uPlZeH7h5E4uPpVjLQPI=IMNzbiscQf8EUINDDOHWjrZmIZOON3Fk_j-H-iabmIc=
>>>>  <>
>>>> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>>>  
>>>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff in 
>>>> Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the 
>>>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the 
>>>> other was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math 
>>>> nerd long before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the 
>>>> other hand is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical 
>>>> workflows who rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>>>>  
>>>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn 
>>>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working 
>>>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating 
>>>> the cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin 
>>>> suite is the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of 
>>>> Houdini, a little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is 
>>>> performance and luckily the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes 
>>>> become thread friendly (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D 
>>>> and Maya's motion design tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so 
>>>> a suite of tools in Houdini with similar capabilities, whilst being 
>>>> optimised for fully threaded workflows will hopefully provide further 
>>>> encouragement for motion artists to deepen their Houdini knowledge. ;)
>>>>  
>>>> On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com <>> wrote:
>>>> No worries Jonathan..
>>>>  
>>>> It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those 
>>>> coming from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really 
>>>> are doing amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an 
>>>> evolution in the sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental 
>>>> for the type of work they intend to do.
>>>>  
>>>> Anyway… good luck though
>>>>  
>>>> hugs
>>>> jb
>>>>  
>>>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.co

Re: Softimage - not going away...

 I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I
>>> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some
>>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain
>>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>>
>>> *From:* Jonathan Moore
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>>> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=LnSwN7r2MYpeqTrq02xtc0yaL2tt2Z8s6qljJTRNLz0=Auur3FIRBA_ERJd3VRpv-y1B0fI0d9N0Q6vapkSej90=
>>> /forum/#!forum/xsi_list
>>> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>>
>>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff
>>> in Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the
>>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other
>>> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long
>>> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand
>>> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who
>>> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>>>
>>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn
>>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working
>>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the
>>> cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite
>>> is the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini,
>>> a little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and
>>> luckily the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread
>>> friendly (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's
>>> motion design tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so a suite of
>>> tools in Houdini with similar capabilities, whilst being optimised for
>>> fully threaded workflows will hopefully provide further encouragement for
>>> motion artists to deepen their Houdini knowledge. ;)
>>>
>>> On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> No worries Jonathan..
>>>>
>>>> It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those
>>>> coming from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really are
>>>> doing amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an
>>>> evolution in the sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental
>>>> for the type of work they intend to do.
>>>>
>>>> Anyway… good luck though
>>>>
>>>> hugs
>>>> jb
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over
>>>> that way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full featured
>>>> end to end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out
>>>> of a many artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive
>>>> view of things but have come to realise there are many that don't share my
>>>> view.  :)
>>>>
>>>> On 26 October 2017 at 19:29, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact
>>>>> that everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based
>>>>> approaches but may be outside is not so obvious.
>>>>>
>>>>> I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
>>>>> jb
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I
>>>>> support. Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being
>>>>> technical.
>>>>>
>>>>> You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have
>>>>> to be considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>

Re: Softimage - not going away...

BTW, I am sure you guys are aware but there are some tools for flocking like 
the ones you have in Cinema4D

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.sidefx.com_docs_houdini_nodes_dop_popcurveforce=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=HG4yc6di4pSPGmjjCQ4nMw4HMQzz-WNeoV_iUe2V20Y=ZAZwrCLfNzu1gwYSL6rpD8PdDhZ4Zl70odynEqbVLtY=
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.sidefx.com_docs_houdini_nodes_dop_popmetaballforce=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=HG4yc6di4pSPGmjjCQ4nMw4HMQzz-WNeoV_iUe2V20Y=LVL8fbw4IGn6v-DNxdiz_4nLFXHlulY4W5UpxYu0zdI=

Out of the box, no need for programming

jb



> On 27 Oct 2017, at 14:53, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I see… indeed you have a few tools there it is true that for motion graphics 
> you have to deal with technical things in Houdini that nor XSI not Cinema4D 
> force you to… this is something gI would love them to tweak so I will ask … 
> who knows.
> 
> jb
> 
>> On 27 Oct 2017, at 12:42, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
>> 
>> That's a very opened ended statement but my own interpretation was that you 
>> don't get very far in motion design without a good understanding of a DCC's 
>> particle system and motion paths in general. On that basis the most obvious 
>> comparison is the intuitive nature of Mograph and X-Particles in C4D to 
>> Particles in Houdini. You won't get far in Houdini particle effects without 
>> expressions at the least and Vex Wrangles to match some of the stock effects 
>> in X-Particles. C4D & X-Particles both put intuitive UX front and centre; 
>> the whole question/answer metaphor used in X-Particles is a UX tour de 
>> force. When you couple that with the elegance of C4D's scene manager it 
>> makes for a very intuitive workflow.
>> 
>> Houdini is without doubt the more powerful and flexible option, but C4D 
>> enables a motion designer to get the task done faster and more intuitively.
>> 
>> On 27 October 2017 at 09:04, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:jordiba...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini that 
>> are wrong or not quite there.
>> 
>> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
>> 
>> Jb
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>>> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini 
>>> isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is 
>>> that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact 
>>> flavour of motion control you favour.
>>> 
>>> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create bespoke 
>>> tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>>> 
>>> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com 
>>> <mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com>> wrote:
>>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful as 
>>> it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most part 
>>> in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out at any 
>>> time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think that 
>>> you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can get 
>>> with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with 
>>> Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to use 
>>> Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I 
>>> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some 
>>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain 
>>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>>  
>>> From: Jonathan Moore <>
>>> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>>> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=HG4yc6di4pSPGmjjCQ4nMw4HMQzz-WNeoV_iUe2V20Y=iOiMTbZP6iKXDYk1V7Uh1Be7Oor2oWR2cuoYLea5vNA=
>>>  <>
>>> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>&g

Re: Softimage - not going away...

I see… indeed you have a few tools there it is true that for motion graphics 
you have to deal with technical things in Houdini that nor XSI not Cinema4D 
force you to… this is something gI would love them to tweak so I will ask … who 
knows.

jb

> On 27 Oct 2017, at 12:42, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
> 
> That's a very opened ended statement but my own interpretation was that you 
> don't get very far in motion design without a good understanding of a DCC's 
> particle system and motion paths in general. On that basis the most obvious 
> comparison is the intuitive nature of Mograph and X-Particles in C4D to 
> Particles in Houdini. You won't get far in Houdini particle effects without 
> expressions at the least and Vex Wrangles to match some of the stock effects 
> in X-Particles. C4D & X-Particles both put intuitive UX front and centre; the 
> whole question/answer metaphor used in X-Particles is a UX tour de force. 
> When you couple that with the elegance of C4D's scene manager it makes for a 
> very intuitive workflow.
> 
> Houdini is without doubt the more powerful and flexible option, but C4D 
> enables a motion designer to get the task done faster and more intuitively.
> 
> On 27 October 2017 at 09:04, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:jordiba...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini that 
> are wrong or not quite there.
> 
> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
> 
> Jb
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
>> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini 
>> isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is 
>> that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact 
>> flavour of motion control you favour.
>> 
>> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create bespoke 
>> tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>> 
>> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com 
>> <mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com>> wrote:
>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful as 
>> it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most part 
>> in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out at any 
>> time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think that 
>> you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can get with 
>> ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with Houdini.  I 
>> agree with others I would just assume continue to use Softimage/Ice, 
>> however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I have had problems 
>> like this with other programs where just recently some updates whether it be 
>> windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain things to crash, and 
>> has caused me great anxiety.
>>  
>> From: Jonathan Moore <>
>> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=5tFi1PqSa43D8reVogRSLLYRU2gjK6Y2Rklk-KYAhsA=7oM-a_-ay0vp5VRaPqCCH7fok2jFuUSAWxg83piov9U=
>>  <>
>> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>  
>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff in 
>> Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the 
>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other 
>> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long 
>> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand 
>> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who 
>> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>>  
>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn 
>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working 
>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the 
>> cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite is 
>> the easy  part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini, a 
>> little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and luckily 
>> the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes b

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Jason S


  
  
On 10/25/17 17:01, Mathieu Leclaire
  wrote:


  
  I hear you, but how will you compete
for a job when everyone else is using nail guns and you are only
using a hammer? If all these new kids can do the job 100x faster
then you can, why would they hire you instead? I'm not saying
you can't do a good job with a hammer, but it'll take more time
so you'll need to charge more money to compensate. You better
make sure you're freaking amazing with that hammer if you want
them to come back to you.
  


There is no doubt that becoming at least familiar if not functional
in a variety of solutions can be good practice and a goo measure (if
only for eventually down the line), 
The same goes for in general staying aware of the current state of
things.

But If we are still having this conversation almost 5 years post
eol, 
if only it was -mostly- about the force of habit or "comfort zones".

Or if even after serious evaluations and experiences, despite
reduced talent base and a number of other obstacles, XSI continues
to persists, I'd hardly think it's due to stubborn muscle memory... 
but mostly -because- of the main "problem" being :: XSI quite
arguably remains the nail gun in a great number of situations by a
still pretty considerable margin.

There is no doubt capability to do anything in alternatives are
there, 
(or even more capability or depth in some areas, -sometimes- more
performance in raw FPS, or sometimes not)
but similarly, if only the "speed of XSI" had to do with raw FPS, as
opposed to general "no-brainer-ism" or fixing things by merly
fiddling a little, or how in both time or requirements to get from A
to B in real life scenarios, can often be more efficient by like a
factor of 10
(without exaggeration), with little to no compromise in terms of
flexibility (mostly approachable).

In other words, in many fronts has XSI been the computer, and we've
been waiting for typewriters to first get lamps before getting
solid-state micro switchers.

Or creation in general in XSI -- like modeling?, rigging? shading?
scene/render management?  procedural process authoring? (all still
major parts of doing CG last time I checked) 
all remain comparatively quite a bit more intuitive, "direct", an
reliable.
(which I must admit may contribute to making XSI really comfortable)

And I think that will only change once exactly that situation would
considerably change.
(H v22? ... maybe?)
That, or once XSI would physically stop working, whichever comes
first (at this pace, it seems the latter would come first, while not
likely being anytime soon).

You know the old saying that "XSI has really good
  <>"
to this day relative to other solutions, we didn't know how good
Softimage "workflow" really was, until lots of us started to look at
other workflows.

In any event, you're an artist looking for jobs? learn what is the
most used out there.
If you're a shop or freelancer, and have the privilege and or
possibility of working with Soft while it's possible, -- apart that
you are benefiting from what is lined-up to be quite possibly if not
probably a one in a lifetime thing (or a one time only cumulative
combinations of things together at once), -- I think it's also
beneficial for the entire CG arena as it's already been to a quite
large degree, since keeping it alive also contributes to sustaining
what continues to be a definite reference, giving rise to all sorts
of constructive comparisons, ending-up being mostly around general
usability and around ... --workflow--.

Anyhoo, 
Cheers!
-J


  

--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

Re: Softimage - not going away...

>
> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”


That's a very opened ended statement but my own interpretation was that you
don't get very far in motion design without a good understanding of a DCC's
particle system and motion paths in general. On that basis the most obvious
comparison is the intuitive nature of Mograph and X-Particles in C4D to
Particles in Houdini. You won't get far in Houdini particle effects without
expressions at the least and Vex Wrangles to match some of the stock
effects in X-Particles. C4D & X-Particles both put intuitive UX front and
centre; the whole question/answer metaphor used in X-Particles is a UX tour
de force. When you couple that with the elegance of C4D's scene manager it
makes for a very intuitive workflow.

Houdini is without doubt the more powerful and flexible option, but C4D
enables a motion designer to get the task done faster and more intuitively.

On 27 October 2017 at 09:04, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini
> that are wrong or not quite there.
>
> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
>
> Jb
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini
> isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is
> that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact
> flavour of motion control you favour.
>
> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create
> bespoke tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>
> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful
>> as it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most
>> part in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out
>> at any time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think
>> that you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can
>> get with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with
>> Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to use
>> Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I
>> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some
>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain
>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>
>> *From:* Jonathan Moore
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=RfOkQ55SiagKNkAHAUMnzk7eSAgZ1xhf4NPRa-D-XIA=g0dOTDIPJ-fvvdzrm4132h8mIPs0jDWfMIfnard1_ZU=
>> /forum/#!forum/xsi_list
>> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>
>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff
>> in Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the
>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other
>> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long
>> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand
>> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who
>> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>>
>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn
>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working
>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the
>> cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite
>> is the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini,
>> a little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and
>> luckily the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread
>> friendly (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's
>> motion design tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so a suite of
>> tools in Houdini with similar capabilities, whilst being optimised for
>> fully threaded workflows will hopefully provide further encouragement for
>> motion artists to deepen their Houdini knowledge. ;)
>>
>> On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> No worries Jonathan..
>>>
>>> It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like thos

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Alex Doss

PS:
I always knew I would miss *a lot* that "middle click" feature on a menu to
repeat its last operation.
And the ability to zoom in on a camera view. (SHIFT+Z) on Softimage.
Basically, all the strongest "workflow tricks" that softimage has.


On 27 October 2017 at 10:45, Alex Doss <alexd...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi, I hope this time my post will make it to this list.
> As of now I have about 5 months of houdini experience. And I am totally in
> love with it, and love is growing by the minute.
> At this moment and personally, I feel the biggest fault in H is the UI
> real estate it seems to claim.
> As a Generalist/Td one has to access all aspects of a project during the
> course of a day. At the moment this is already fastidious.
> Way too many dives IN/OUT to have access a given param. Promoting is ok,
> but I consider it, to some extend, a waste of time since u have to "stop"
> to promote. And that doesnt usually place the param where u need it to be.
> (finger tips)
> Hou needs to improve VASTLY on filtering. (hello 16.5)
> Viewport Display filter (geometry, nulls, bones, curves, pointclouds, vdb,
> isolate selected (without scene interference) etc... )
> Tree view (Softimage explorer like) Urgently ! ( multi-selection, selected
> obj only, parameters only, takes, groups, material, stylesheets ,etc.. )
>
> Currently treeview has some filters i mentioned already in place, yet far
> from optimal. "Takes" have to be checked with a specialized  "treeview"
> like window. Thats quite similar to the obtuse "Mayan" approach. Aka 1
> editor per task. (Layer editor, Group editor, Take editor, StyleSheet
> editor )
>
> Blender has one really neat feature on its 'node view' where parameters
> are already exposed on the node's box:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__bensimonds.files.wordpress.com_2011_06_defocus-5Fe1.gif=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=j7Fek1CMAmp-pitj0OIJHRmXMbtXnBROvPPDoG56a88=Sc9c6FgXv6Kmc7RtrDIo5LAdHn5x7xC1ciakIz05aWc=
>
> So basically, I feel houdini's interface still remains too much on your
> face, as opposed to ur work. Granted Im only starting, but  that's my 2
> cents atm.
> Luv,
> Al.
>
>
>
>
>
> On 27 October 2017 at 10:04, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini
>> that are wrong or not quite there.
>>
>> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
>>
>> Jb
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in
>> Houdini isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer
>> answer is that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the
>> exact flavour of motion control you favour.
>>
>> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create
>> bespoke tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>>
>> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful
>>> as it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most
>>> part in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out
>>> at any time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think
>>> that you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can
>>> get with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with
>>> Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to use
>>> Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I
>>> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some
>>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain
>>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>>
>>> *From:* Jonathan Moore
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>>> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=j7Fek1CMAmp-pitj0OIJHRmXMbtXnBROvPPDoG56a88=feS6NZgMADaMrp6PBjqL_gX5haoEBAu3viWphsZ_Vzg=
>>> /forum/#!forum/xsi_list
>>> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>>
>>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff
>>> in

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-27 Thread Alex Doss

Hi, I hope this time my post will make it to this list.
As of now I have about 5 months of houdini experience. And I am totally in
love with it, and love is growing by the minute.
At this moment and personally, I feel the biggest fault in H is the UI real
estate it seems to claim.
As a Generalist/Td one has to access all aspects of a project during the
course of a day. At the moment this is already fastidious.
Way too many dives IN/OUT to have access a given param. Promoting is ok,
but I consider it, to some extend, a waste of time since u have to "stop"
to promote. And that doesnt usually place the param where u need it to be.
(finger tips)
Hou needs to improve VASTLY on filtering. (hello 16.5)
Viewport Display filter (geometry, nulls, bones, curves, pointclouds, vdb,
isolate selected (without scene interference) etc... )
Tree view (Softimage explorer like) Urgently ! ( multi-selection, selected
obj only, parameters only, takes, groups, material, stylesheets ,etc.. )

Currently treeview has some filters i mentioned already in place, yet far
from optimal. "Takes" have to be checked with a specialized  "treeview"
like window. Thats quite similar to the obtuse "Mayan" approach. Aka 1
editor per task. (Layer editor, Group editor, Take editor, StyleSheet
editor )

Blender has one really neat feature on its 'node view' where parameters are
already exposed on the node's box:
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__bensimonds.files.wordpress.com_2011_06_defocus-5Fe1.gif=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=Wd_RyGDz-lg9sFrxP9AaL7w8BRt4WRlf2KoPR3t7JKw=aFeQpnoXniNfBvpjRgkA7B8SqipiNq_YU_y5h5j32hk=

So basically, I feel houdini's interface still remains too much on your
face, as opposed to ur work. Granted Im only starting, but  that's my 2
cents atm.
Luv,
Al.

On 27 October 2017 at 10:04, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini
> that are wrong or not quite there.
>
> What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”
>
> Jb
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini
> isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is
> that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact
> flavour of motion control you favour.
>
> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create
> bespoke tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
>
> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful
>> as it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most
>> part in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out
>> at any time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think
>> that you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can
>> get with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with
>> Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to use
>> Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I
>> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some
>> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain
>> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>>
>> *From:* Jonathan Moore
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=Wd_RyGDz-lg9sFrxP9AaL7w8BRt4WRlf2KoPR3t7JKw=Uj1fm4e20gXXCIzSDZmB2MW2yj4mYOdBO8-kUqZBSQA=
>> /forum/#!forum/xsi_list
>> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>
>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff
>> in Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the
>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other
>> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long
>> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand
>> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who
>> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>>
>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn
>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working
>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houd

Re: Softimage - not going away...

I am very interested in understanding the things others see in Houdini that are 
wrong or not quite there.

What do you exactly mean by “control of motion”

Jb

Sent from my iPhone

> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:48, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini 
> isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is 
> that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact 
> flavour of motion control you favour.
> 
> Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create bespoke 
> tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.
> 
>> On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com> 
>> wrote:
>> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful as 
>> it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most part 
>> in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out at any 
>> time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think that 
>> you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can get with 
>> ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with Houdini.  I 
>> agree with others I would just assume continue to use Softimage/Ice, 
>> however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I have had problems 
>> like this with other programs where just recently some updates whether it be 
>> windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain things to crash, and 
>> has caused me great anxiety.
>>  
>> From: Jonathan Moore
>> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
>> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing 
>> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=HMenLmc1uNJ3rjPOyl1s4u5K9nSTxbps_xDuoTXndRQ=Cg7kGi-IltcalneHNg8GUnm6OAvxNw5Ox4JoLW6pLvs=
>> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>>  
>> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff in 
>> Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the 
>> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other 
>> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long 
>> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand 
>> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who 
>> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.  
>>  
>> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn 
>> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working 
>> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the 
>> cloners,  effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite 
>> is the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini, a 
>> little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and luckily 
>> the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread friendly 
>> (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's motion design 
>> tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so a suite of tools in 
>> Houdini with similar capabilities, whilst being optimised for fully threaded 
>> workflows will hopefully provide further encouragement for motion artists to 
>> deepen their Houdini knowledge. ;)
>>  
>>> On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> No worries Jonathan..
>>>  
>>> It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those coming 
>>> from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really are doing 
>>> amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an evolution in 
>>> the sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental for the type 
>>> of work they intend to do.
>>>  
>>> Anyway… good luck though
>>>  
>>> hugs
>>> jb
>>>  
>>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>  
>>>> I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over that 
>>>> way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full  featured 
>>>> end to end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out 
>>>> of a many artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive 
>>>> view of things but have come to realise there are many that don't share my 
>>

Re: Softimage - not going away...

If your field is motion graphics and nonVFX FX... well then it’s clear you have 
to accept a certain level of programming and maths and tinkering with the 
software and how is architected.

Very interesting to invest time on higher manipulation layer... look forward to 
see that. 

Jb

Sent from my iPhone

> On 27 Oct 2017, at 00:07, Jonathan Moore  wrote:
> 
> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff in 
> Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the 
> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other 
> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long 
> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand 
> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who 
> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
> 
> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn 
> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working 
> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the 
> cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite is 
> the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini, a 
> little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and luckily 
> the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread friendly 
> (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's motion design 
> tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so a suite of tools in Houdini 
> with similar capabilities, whilst being optimised for fully threaded 
> workflows will hopefully provide further encouragement for motion artists to 
> deepen their Houdini knowledge. ;)
> 
>> On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>> No worries Jonathan..
>> 
>> It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those coming 
>> from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really are doing 
>> amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an evolution in 
>> the sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental for the type 
>> of work they intend to do.
>> 
>> Anyway… good luck though
>> 
>> hugs
>> jb
>> 
>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over that 
>>> way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full featured end 
>>> to end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out of a 
>>> many artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive view of 
>>> things but have come to realise there are many that don't share my view.  :)
>>> 
>>> On 26 October 2017 at 19:29, Jordi Bares  wrote:
 Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact that 
 everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based 
 approaches but may be outside is not so obvious.
 
 I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
 jb
 
 
> On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore  
> wrote:
> 
> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I support. 
> Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical.
> 
> You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have to 
> be considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.
> 
>> On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>> Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you 
>> need those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others 
>> that you might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract 
>> motion graphics for example)
>> 
>> Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although 
>> they are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you 
>> were able to do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good 
>> example is the new Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.
>> 
>> I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX 
>> animation), Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need 
>> Zero skills.
>> 
>> But may be I am missing something.
>> jb
>> 
>> 
 On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore  
 wrote:
 
 The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, 
 same thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more 
 viewport centric approach makes it very easy to start.
 True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but 
 those come easy if you really go for it.
>>> 
>>> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy

Re: Softimage - not going away...

The short answer to your question Phil is no. Control of motion in Houdini
isn't as easy or intuitive as it is with XSI/ICE. But the longer answer is
that you can easily build bespoke tools in Houdini to provide the exact
flavour of motion control you favour.

Houdini gives you less out of the box but it's far easier to create bespoke
tools in Houdini than with any other DCC.

On 27 October 2017 at 00:18, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
wrote:

> I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful
> as it is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most
> part in ice, create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out
> at any time, and apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think
> that you do much of this in C4D but without the complete control you can
> get with ICE, however I wonder if the same ease of creation is there with
> Houdini.  I agree with others I would just assume continue to use
> Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I
> have had problems like this with other programs where just recently some
> updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, have caused certain
> things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.
>
> *From:* Jonathan Moore
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing 
> List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=hvMxNLrxbGvnjCDu0opRaYW9bNDSFhqs6TZ0ddqx5Rk=oJZWcZRo_KTgxFHUjlxdjqQPhJBlkm-5rcl6Dp9Qwn0=.
> com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
> Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff in
> Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the
> Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other
> was skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long
> before he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand
> is a great example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who
> rapidly adapted to using Houdini as his main platform.
>
> Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn
> Houdini, but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working
> with others on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the
> cloners, effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite
> is the easy part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini,
> a little harder! But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and
> luckily the v16 release cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread
> friendly (e.g. the Copy and Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's
> motion design tools are throttled by a single threaded core, so a suite of
> tools in Houdini with similar capabilities, whilst being optimised for
> fully threaded workflows will hopefully provide further encouragement for
> motion artists to deepen their Houdini knowledge. ;)
>
> On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> No worries Jonathan..
>>
>> It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those
>> coming from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really are
>> doing amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an
>> evolution in the sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental
>> for the type of work they intend to do.
>>
>> Anyway… good luck though
>>
>> hugs
>> jb
>>
>>
>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over that
>> way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full featured end
>> to end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out of a
>> many artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive view of
>> things but have come to realise there are many that don't share my view.  :)
>>
>> On 26 October 2017 at 19:29, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact
>>> that everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based
>>> approaches but may be outside is not so obvious.
>>>
>>> I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
>>> jb
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread phil harbath

I would be interested to know if Motion Creation is as easy and powerful as it 
is in ICE,  I can find I can do whatever I want to do for the most part in ice, 
create point clouds in most any fashion, pop them in and out at any time, and 
apply animated colors to them as I see fit,  I would think that you do much of 
this in C4D but without the complete control you can get with ICE, however I 
wonder if the same ease of creation is there with Houdini.  I agree with others 
I would just assume continue to use Softimage/Ice, however, I worry about the 
day, Soft just doesn’t open.  I have had problems like this with other programs 
where just recently some updates whether it be windows 10 or the video drivers, 
have caused certain things to crash, and has caused me great anxiety.

From: Jonathan Moore 
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 7:07 PM
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing 
List.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=ZdkZahgcGpF7AcCYLN6bpeJvGhb5646aVqvMp9i6OJk=gc1xHlmwhFGWaRk4lH-PJAcFTfu0glRcoRVAZwWhQPw=
 
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Those coming from the likes C4D and After Effects doing wonderful stuff in 
Houdini were in many cases already technical artists. One of the 
Aixsponza/Entagma boys (Manuel) started out in XSI as it happens, the other was 
skilled in Processing (Moritz). And Simon Holmedal was a math nerd long before 
he gazed eyes on C4D, never mind Houdini. Ben Watt on the other hand is a great 
example of a C4D artist not used to technical workflows who rapidly adapted to 
using Houdini as his main platform. 

Motion design is my thing and I encourage any artists I know to learn Houdini, 
but sadly for some, things don't click. At the moment I'm working with others 
on a Mograph/MASH type suite of tools for Houdini. Creating the cloners, 
effectors and falloffs of a typical motion graphics plugin suite is the easy 
part, making it a 'gateway drug' into the delights of Houdini, a little harder! 
But we feel one of the major hooks is performance and luckily the v16 release 
cycle has seen critical SOP nodes become thread friendly (e.g. the Copy and 
Point SOP's for starters). C4D and Maya's motion design tools are throttled by 
a single threaded core, so a suite of tools in Houdini with similar 
capabilities, whilst being optimised for fully threaded workflows will 
hopefully provide further encouragement for motion artists to deepen their 
Houdini knowledge. ;)

On 26 October 2017 at 21:30, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:

  No worries Jonathan.. 

  It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those coming 
from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really are doing 
amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an evolution in the 
sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental for the type of work 
they intend to do.

  Anyway… good luck though

  hugs
  jb

On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> wrote:

I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over that 
way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full featured end to 
end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out of a many 
artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive view of things 
but have come to realise there are many that don't share my view.  :)

On 26 October 2017 at 19:29, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:

  Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact 
that everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based 
approaches but may be outside is not so obvious.

  I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
  jb


On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> 
wrote:

Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I 
support. Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical. 

You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have 
to be considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.

On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:

  Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where 
you need those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that 
you might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion graphics 
for example)

  Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although 
they are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were able 
to do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is the new 
Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.

  I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX 
animation), Layout

Re: Softimage - not going away...

No worries Jonathan..

It is nevertheless interesting that non-technical artists like those coming 
from C4D and AfterEffects are jumping on Houdini and some really are doing 
amazing work the like we haven’t seen so may be it will be an evolution in the 
sense that understanding the processes may be fundamental for the type of work 
they intend to do.

Anyway… good luck though

hugs
jb

> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:41, Jonathan Moore  wrote:
> 
> I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over that 
> way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full featured end to 
> end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out of a many 
> artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive view of things 
> but have come to realise there are many that don't share my view.  :)
> 
> On 26 October 2017 at 19:29, Jordi Bares  > wrote:
> Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact that 
> everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based 
> approaches but may be outside is not so obvious.
> 
> I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
> jb
> 
> 
>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore > > wrote:
>> 
>> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I support. 
>> Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical.
>> 
>> You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have to be 
>> considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.
>> 
>> On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares > > wrote:
>> Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you 
>> need those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that 
>> you might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion 
>> graphics for example)
>> 
>> Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although they 
>> are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were able to 
>> do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is the new 
>> Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.
>> 
>> I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX animation), 
>> Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need Zero skills.
>> 
>> But may be I am missing something.
>> jb
>> 
>> 
>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same 
>>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport 
>>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those 
>>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>> 
>>> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for 
>>> technical artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as 
>>> well as technical artists and those with a fine art background even found 
>>> ICE a challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this 
>>> isn't a major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is 
>>> Wrangle-centric these days causes problems for those with a purely art 
>>> school background who don't know their way around a scripting language, 
>>> never mind a C-like programming language.
>>> 
>>> I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true to 
>>> say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those 
>>> with a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at 
>>> the very least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that 
>>> stick to VOP's rather than Wrangles.
>>> 
>>> One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are plenty 
>>> of professionals working in media & entertainment based studio businesses 
>>> that get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting & programming. 
>>> Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's difficult to 
>>> get past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares >> > wrote:
>>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same 
>>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport 
>>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>> 
>>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those 
>>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>> 
>>> :)
>>> 
>>> jb
>>> 
>>> 
>>> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy >> > > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have 
>>> > actually looked

Re: Softimage - not going away...

I wasn't intending to pick holes Jordi, so apologies if it came over that
way. But yes, be it nodal shading, nodal compositing or full featured end
to end procedural modeling and animation; nodes scare the bejesus out of a
many artists. Personally, I find nodes a more visually descriptive view of
things but have come to realise there are many that don't share my view.  :)

On 26 October 2017 at 19:29, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact that
> everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based
> approaches but may be outside is not so obvious.
>
> I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
> jb
>
>
> On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore 
> wrote:
>
> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I support.
> Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical.
>
> You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have to
> be considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.
>
> On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>
>> Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you
>> need those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that
>> you might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion
>> graphics for example)
>>
>> Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although
>> they are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were
>> able to do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is
>> the new Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.
>>
>> I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX
>> animation), Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need
>> Zero skills.
>>
>> But may be I am missing something.
>> jb
>>
>>
>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore 
>> wrote:
>>
>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
>>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
>>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
>>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>
>>
>> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for
>> technical artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as
>> well as technical artists and those with a fine art background even found
>> ICE a challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this
>> isn't a major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is
>> Wrangle-centric these days causes problems for those with a purely art
>> school background who don't know their way around a scripting language,
>> never mind a C-like programming language.
>>
>> I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true
>> to say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those
>> with a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at
>> the very least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that
>> stick to VOP's rather than Wrangles.
>>
>> One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are
>> plenty of professionals working in media & entertainment based studio
>> businesses that get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting &
>> programming. Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's
>> difficult to get past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>>
>>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
>>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
>>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>>
>>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
>>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>>
>>> :)
>>>
>>> jb
>>>
>>>
>>> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have
>>> actually looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also
>>> very much depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
>>> >
>>> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is
>>> also certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
>>> >
>>> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down
>>> and try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so
>>> downtime is considerable.
>>> >
>>> > MB
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel <
>>> nagv...@gmail.com>:
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to
>>> learn Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
>>> some. After 3 months+ of

Re: Softimage - not going away...

Indeed you are right, I probably have a skewed vision due to the fact that 
everyone is now exposed to Nuke (and here XSI) which have node based approaches 
but may be outside is not so obvious.

I hope you have fun though.  ;-)
jb


> On 26 Oct 2017, at 18:44, Jonathan Moore  wrote:
> 
> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I support. 
> Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical.
> 
> You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have to be 
> considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.
> 
> On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares  > wrote:
> Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you need 
> those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that you 
> might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion graphics 
> for example)
> 
> Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although they 
> are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were able to 
> do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is the new 
> Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.
> 
> I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX animation), 
> Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need Zero skills.
> 
> But may be I am missing something.
> jb
> 
> 
>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore > > wrote:
>> 
>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same 
>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport 
>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those come 
>> easy if you really go for it.
>> 
>> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for 
>> technical artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as 
>> well as technical artists and those with a fine art background even found 
>> ICE a challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this 
>> isn't a major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is Wrangle-centric 
>> these days causes problems for those with a purely art school background who 
>> don't know their way around a scripting language, never mind a C-like 
>> programming language.
>> 
>> I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true to 
>> say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those with 
>> a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at the very 
>> least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that stick to 
>> VOP's rather than Wrangles.
>> 
>> One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are plenty 
>> of professionals working in media & entertainment based studio businesses 
>> that get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting & programming. 
>> Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's difficult to get 
>> past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares > > wrote:
>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same 
>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport 
>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>> 
>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those come 
>> easy if you really go for it.
>> 
>> :)
>> 
>> jb
>> 
>> 
>> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy > > > wrote:
>> >
>> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have actually 
>> > looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also very much 
>> > depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
>> >
>> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is also 
>> > certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
>> >
>> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and 
>> > try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so 
>> > downtime is considerable.
>> >
>> > MB
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel > >> >:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn 
>> >>> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then 
>> >>> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like 
>> >>> some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the 
>> >>> viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are 
>> >>> blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could have been if 
>> >>> things had

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread skuby

Different software for different tasks and just pick the best Software
available at the time, total compartmentalization.

example ( / slashes = "or" )

Modeling (Softimage/Blender +Marvelous Deisgner) Sculpting
(Mudbox/ZBrush/Blender) Retopo (ZBrush/Houdini) UV's (semi-automated via
Houdini) Painting (Mudbox/Substance) Rigging+Animation (Houdini/Akeytsu)
everything else i.e. Shading/Lighting/Hair/Dynamics/etc. (Houdini/Unreal
Engine 4 + Add-ons)

There will never be a replacement for Softimage and what it meant to us.
The above example is at least a high quality replacement for modern times,
fully powerful and optimized for each individual task and you can always
swap out a part or add in an extra piece.

On Thu, Oct 26, 2017 at 11:01 PM, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>
> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
> come easy if you really go for it.
>
> :)
>
> jb
>
>
> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy  wrote:
> >
> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have
> actually looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also
> very much depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
> >
> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is
> also certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
> >
> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and
> try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so
> downtime is considerable.
> >
> > MB
> >
> >
> >
> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel <
> nagv...@gmail.com>:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some.
> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some
> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the
> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to
> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Morten
> >>
> >> If you read on, the story splits.
> >> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
> >> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
> >> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
> >> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
> >> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
> >> G
> >>
> >> --
> >> Softimage Mailing List.
> >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread kenny wood

Only problem I have with Houdini is the slow viewport subdivision display
...otherwise I would use it for modelling aswell

On 26 Oct 2017 19:44, "Jonathan Moore"  wrote:

> Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I support.
> Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical.
>
> You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have to
> be considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.
>
> On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>
>> Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you
>> need those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that
>> you might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion
>> graphics for example)
>>
>> Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although
>> they are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were
>> able to do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is
>> the new Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.
>>
>> I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX
>> animation), Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need
>> Zero skills.
>>
>> But may be I am missing something.
>> jb
>>
>>
>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore 
>> wrote:
>>
>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
>>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
>>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
>>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>
>>
>> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for
>> technical artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as
>> well as technical artists and those with a fine art background even found
>> ICE a challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this
>> isn't a major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is
>> Wrangle-centric these days causes problems for those with a purely art
>> school background who don't know their way around a scripting language,
>> never mind a C-like programming language.
>>
>> I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true
>> to say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those
>> with a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at
>> the very least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that
>> stick to VOP's rather than Wrangles.
>>
>> One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are
>> plenty of professionals working in media & entertainment based studio
>> businesses that get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting &
>> programming. Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's
>> difficult to get past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>>
>>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
>>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
>>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>>
>>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
>>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>>
>>> :)
>>>
>>> jb
>>>
>>>
>>> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have
>>> actually looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also
>>> very much depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
>>> >
>>> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is
>>> also certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
>>> >
>>> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down
>>> and try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so
>>> downtime is considerable.
>>> >
>>> > MB
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel <
>>> nagv...@gmail.com>:
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to
>>> learn Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
>>> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some
>>> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the
>>> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to
>>> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Morten
>>> >>
>>> >> If you read on, the story splits.
>>> >> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
>>> >> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
>>> >> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
>>> >> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
>>> >> Why not Houdini

Re: Softimage - not going away...

Jordi, I'm only recounting the feedback I get from the artists I support.
Some of these artists find nodal approaches per se as being technical.

You, I and most on this list know this not to be the case, but we have to
be considerate that not all artists are wired the same as us.

On 26 October 2017 at 18:13, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you
> need those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that
> you might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion
> graphics for example)
>
> Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although they
> are awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were able
> to do anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is the
> new Point Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.
>
> I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX
> animation), Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need
> Zero skills.
>
> But may be I am missing something.
> jb
>
>
> On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore 
> wrote:
>
> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
>> come easy if you really go for it.
>
>
> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for
> technical artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as
> well as technical artists and those with a fine art background even found
> ICE a challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this
> isn't a major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is
> Wrangle-centric these days causes problems for those with a purely art
> school background who don't know their way around a scripting language,
> never mind a C-like programming language.
>
> I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true to
> say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those
> with a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at
> the very least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that
> stick to VOP's rather than Wrangles.
>
> One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are plenty
> of professionals working in media & entertainment based studio businesses
> that get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting & programming.
> Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's difficult to
> get past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.
>
>
>
>
>
> On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares  wrote:
>
>> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
>> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
>> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>>
>> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
>> come easy if you really go for it.
>>
>> :)
>>
>> jb
>>
>>
>> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy  wrote:
>> >
>> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have
>> actually looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also
>> very much depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
>> >
>> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is
>> also certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
>> >
>> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and
>> try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so
>> downtime is considerable.
>> >
>> > MB
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel <
>> nagv...@gmail.com>:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
>> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some.
>> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some
>> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the
>> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to
>> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Morten
>> >>
>> >> If you read on, the story splits.
>> >> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
>> >> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
>> >> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
>> >> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
>> >> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
>> >> G
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Softimage Mailing List.
>> >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>> > --
>> > Softimage Mailing List.
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

Could you give me an example of various stages of a production where you need 
those skills? I can only see a few places where you do and others that you 
might if you want to do complex stuff (like modern abstract motion graphics for 
example)

Let’s also remember, only recently we have Wrangle nodes and although they are 
awesome, you didn’t even have them a few years back yet you were able to do 
anything (slower of course) in other manners. A good example is the new Point 
Wrangle versus the old Point SOP.

I still think for Previz, Modelling, Animation (not technical FX animation), 
Layout, Shading, Texturing, Lighting and Rendering you need Zero skills.

But may be I am missing something.
jb


> On 26 Oct 2017, at 17:29, Jonathan Moore  wrote:
> 
> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same thing 
> here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport centric 
> approach makes it very easy to start.
> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those come 
> easy if you really go for it.
> 
> I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for technical 
> artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as well as 
> technical artists and those with a fine art background even found ICE a 
> challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this isn't a 
> major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is Wrangle-centric these 
> days causes problems for those with a purely art school background who don't 
> know their way around a scripting language, never mind a C-like programming 
> language.
> 
> I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true to 
> say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those with 
> a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at the very 
> least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that stick to 
> VOP's rather than Wrangles.
> 
> One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are plenty of 
> professionals working in media & entertainment based studio businesses that 
> get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting & programming. 
> Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's difficult to get 
> past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares  > wrote:
> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same thing 
> here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport centric 
> approach makes it very easy to start.
> 
> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those come 
> easy if you really go for it.
> 
> :)
> 
> jb
> 
> 
> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy  > > wrote:
> >
> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have actually 
> > looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also very much 
> > depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
> >
> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is also 
> > certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
> >
> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and try 
> > and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so 
> > downtime is considerable.
> >
> > MB
> >
> >
> >
> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel  >> >:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn 
> >>> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then 
> >>> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like 
> >>> some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the 
> >>> viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are 
> >>> blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could have been if 
> >>> things had been different.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Morten
> >>
> >> If you read on, the story splits.
> >> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
> >> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
> >> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
> >> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
> >> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
> >> G
> >>
> >> --
> >> Softimage Mailing List.
> >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com 
> >>  with "unsubscribe" in the 
> >> subject, and reply to confirm.
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com 
> >  with "unsubscribe" in the 
> > subject, and reply to confirm.
> 
> 
> --
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> To unsubscribe, send a mail to

Re: Softimage - not going away...

>
> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
> come easy if you really go for it.

I say this as a Houdini fan. Houdini is only an easy transition for
technical artists. I support teams of artists from fine art backgrounds as
well as technical artists and those with a fine art background even found
ICE a challenge. For larger teams made up of both TD's and artists this
isn't a major issue, but the fact that so much of Houdini is
Wrangle-centric these days causes problems for those with a purely art
school background who don't know their way around a scripting language,
never mind a C-like programming language.

I think it's untrue to say 'Houdini is not hard anymore', but more true to
say that Houdini is easier to transition to from another DCC (for those
with a technical aptitude). You won't get far in Houdini if you can't at
the very least think programmatically, and that still goes for those that
stick to VOP's rather than Wrangles.

One can argue that 3d is an inherently technical art, but there are plenty
of professionals working in media & entertainment based studio businesses
that get by just fine without any aptitude for scripting & programming.
Unfortunately, I don't think it's untrue to state that it's difficult to
get past the basics in Houdini without a technical aptitude.

On 26 October 2017 at 17:01, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same
> thing here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport
> centric approach makes it very easy to start.
>
> True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those
> come easy if you really go for it.
>
> :)
>
> jb
>
>
> > On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy  wrote:
> >
> > Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have
> actually looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also
> very much depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
> >
> > Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is
> also certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
> >
> > Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and
> try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so
> downtime is considerable.
> >
> > MB
> >
> >
> >
> >> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel <
> nagv...@gmail.com>:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some.
> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some
> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the
> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to
> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Morten
> >>
> >> If you read on, the story splits.
> >> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
> >> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
> >> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
> >> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
> >> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
> >> G
> >>
> >> --
> >> Softimage Mailing List.
> >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

The only way to learn a language well is to fully immerse into it, same thing 
here… Houdini is not hard any more, UX and specially a more viewport centric 
approach makes it very easy to start.

True there is some vocabulary and weird things in a few areas but those come 
easy if you really go for it.

:)

jb


> On 26 Oct 2017, at 16:07, Morten Bartholdy  wrote:
> 
> Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have actually 
> looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also very much 
> depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
> 
> Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is also 
> certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
> 
> Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and try 
> and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so downtime 
> is considerable.
> 
> MB
> 
> 
> 
>> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel :
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn Maya 
>>> earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some. 
>>> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some 
>>> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the 
>>> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to 
>>> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Morten
>> 
>> If you read on, the story splits.
>> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
>> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
>> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
>> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
>> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
>> G
>> 
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
>> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.


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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread Mathieu Leclaire

Houdini is not that hard to use... What's difficult is learning their 
nomenclature. They use very different terminology from other 3D 
softwares and that makes it hard to find the tools you are looking for. 
Once you learned what all these new terms are, it becomes so easy to 
work with.

It's a little different the way it all works, but it makes it so 
powerful once you wrap your head around it. But I understand how an 
artist who just want to pick up the software and start working without 
thinking too much can be intimidated by Houdini. It's very confusing at 
first. It is an investment to learn it, but one that pays off immensely 
afterwards. But it's OK if you don't want to go down that road too. 
Houdini is not for everyone. If it was, we would have deployed it in 
every department, but we haven't done that. A lot of tools are much more 
user friendly. It's up to you to decide if you prefer ease of use with 
clear limitations or learn something a little more complex but that has 
immense power and flexibility.

On 26/10/2017 11:07 AM, Morten Bartholdy wrote:
> Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have actually 
> looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also very much 
> depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
>
> Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is also 
> certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
>
> Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and try 
> and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so downtime 
> is considerable.
>
> MB
>
>
>
>> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel :
>>
>>
>>
>>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn Maya 
>>> earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some. 
>>> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some 
>>> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the 
>>> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to 
>>> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
>>>
>>>
>>> Morten
>> If you read on, the story splits.
>> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
>> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
>> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
>> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
>> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
>> G
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
>> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>

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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread Enter Reality

For technical reasons I had to switch to Maya, but I'm still pretty bad
with modeling ( tools looks like a plugin on top of a plugin on top of
another plugin ), and for animation I switched to Motion Builders, since
all the characters I'm working on are humans with a pretty standard rig (
except for the facial rig, which is done by Morph targets ).

I still rely on XSI for modeling and fast prototyping in general, but due
to the projects I'm working on I basically switched to Unreal Engine 4 for
animation and simulations, also having custom version of the engine
combined with the nVidia technology ( VXGI and Flex above all ), so I've
transfered the little ICE knowledge I had by using the Blueprint system in
UE4, and oh my, I'm creating some neat stuff there using a very intuitive
workflow.

UE4 won't replace XSI or any kind of modeling DCC any time soon, but the
XSI+UE4 combination allows me to use Maya as little as possible, because
I'm sick of all the crashes ( both on standard and Lite version ) and
overall workflow.

2017-10-26 17:07 GMT+02:00 Morten Bartholdy :

> Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have actually
> looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also very much
> depends on where you are working or aspire to work.
>
> Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is also
> certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.
>
> Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and
> try and learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so
> downtime is considerable.
>
> MB
>
>
>
> > Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel  >:
> >
> >
> >
> > > I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some.
> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some
> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the
> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to
> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
> > >
> > >
> > > Morten
> >
> > If you read on, the story splits.
> > Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
> > Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
> > Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
> > Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
> > Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
> > G
> >
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread Morten Bartholdy

Houdini is still to technical to even start using. Blender I have actually 
looked at and it doesn't look half as bad as Maya, but it also very much 
depends on where you are working or aspire to work.

Maya is a ticket to work in most places these days I guess, but it is also 
certain to drive you mad, and hate going to work everyday.

Honestly I would love to work with Houdini, and might even sit down and try and 
learn it some day, but it is still damn hard to start using, so downtime is 
considerable.

MB



> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 14:53 skrev Gerbrand Nel :
> 
> 
> 
> > I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn Maya 
> > earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some. 
> > After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some 
> > modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the 
> > rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to 
> > how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
> >
> >
> > Morten
> 
> If you read on, the story splits.
> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
> G
> 
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread Morten Bartholdy

I very much agree with the sentiment that we need to move on for various good 
reasons. The problem is there still are no really good alternatives to XSI 
available.

Houdini certainly looks like it will inherit the world at some point, if they 
manage to get character work down, make the UI even more accessible, and a few 
other things perhaps. 16.5 looks incredible, but it is still prohibitive to 
start to learn for non technical artists.

Maya is a horrible mess - I fail to understand how anyone could ever consider 
it twice for serious production. It must be down to number of legacy 
installations and the size of the userbase, edu situation and availability of 
artists, because if I were to advise someone setting up shop now I would 
strongly advise against it, for reasons most people here probably agree with, 
one of them being it is from Autodesk. This is not (just) a serious dislike of 
them. I consider them to be a very unstable software vendor.

I don't see anyone mentioning Cinema 4D here - any thoughts? Is it not really 
there for character work or  pipeline work, or what is it? I have read many 
good things about it, also from XSI people who have transitioned. Powerful, 
rocksolid, easier to use than XSI in some aspects, and a UI that actually makes 
sense. And - it is not Autodesk.

I do like learning new stuff, but hate it when it is worse than what I come 
from, and Maya is driving me insane very fast.

Best
Morten

> Den 25. oktober 2017 klokken 23:34 skrev Jonathan Moore 
> <jonathan.moo...@gmail.com>:
> 
> 
> I was told by the Animal Logic boys that they only made the move over to
> Maya from XSI on the latest Lego show, but even then XSI had to be retained
> for a number of shots.
> 
> I can't see the harm in using XSI for specific reasons (as long as chief
> amongst those reasons isn't nostalgia).
> 
> There seems to be a consensus in this thread (and the multitude of others
> like it) ref growing your knowledge with regards to alternative options.
> That's the main thing that's important. When we're in our late teens/early
> twenties, the best quality we have is open mindedness. Keep that middle
> aged 'been there, seen it, done it' attitude at bay and there's plenty of
> ways of transitioning on with grace. ;)
> 
> On 25 October 2017 at 22:20, Sven Constable <sixsi_l...@imagefront.de>
> wrote:
> 
> > The thing is, you don't have to be freaking amazing to be competitive with
> > XSI. In fact you can easily compete, taking a break and playing banjo while
> > doing the work. Maybe not in vfx but with usual 3d.
> >
> >
> >
> > *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-bounces@
> > listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Mathieu Leclaire
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:02 PM
> >
> > *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
> > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oGDNgAaiMwEiQ-vQftI9VW4PykRgog6IwH09oHGQHdc=BUhHPUR9_jcH4XXM9tIEX9om2E-fLMCDPO1YZp9X0Y0=
> > forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> > *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
> >
> >
> >
> > I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is using
> > nail guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids can do the
> > job 100x faster then you can, why would they hire you instead? I'm not
> > saying you can't do a good job with a hammer, but it'll take more time so
> > you'll need to charge more money to compensate. You better make sure you're
> > freaking amazing with that hammer if you want them to come back to you.
> >
> > On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:
> >
> > Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship
> > with a person…
> >
> > There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and
> > nails. There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a
> > tool. Whatever gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard
> > comparing a hammer with a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and
> > whatever you do, even art can be made with the defunct Microsoft Paint.
> > Whatever floats your boat. When it comes to productions, whatever gets the
> > job done in time too is valid as anything else superior or not.
> >
> >
> > Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still
> > is the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in
> > one, rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination
> > with fabric engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand
> > artistry so

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-26 Thread Mirko Jankovic

GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aOu3WXAtDZ3O7Fzt-xVuVkRS1BmTU7nk0dhBBmrCaV8=LFzndMEkAw6_AcbJeZFmB65Ankm3YV2rh5bvJbqFCMk=
> forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> *Subject: *Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
>
>
> I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is using
> nail guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids can do the
> job 100x faster then you can, why would they hire you instead? I'm not
> saying you can't do a good job with a hammer, but it'll take more time so
> you'll need to charge more money to compensate. You better make sure you're
> freaking amazing with that hammer if you want them to come back to you.
>
> On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:
>
> Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship
> with a person…
>
> There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and
> nails. There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a
> tool. Whatever gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard
> comparing a hammer with a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and
> whatever you do, even art can be made with the defunct Microsoft Paint.
> Whatever floats your boat. When it comes to productions, whatever gets the
> job done in time too is valid as anything else superior or not.
>
>
> Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still
> is the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in
> one, rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination
> with fabric engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand
> artistry sometimes) in Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base
> workflows, realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things
> fading away, has OBJ died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and
> the 3D workflow will fade so quickly as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t
> become obsolete today…
>
> I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for it’s
> unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years later,
> 32bit, still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree, with a
> directX9 viewport, updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport that
> handles more polygons than Blender at the moment. It’s old, retro, but
> maybe the near future that will be a thing – as much as 8bit games are a
> thing, like hand brew coffee, microbrewery beer and vinly DJ’s.
>
> Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be in an
> industry standard to survive.
>
> And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving and
> developing (and having to learn over and over again as things revamp,
> modifies and improves) to be free to  focus on the art and story… Just a
> thought.
>
> -Draise
>
>
>
> *From: *Mathieu Leclaire <mlecl...@hybride.com>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:43
> *To: *Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=aOu3WXAtDZ3O7Fzt-xVuVkRS1BmTU7nk0dhBBmrCaV8=LFzndMEkAw6_AcbJeZFmB65Ankm3YV2rh5bvJbqFCMk=
> forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> *Subject: *Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
>
>
> Hi guys,
>
> I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
> offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
> by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:
>
> I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
> industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
> still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
> handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
> will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
> support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
> current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
> you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
> you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
> relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
> the outside looking in.
>
> I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
> But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
> with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
> love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.
>
> Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
> lot here at Hybride, but we

RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Andres Stephens

Yeah.. you’d need to be pretty skilled with whatever tool you have to do the 
art and make business. As in everywhere... anywhere. And it is a rule of the 
digital art game, always improve your skills, don’t stop. No?

Concerning being hired with old software, if you have a great style, a good 
productive workflow and a great showcase – anything that looks different goes a 
long way, like the Lego movies or Samuri Jack.

If the nailgun was better than the hammer as if it were always the better 
choice, hand drawn 2D films and cartoons would be certainly left in the past, 
but they are not. People still hand-draw and do stopmotion, and those 
productions have similar turnover schedules as 3D and digital cutout 
productions. It just aesthetically works on it’s own merit... it’s not the tool 
itself, but the skill (and story) put into it... Indeed time is a big factor to 
being hired, getting work, etc, it may also be a competing edge, and always, 
quality = time (divided by talent count multiplying cost), and good stories and 
good art take time, regardless of the tool, quality will always take time, 
either to learn, to study and master the tool, or to put in enough hours to do 
a good job, with or without the good or bad tools.

And if you have less time use burned to churn out trillions of polygons that 
morph into each other, where else should the extra time be put into? I agree... 
that it should always be invested in time for mastering your skills for the 
stories and art communicated with the work from where you’re at and where you 
want to be in style. Though this should also remain true as software agnostic.

I do use Si for some short deadlines, but I like learning Unreal Engine, 
starting to use it in production, through rendering in realtime and all that it 
offers, learning Bforartists, a nicer easier version of Blender, most of my 
work, including in studio and independent is in Blender, and mainly I put my 
earnings in equipment instead of new software to hire more creative artistic 
seats with opensource and free and fast developing software...

-Draise

From: Mathieu Leclaire<mailto:mlecl...@hybride.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 16:09
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIGaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=TmRdiWvTN6QxuXia96c28dCX7DLuz6e53x9dT5inds4=1BaJiGJyVVOu5B0CDaMO2yAFPp91BC623yb8rauFCTs=<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is using nail 
guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids can do the job 100x 
faster then you can, why would they hire you instead? I'm not saying you can't 
do a good job with a hammer, but it'll take more time so you'll need to charge 
more money to compensate. You better make sure you're freaking amazing with 
that hammer if you want them to come back to you.

On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:
Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship with a 
person…

There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and nails. 
There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a tool. Whatever 
gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard comparing a hammer with 
a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and whatever you do, even art can be 
made with the defunct Microsoft Paint. Whatever floats your boat. When it comes 
to productions, whatever gets the job done in time too is valid as anything 
else superior or not.

Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still is 
the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in one, 
rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination with fabric 
engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand artistry 
sometimes) in Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base workflows, 
realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things fading away, has OBJ 
died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and the 3D workflow will fade 
so quickly as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t become obsolete today…

I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for it’s 
unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years later, 32bit, 
still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree, with a directX9 viewport, 
updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport that handles more polygons than 
Blender at the moment. It’s old, retro, but maybe the near future that will be 
a thing – as much as 8bit games are a thing, like hand brew coffee, 
microbrewery beer and vinly DJ’s.

Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be in an 
industry standard to survive.

And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving and

Re: Softimage - not going away...

For now, sure. ...and that's my point. Now Softimage is still
competitive for most scenarios, but all the others are evolving while
Softimage is locked in time.

You can probably stay competitive with it for a few more years, but the
day will come where the number of scenarios this is true will
drastically shrink. Clients will start asking for you to handle scenes
with millions of objects that weight billions of polygons... or maybe it
won't even be polygons anymore. There will be this new geometry format
that everyone has switched over because you can do amazingly complex
things with it, but Softimage won't be able to manage that. Imagine
Softimage can only do nurbs while all other softwares have adopted
polygons. Who knows what new technology is around the corner, but you'll
never have access to it. How long would you think you can stay
competitive working with outdated technology?

Then you will have to turn down that contract, and then more contracts
and eventually you'll barely have any more contracts. Then you'll have
to learn a new tool and you'll have years of new technologies to
familiarize yourself with. The learning curve will be incredibly more
steep and you might need to go back to school to learn all that stuff
you should have learned years ago.

All I am saying is to look farther then the next couple gigs and prepare
yourself for the future. Now I don't care if you want to stick with
Softimage as long as you can. That's your choice. Sooner or later,
reality will catch up to you. You won't be able to compete with everyone
else. You'll have no choice but to learn these new tools to become
competitive again and you will simply have that much more work to do to
get back up to speed on the new tools currently available. You can wait
until your back is against the wall or you can prepare yourself by
slowly learning new tools and staying up to date with what's available.

On 25/10/2017 5:20 PM, Sven Constable wrote:

The thing is, you don't have to be freaking amazing to be competitive
with XSI. In fact you can easily compete, taking a break and playing
banjo while doing the work. Maybe not in vfx but with usual 3d.

*From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of
*Mathieu Leclaire

*Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:02 PM
*To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=RoNi5IeEHwl7kyWd6s1oiwvah-3eIVL1xhRX2sNW3uk=UTMK4Vx73y_8hRYT4uW65L9Yah6uMXr3fIKfqyhrQU0=

*Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...

I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is
using nail guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids
can do the job 100x faster then you can, why would they hire you
instead? I'm not saying you can't do a good job with a hammer, but
it'll take more time so you'll need to charge more money to
compensate. You better make sure you're freaking amazing with that
hammer if you want them to come back to you.

On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:

Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a
relationship with a person…

There still are very efficient people building houses out of
hammers and nails. There still are capable artists using paint and
brushes. It’s a tool. Whatever gets the job done. And yes,
eventually it will be hard comparing a hammer with a nail gun –
but for the sake of the art and whatever you do, even art can be
made with the defunct Microsoft Paint. Whatever floats your boat.
When it comes to productions, whatever gets the job done in time
too is valid as anything else superior or not.

Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think
polyamory still is the name of the game. A harmonious relationship
of many. Sculpting in one, rendering in another, animation in
another, even cross pollination with fabric engine, proceduralism
(which isn’t always great for hard hand artistry sometimes) in
Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base workflows,
realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things fading
away, has OBJ died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and
the 3D workflow will fade so quickly as much as the hammer and
nail hasn’t become obsolete today…

I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace
for it’s unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9
years later, 32bit, still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a
degree, with a directX9 viewport, updated FBX exporter, and a
wysiwyg viewport that handles more polygons than Blender at the
moment. It’s old, retro, but maybe the near future that will be a
thing – as much as 8bit games are a thing, like hand brew

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Jordi Bares

Following the game of analogies and with the only intention of stating that a 
tool is not just a tool once and for all, you would expect to use the same 
tools to carve a soft marble from a hard one, let alone granite or hard wood. 
Sometimes you will use a Chisel, a Cape Chisel, a Ripper, Wedges and Shims…

In our world it is clear certain tools “drive” you in certain directions (Maya 
is very good and driving you to the cliff though) while others “drive” you to 
technical elements at first may seem silly (Houdini is particularly good at 
that sometimes) but overall both are evolving. Softimage, unfortunately is dead 
although I understand the cozy feeling is great, the reality is that the world 
out there is not cozy at all, and sooner than you think your neighbour will be 
able to do things you simply can’t do at all (in fact this is already true in 
terms of scalability for example)

But you are right, if you prefer to use it and it does the job, go for it, 
surely you know the various aspects but please don’t forget these emails were 
only with the intention of helping a community like this one with so many great 
people that have helped me so much, I would like to help everyone to just move 
on and accept the realities of modern CGI are very very different from the ones 
we all experienced 3 years ago, let alone 6. 

hugs
jb


> On 25 Oct 2017, at 21:47, Andres Stephens <drais...@outlook.com> wrote:
> 
> Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship with a 
> person…
> 
> There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and 
> nails. There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a tool. 
> Whatever gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard comparing a 
> hammer with a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and whatever you do, 
> even art can be made with the defunct Microsoft Paint. Whatever floats your 
> boat. When it comes to productions, whatever gets the job done in time too is 
> valid as anything else superior or not.
> 
> Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still is 
> the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in one, 
> rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination with 
> fabric engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand artistry 
> sometimes) in Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base workflows, 
> realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things fading away, has 
> OBJ died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and the 3D workflow will 
> fade so quickly as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t become obsolete today… 
> 
> I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for it’s 
> unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years later, 32bit, 
> still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree, with a directX9 
> viewport, updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport that handles more 
> polygons than Blender at the moment. It’s old, retro, but maybe the near 
> future that will be a thing – as much as 8bit games are a thing, like hand 
> brew coffee, microbrewery beer and vinly DJ’s. 
> 
> Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be in an 
> industry standard to survive. 
> 
> And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving and 
> developing (and having to learn over and over again as things revamp, 
> modifies and improves) to be free to  focus on the art and story… Just a 
> thought. 
> 
> -Draise
>  
> From: Mathieu Leclaire <mailto:mlecl...@hybride.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:43
> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QJrs1bxZsIRam1W2VAnyiENCqncwzNlJzFEYlWwRI48=rN3QTK9WcfCaQ-_XI-6L1Yzkf6SYU0BKHZneXMfnYeE=
>  <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>  
> Hi guys,
> 
> I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take 
> offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times 
> by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:
> 
> I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This 
> industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now 
> still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to 
> handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers 
> will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't 
> support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with 
> current production needs using that software. If you guys

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Jonathan Moore

I was told by the Animal Logic boys that they only made the move over to
Maya from XSI on the latest Lego show, but even then XSI had to be retained
for a number of shots.

I can't see the harm in using XSI for specific reasons (as long as chief
amongst those reasons isn't nostalgia).

There seems to be a consensus in this thread (and the multitude of others
like it) ref growing your knowledge with regards to alternative options.
That's the main thing that's important. When we're in our late teens/early
twenties, the best quality we have is open mindedness. Keep that middle
aged 'been there, seen it, done it' attitude at bay and there's plenty of
ways of transitioning on with grace. ;)

On 25 October 2017 at 22:20, Sven Constable <sixsi_l...@imagefront.de>
wrote:

> The thing is, you don't have to be freaking amazing to be competitive with
> XSI. In fact you can easily compete, taking a break and playing banjo while
> doing the work. Maybe not in vfx but with usual 3d.
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-bounces@
> listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Mathieu Leclaire
> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:02 PM
>
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oGDNgAaiMwEiQ-vQftI9VW4PykRgog6IwH09oHGQHdc=BUhHPUR9_jcH4XXM9tIEX9om2E-fLMCDPO1YZp9X0Y0=
> forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
>
>
> I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is using
> nail guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids can do the
> job 100x faster then you can, why would they hire you instead? I'm not
> saying you can't do a good job with a hammer, but it'll take more time so
> you'll need to charge more money to compensate. You better make sure you're
> freaking amazing with that hammer if you want them to come back to you.
>
> On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:
>
> Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship
> with a person…
>
> There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and
> nails. There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a
> tool. Whatever gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard
> comparing a hammer with a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and
> whatever you do, even art can be made with the defunct Microsoft Paint.
> Whatever floats your boat. When it comes to productions, whatever gets the
> job done in time too is valid as anything else superior or not.
>
>
> Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still
> is the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in
> one, rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination
> with fabric engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand
> artistry sometimes) in Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base
> workflows, realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things
> fading away, has OBJ died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and
> the 3D workflow will fade so quickly as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t
> become obsolete today…
>
> I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for it’s
> unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years later,
> 32bit, still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree, with a
> directX9 viewport, updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport that
> handles more polygons than Blender at the moment. It’s old, retro, but
> maybe the near future that will be a thing – as much as 8bit games are a
> thing, like hand brew coffee, microbrewery beer and vinly DJ’s.
>
> Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be in an
> industry standard to survive.
>
> And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving and
> developing (and having to learn over and over again as things revamp,
> modifies and improves) to be free to  focus on the art and story… Just a
> thought.
>
> -Draise
>
>
>
> *From: *Mathieu Leclaire <mlecl...@hybride.com>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:43
> *To: *Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oGDNgAaiMwEiQ-vQftI9VW4PykRgog6IwH09oHGQHdc=BUhHPUR9_jcH4XXM9tIEX9om2E-fLMCDPO1YZp9X0Y0=
> forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> *Subject: *Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
>
>
> Hi guys,
>
> I don't want to crash your rant here and hope yo

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Eugene Flormata

I played with the akeytsu demo a bit, but I didn't see it any differently
than the existing animation paradigm, it's just a different interface,
looks like they've made some updates, so I'll take another look at it


i think the most radical ways to look at future animation are
mosketch (which I think lacks the detailed control at the moment, and can
get slow at times, but it's in beta)

Raf Anzovin's ephemeral rigging process, which makes some really hand-drawn
looking animations 
(https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__vimeo.com_238453633=DwIBaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=R8qKNZRSen0BL09QD5WJVJoc_n6P96fOyXJp0hchj7s=1LFGLGwjoItzWkAMABbdI1GUwYbza4yqMLfA97MBCQY=),
 it's a very keyframe
based animation process
he even posts some of the tech behind it on his website
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.justtodosomethingbad.com_=DwIBaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=R8qKNZRSen0BL09QD5WJVJoc_n6P96fOyXJp0hchj7s=H0Yq9uApWtGn78d1i5xpk-I6IY_bVgGIRmJumbczD-o=

i think these mixed with some of Richard lico's process on baked animation
is a nice steps forward in a new animation paradigm

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 1:42 PM, Cristobal Infante  wrote:

> A bit OT but is anyone giving akeytsu a go? I played with it yesterday,
> and feels simple and fast!!
>
>>
>>
>>
--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Sven Constable

The thing is, you don't have to be freaking amazing to be competitive with XSI. 
In fact you can easily compete, taking a break and playing banjo while doing 
the work. Maybe not in vfx but with usual 3d.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mathieu Leclaire
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:02 PM
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=CmolRlPA4kn-A9QxeRrxRSH0Syk1M_3Mjk6OIxd59sE=gwUhrGga_WyaP0poKfxTXKxi0b7DOKTTi2HxtfOw4Do=
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is using nail 
guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids can do the job 100x 
faster then you can, why would they hire you instead? I'm not saying you can't 
do a good job with a hammer, but it'll take more time so you'll need to charge 
more money to compensate. You better make sure you're freaking amazing with 
that hammer if you want them to come back to you.

On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:

Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship with a 
person…

There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and nails. 
There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a tool. Whatever 
gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard comparing a hammer with 
a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and whatever you do, even art can be 
made with the defunct Microsoft Paint. Whatever floats your boat. When it comes 
to productions, whatever gets the job done in time too is valid as anything 
else superior or not. 

Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still is 
the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in one, 
rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination with fabric 
engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand artistry 
sometimes) in Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base workflows, 
realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things fading away, has OBJ 
died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and the 3D workflow will fade 
so quickly as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t become obsolete today… 

I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for it’s 
unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years later, 32bit, 
still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree, with a directX9 viewport, 
updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport that handles more polygons than 
Blender at the moment. It’s old, retro, but maybe the near future that will be 
a thing – as much as 8bit games are a thing, like hand brew coffee, 
microbrewery beer and vinly DJ’s. 

Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be in an 
industry standard to survive. 

And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving and 
developing (and having to learn over and over again as things revamp, modifies 
and improves) to be free to  focus on the art and story… Just a thought. 

-Draise

From: Mathieu Leclaire <mailto:mlecl...@hybride.com> 
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:43
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=CmolRlPA4kn-A9QxeRrxRSH0Syk1M_3Mjk6OIxd59sE=gwUhrGga_WyaP0poKfxTXKxi0b7DOKTTi2HxtfOw4Do=
 <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com> 
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take 
offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times 
by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This 
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now 
still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to 
handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers 
will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't 
support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with 
current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve, 
you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before 
you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily 
relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on 
the outside looking in.

I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself. 
But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable 
with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now

RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Tekano Bob

Interesting points Andres,  wonder if Vitaly Bulgarov plans on sticking
with Xsi, it looked like he used it on ghost in the Shell, so it is still a
valid design tool choice on contempory film productions in the right hands.
I've tried to maintain a philosophy to use the best tools for the task and
until something better (or faster) came along , Xsi was the tool most often
reached. Lately Houdini has been the go to tool for more complex technical
tasks but Xsi still for rapid prototype modelling, it's muscle memory Still


On Oct 25, 2017 9:47 PM, "Andres Stephens"  wrote:

Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship with
a person…

There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and
nails. There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a
tool. Whatever g
--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

Re: Softimage - not going away...

I hear you, but how will you compete for a job when everyone else is
using nail guns and you are only using a hammer? If all these new kids
can do the job 100x faster then you can, why would they hire you
instead? I'm not saying you can't do a good job with a hammer, but it'll
take more time so you'll need to charge more money to compensate. You
better make sure you're freaking amazing with that hammer if you want
them to come back to you.

On 25/10/2017 4:47 PM, Andres Stephens wrote:

Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship
with a person…

There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers
and nails. There still are capable artists using paint and brushes.
It’s a tool. Whatever gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will
be hard comparing a hammer with a nail gun – but for the sake of the
art and whatever you do, even art can be made with the defunct
Microsoft Paint. Whatever floats your boat. When it comes to
productions, whatever gets the job done in time too is valid as
anything else superior or not.

Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory
still is the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many.
Sculpting in one, rendering in another, animation in another, even
cross pollination with fabric engine, proceduralism (which isn’t
always great for hard hand artistry sometimes) in Houdini, or even in
Blender with some node base workflows, realtime rendering in Unreal,
and.. even with that, things fading away, has OBJ died yet after all
these years? I don’t think SI and the 3D workflow will fade so quickly
as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t become obsolete today…

I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for
it’s unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years
later, 32bit, still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree,
with a directX9 viewport, updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport
that handles more polygons than Blender at the moment. It’s old,
retro, but maybe the near future that will be a thing – as much as
8bit games are a thing, like hand brew coffee, microbrewery beer and
vinly DJ’s.

Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be
in an industry standard to survive.

And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving
and developing (and having to learn over and over again as things
revamp, modifies and improves) to be free to focus on the art and
story… Just a thought.

-Draise

*From: *Mathieu Leclaire <mailto:mlecl...@hybride.com>
*Sent: *Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:43
*To: *Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=KCiACNTEyMsBXu1UBP9xMuiifAI7s2bFxksN85cTFSo=SEtOI9o73TEwGHA08KO3NvtJwaKmOGuJ62-Muo34lCc=
<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>

*Subject: *Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
the outside looking in.

I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.

Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing
it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated,
there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they
prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a
price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in
Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that
this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot beca

RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Andres Stephens

Though a good analogy... a tool is very different than a relationship with a 
person…

There still are very efficient people building houses out of hammers and nails. 
There still are capable artists using paint and brushes. It’s a tool. Whatever 
gets the job done. And yes, eventually it will be hard comparing a hammer with 
a nail gun – but for the sake of the art and whatever you do, even art can be 
made with the defunct Microsoft Paint. Whatever floats your boat. When it comes 
to productions, whatever gets the job done in time too is valid as anything 
else superior or not.

Even if it’s about relationships with a software… I think polyamory still is 
the name of the game. A harmonious relationship of many. Sculpting in one, 
rendering in another, animation in another, even cross pollination with fabric 
engine, proceduralism (which isn’t always great for hard hand artistry 
sometimes) in Houdini, or even in Blender with some node base workflows, 
realtime rendering in Unreal, and.. even with that, things fading away, has OBJ 
died yet after all these years? I don’t think SI and the 3D workflow will fade 
so quickly as much as the hammer and nail hasn’t become obsolete today…

I would, for the hell of it, still make a webseries in trueSpace for it’s 
unique relaxing workflow and still funcioning software, 9 years later, 32bit, 
still has a Yafaray and Vray integration to a degree, with a directX9 viewport, 
updated FBX exporter, and a wysiwyg viewport that handles more polygons than 
Blender at the moment. It’s old, retro, but maybe the near future that will be 
a thing – as much as 8bit games are a thing, like hand brew coffee, 
microbrewery beer and vinly DJ’s.

Whatever gets the job done, whatever floats your boat. No need to be in an 
industry standard to survive.

And.. it is relaxing working in something that isn’t always evolving and 
developing (and having to learn over and over again as things revamp, modifies 
and improves) to be free to  focus on the art and story… Just a thought.

-Draise

From: Mathieu Leclaire<mailto:mlecl...@hybride.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 11:43
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIGaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=db8TrB1coaRtjYPF6KcpQ2L1OK4KWigxiU2pkVIyYdc=h10Ve8A43Do_hfLRfqF_bi3JLDoeVSApm-JIj5OFfUE=<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
the outside looking in.

I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.

Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing
it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated,
there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they
prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a
price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in
Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that
this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot because he's
too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision is putting
a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to
overcharge for his shots anymore.

This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few
years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an
old typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels
like taking a few steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to
eventually move forward where you are standing still in

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Cristobal Infante

A bit OT but is anyone giving akeytsu a go? I played with it yesterday, and
feels simple and fast!!


On Wed, 25 Oct 2017 at 21:38, Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I will suggest, like it has been mentioned, that you take a hard cold look
> at what it is at stake… your family? Your company?
>
> Make sure you don’t get run over by the competition..
>
> And good luck
> jb
>
>
> > On 25 Oct 2017, at 20:10, Sven Constable <sixsi_l...@imagefront.de>
> wrote:
> >
> > Two or three years back I considered another software as a replacement
> for XSI. You can do that and be on the safe side, because everyone else
> will use something else than Softimage. If you have to rely on a career as
> an employed artist you should do it instantly. Don't waste time. No one can
> compete in a jobmarket  with outdated tools. If you are independent, it's
> an entirely different story.
> >
> > You can work with XSI now, be productive and went further for many years
> to come. The success to use XSI in the future for us ppl will depend
> strongly how we will able to manage our pipeline. Can you fix problems with
> licensing or OS related things without TDs and IT? If you're non-tech, can
> you fix problems without help from developers? I can handle that and I
> chose to stick with XSI.
> > I think the difficult part of using it is not to work with something
> rare or exotic like Softimage is nowadays. It's still superior to Maya and
> 3dsmax, so there is no problem in my daily work. But you will need to keep
> it working together: applications, OS, hardware, network, licensing. Those
> problems will perhaps become harder to solve.
> >
> > Sven
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mathieu Leclaire
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 6:17 PM
> > To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=Gb_Emr-HzoGjo5ki4TWNZ69vBhKhDEZTSDucMra7Qtk=UWI2gpHt4EfUs71Vjr7YUWpAylTHY1Scp10j8Dw5y30=
> > Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
> >
> > Hi guys,
> >
> > I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
> offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times by
> now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:
> >
> > I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
> industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now still
> feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to handle all
> the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers will stop
> being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't support it, etc.
> It will eventually become impossible to keep up with current production
> needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve, you will become
> dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before you'll be able to
> get work again. We work in an industry that heavily relies on new
> technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on the outside
> looking in.
> >
> > I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
> > But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
> with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now love
> Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.
> >
> > Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
> lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to with
> all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I get
> pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing it
> directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated, there's
> a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they prefer not to
> get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a price to pay.
> For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in Softimage where it
> loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that this artist takes about
> twice the time allocated per shot because he's too hard headed to switch
> software. Trust me that supervision is putting a lot of pressure on that
> guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to overcharge for his shots anymore.
> >
> > This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few
> years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an old
> typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that sw

RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Sven Constable

Two or three years back I considered another software as a replacement for XSI. 
You can do that and be on the safe side, because everyone else will use 
something else than Softimage. If you have to rely on a career as an employed 
artist you should do it instantly. Don't waste time. No one can compete in a 
jobmarket  with outdated tools. If you are independent, it's an entirely 
different story.

You can work with XSI now, be productive and went further for many years to 
come. The success to use XSI in the future for us ppl will depend strongly how 
we will able to manage our pipeline. Can you fix problems with licensing or OS 
related things without TDs and IT? If you're non-tech, can you fix problems 
without help from developers? I can handle that and I chose to stick with XSI.
I think the difficult part of using it is not to work with something rare or 
exotic like Softimage is nowadays. It's still superior to Maya and 3dsmax, so 
there is no problem in my daily work. But you will need to keep it working 
together: applications, OS, hardware, network, licensing. Those problems will 
perhaps become harder to solve.

Sven


-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mathieu Leclaire
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 6:17 PM
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=Gb_Emr-HzoGjo5ki4TWNZ69vBhKhDEZTSDucMra7Qtk=UWI2gpHt4EfUs71Vjr7YUWpAylTHY1Scp10j8Dw5y30=
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take offense to 
what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times by now, but if you 
would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This 
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now still 
feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to handle all the 
new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers will stop being 
supported, new hardware and operating systems won't support it, etc. It will 
eventually become impossible to keep up with current production needs using 
that software. If you guys don't evolve, you will become dinosaurs and you'll 
have a long way to catch up before you'll be able to get work again. We work in 
an industry that heavily relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with 
it or you end up on the outside looking in.

I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself. 
But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable with 
Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now love Houdini 
probably more then I ever loved Softimage.

Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a lot 
here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to with all the 
new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I get pissed off when 
colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing it directly in Houdini or 
in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated, there's a lot of pressure to 
deliver in short timelines and so they prefer not to get out of their comfort 
zone. But it already comes with a price to pay. For example, we had a scene 
that took an hour to load in Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in 
Houdini. That means that this artist takes about twice the time allocated per 
shot because he's too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision 
is putting a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to 
overcharge for his shots anymore.

This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few years and 
eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an old typewriter 
instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels like taking a few 
steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to eventually move forward where 
you are standing still in Softimage. I hated having to go through all this, but 
eventually Houdini open my eyes to a world of new possibilities that never 
would have been available in Softimage and I couldn't be happier that I finally 
made that move. Don't make the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of 
working. It'll become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys 
out there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and 
move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at first, but 
you just might find one that will blow your mind and change your life for the 
better, but you have to take that leap first and give it a fair chance.

That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to manage 
your career.

-Mathieu

On 25/10/2017 10:46 AM, Stefan

Re: Softimage - not going away...

: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=

<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=>
.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)

Amen to that!!

If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make
sure they had
flat tires for a year.
If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest
they admit
themselves to a mental facility.
Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also
flog with
wet newspapers for a year.

I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have
to learn
Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true
and then
some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually
only like
some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures
in the
viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are
blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could
have been if
things had been different.

Morten

Den 24. oktober 2017 klokken 21:59 skrev Mirko Jankovic
mailto:t...@gmail.com>>:

I do believe that there is still ton of Softimage people
that are
pushed
into hell of maya that would give a leg to have a chance to
work
again in
Softimage so..  :)
ᐧ

On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:47 PM, David Gallagher Softimage <
davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com
<mailto:davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Great work!

Big high-five for using Softimage still. I do too!
Curious though, how do you handle new employees? Do you
only bring
in
people who know Softimage already? I'm just imagining a new
employee
learning your pipeline with EOL software and how they
handle that.

On 10/24/2017 7:16 AM, Jean-Louis wrote:

Hi list,

Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem:
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole>
m.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=xNkb2
ahCYupFGKwPqnIZyYQ8bR_QW7V_uRaMaaQW44k=
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol>
em.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs=>

Cheers,
JL

Jean-Louis Billard
-
*Digital Golem*
BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
<mailto:jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com>
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole>
m.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=0_YH6
IZI7Lxy5elO-n3Ncs30aXU03EcGQdV8Tua6pek=
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol>
em.com_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Jonathan Moore

y, October 25, 2017 12:16 PM
> To: Official Softimage Users
> MailingList.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/
> url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-
> 5Flist=DwICaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_
> 32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=w__nc6mCMrINpx5xEp-
> sXoo5sEeL0el9ETqHSc8sMX4=ZOLCGskRP-KFcopiYRgs8bJ9N8OrwFUu6F1EGrD5DOY=
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
> Hi guys,
>
> I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
> offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
> by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:
>
> I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
> industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
> still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
> handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
> will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
> support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
> current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
> you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
> you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
> relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
> the outside looking in.
>
> I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
> But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
> with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
> love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.
>
> Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
> lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
> with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
> get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing
> it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated,
> there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they
> prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a
> price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in
> Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that
> this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot because he's
> too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision is putting
> a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to
> overcharge for his shots anymore.
>
> This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few
> years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an
> old typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels
> like taking a few steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to
> eventually move forward where you are standing still in Softimage. I
> hated having to go through all this, but eventually Houdini open my eyes
> to a world of new possibilities that never would have been available in
> Softimage and I couldn't be happier that I finally made that move. Don't
> make the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of working. It'll
> become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys out
> there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and
> move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at
> first, but you just might find one that will blow your mind and change
> your life for the better, but you have to take that leap first and give
> it a fair chance.
>
> That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to
> manage your career.
>
> -Mathieu
>
>
>
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>
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

Well, there you go... You can see that in Houdini 16.5 
(https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__vimeo.com_239828144=DwICaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=03dNdWcJLx25CNQtnuq9ag-h0UeRloNZ0etUrCP3IPk=QGq_k-YaWltbBgMZrYG4zX-48QX7WZzqi07AOvBTf6Y= 
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__vimeo.com_239828144=DwMFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=N2Vb-j_1yEG1T7iLmOyceqou2RUR5O3T-54diimY1bs=aqjODiL6tOfYklM1tlalzeu6S3ti1FGkrL2LYitI4-w=>) 
they've already pushed a few new animation features. I'm sure more will 
follow in version 17. As I said, they are working on improving their 
animation tools. It might take a few more version to get something worth 
switching over for, but you can see there's an effort put into that area.


On 25/10/2017 2:07 PM, Mathieu Leclaire wrote:

Currently we do our rigging and animation in Maya.

I'm in no way an expert on rigging and animation, so I can only share 
feedback that I've heard from our experts.


From what I see, Houdini have some very interesting rigging tools. 
It's the animation tools that are a bit primitive. You can do pretty 
much what you want, it's just not as sexy and user friendly as the 
other softwares.


SideFX told us they have plans to improve these tools. I'm not sure 
when that will happen, but everything SideFX do seems to turn to gold 
so It'll probably be amazing once they get to it... I'm just not sure 
of their timeline.


We try and do as much as we can in Maya for now, but we can also 
import the animation back into Houdini to do muscle simulations, cloth 
and hair sims when necessary... or use Houdini Engine in Maya. We 
haven't needed to go there yet, so these are all options that are up 
in the air for us right now.


All I can say is that our Animation/Rigging departments where the 
first department to transition into Maya before we even looked at 
Houdini and they seem happy with it. When we suggested that they look 
at Houdini for Animation/Rigging, there was a lot of resistance since 
they just made the move over to Maya and they weren't very excited at 
the prospect of learning yet another software, so we never pushed it.


Houdini is very flexible to customize to your need. You can make it do 
anything, but you need technical people to help make these tools more 
user friendly. If you are more artistic then technical and just want 
to animate, then Maya is probably a better choice for the moment. I 
don't know if there are other software worth looking into at this 
moment though!? Motion builder and crowd tools like Goalem are good at 
mixing existing clips together, but they aren't animation tools.


Animation feels like an area where it seem ready for a big 
technological evolution. How long will people edit keys on curves? 
Feels as primitive as modeling was before ZBrush and Mudbox where 
invented. I see there's a lot of research done with machine learning 
and deep neural networks... I have a feeling big breakthroughs are on 
the verge of revolutionizing the way we animate our characters. But 
until then, I would say Maya is your safest bet for now.



On 25/10/2017 1:00 PM, phil harbath wrote:

Do you do character animation in Houdini, I am hesitant to change to
another program if I can't get
near the character animation workflow as Softimage, just wondering I 
don't

know much about Houdini's
strengths in that department other than it is behind and a work in 
progress,

maybe they are fine with that not being
their niche. Of all the nightmares I hear about about working in Maya 
I am

not crazy about spending a ton of time (and money)
changing to Maya for character animation to have it worse.

thanks

-Original Message-
From: Mathieu Leclaire
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 12:16 PM
To: Official Softimage Users
MailingList.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwICaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=w__nc6mCMrINpx5xEp-sXoo5sEeL0el9ETqHSc8sMX4=ZOLCGskRP-KFcopiYRgs8bJ9N8OrwFUu6F1EGrD5DOY= 


Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
you will become dinosaurs and you'll have

Re: Softimage - not going away...

Currently we do our rigging and animation in Maya.

I'm in no way an expert on rigging and animation, so I can only share 
feedback that I've heard from our experts.

 From what I see, Houdini have some very interesting rigging tools. It's 
the animation tools that are a bit primitive. You can do pretty much 
what you want, it's just not as sexy and user friendly as the other 
softwares.

SideFX told us they have plans to improve these tools. I'm not sure when 
that will happen, but everything SideFX do seems to turn to gold so 
It'll probably be amazing once they get to it... I'm just not sure of 
their timeline.

We try and do as much as we can in Maya for now, but we can also import 
the animation back into Houdini to do muscle simulations, cloth and hair 
sims when necessary... or use Houdini Engine in Maya. We haven't needed 
to go there yet, so these are all options that are up in the air for us 
right now.

All I can say is that our Animation/Rigging departments where the first 
department to transition into Maya before we even looked at Houdini and 
they seem happy with it. When we suggested that they look at Houdini for 
Animation/Rigging, there was a lot of resistance since they just made 
the move over to Maya and they weren't very excited at the prospect of 
learning yet another software, so we never pushed it.

Houdini is very flexible to customize to your need. You can make it do 
anything, but you need technical people to help make these tools more 
user friendly. If you are more artistic then technical and just want to 
animate, then Maya is probably a better choice for the moment. I don't 
know if there are other software worth looking into at this moment 
though!? Motion builder and crowd tools like Goalem are good at mixing 
existing clips together, but they aren't animation tools.

Animation feels like an area where it seem ready for a big technological 
evolution. How long will people edit keys on curves? Feels as primitive 
as modeling was before ZBrush and Mudbox where invented. I see there's a 
lot of research done with machine learning and deep neural networks... I 
have a feeling big breakthroughs are on the verge of revolutionizing the 
way we animate our characters. But until then, I would say Maya is your 
safest bet for now.

On 25/10/2017 1:00 PM, phil harbath wrote:
> Do you do character animation in Houdini,  I am hesitant to change to
> another program if I can't get
> near the character animation workflow as Softimage, just wondering I don't
> know much about Houdini's
> strengths in that department other than it is behind and a work in progress,
> maybe they are fine with that not being
> their niche. Of all the nightmares I hear about about working in Maya I am
> not crazy about spending a ton of time (and money)
> changing to Maya for character animation to have it worse.
>
> thanks
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mathieu Leclaire
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 12:16 PM
> To: Official Softimage Users
> MailingList.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwICaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=w__nc6mCMrINpx5xEp-sXoo5sEeL0el9ETqHSc8sMX4=ZOLCGskRP-KFcopiYRgs8bJ9N8OrwFUu6F1EGrD5DOY=
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
> Hi guys,
>
> I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
> offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
> by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:
>
> I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
> industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
> still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
> handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
> will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
> support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
> current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
> you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
> you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
> relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
> the outside looking in.
>
> I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
> But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
> with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
> love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.
>
> Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
> lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
> with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
> get pissed off when colleagues dec

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Mirko Jankovic

and you'll have a long way to catch up before
>> you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
>> relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
>> the outside looking in.
>>
>> I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
>> But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
>> with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
>> love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.
>>
>> Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
>> lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
>> with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
>> get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing
>> it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated,
>> there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they
>> prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a
>> price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in
>> Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that
>> this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot because he's
>> too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision is putting
>> a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to
>> overcharge for his shots anymore.
>>
>> This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few
>> years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an
>> old typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels
>> like taking a few steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to
>> eventually move forward where you are standing still in Softimage. I
>> hated having to go through all this, but eventually Houdini open my eyes
>> to a world of new possibilities that never would have been available in
>> Softimage and I couldn't be happier that I finally made that move. Don't
>> make the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of working. It'll
>> become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys out
>> there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and
>> move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at
>> first, but you just might find one that will blow your mind and change
>> your life for the better, but you have to take that leap first and give
>> it a fair chance.
>>
>> That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to
>> manage your career.
>>
>> -Mathieu
>>
>> On 25/10/2017 10:46 AM, Stefan Kubicek wrote:
>>
>> There are only two kinds of CG artist in the world: Those who use
>> Softimage, and those who never tried.
>>
>> S
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Morten Bartholdy <x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
>> Reply-to: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.
>> google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
>> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPj
>> jNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfT
>> wQeJQ0=QE3ckC9GK7WPFXoMa4iFbvFLcjJpaa5u98JrEqLaEuw="
>>
>> <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A_
>> _groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9
>> uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=Ql
>> ldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC
>> 7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=
>> .com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)
>>
>> Amen to that!!
>>
>> If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make sure they had
>> flat tires for a year.
>> If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest they admit
>> themselves to a mental facility.
>> Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also flog with
>> wet newspapers for a year.
>>
>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
>> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
>> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like
>> some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the
>> viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are
>> bliss

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Olivier Jeannel

 the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of working. It'll
> become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys out
> there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and
> move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at
> first, but you just might find one that will blow your mind and change
> your life for the better, but you have to take that leap first and give
> it a fair chance.
>
> That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to
> manage your career.
>
> -Mathieu
>
> On 25/10/2017 10:46 AM, Stefan Kubicek wrote:
>
> There are only two kinds of CG artist in the world: Those who use
> Softimage, and those who never tried.
>
> S
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Morten Bartholdy <x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
> Reply-to: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.
> google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVM
> srMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=
> QE3ckC9GK7WPFXoMa4iFbvFLcjJpaa5u98JrEqLaEuw="
>
> <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-
> 3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_
> IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=
> QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=
> NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=
> .com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)
>
> Amen to that!!
>
> If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make sure they had
> flat tires for a year.
> If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest they admit
> themselves to a mental facility.
> Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also flog with
> wet newspapers for a year.
>
> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like
> some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the
> viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are
> blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could have been if
> things had been different.
>
>
> Morten
>
>
>
>
> Den 24. oktober 2017 klokken 21:59 skrev Mirko Jankovic  t...@gmail.com>:
>
>
> I do believe that there is still ton of Softimage people that are
> pushed
> into hell of maya that would give a leg to have a chance to work
> again in
> Softimage so..  :)
> ᐧ
>
> On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:47 PM, David Gallagher Softimage <
> davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Great work!
>
> Big high-five for using Softimage still. I do too!
> Curious though, how do you handle new employees? Do you only bring
> in
> people who know Softimage already? I'm just imagining a new
> employee
> learning your pipeline with EOL software and how they handle that.
>
>
> On 10/24/2017 7:16 AM, Jean-Louis wrote:
>
> Hi list,
>
> Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem:
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
> m.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=xNkb2
> ahCYupFGKwPqnIZyYQ8bR_QW7V_uRaMaaQW44k=
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
> em.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
> lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs=>
>
> Cheers,
> JL
>
>
> Jean-Louis Billard
> -
> *Digital Golem*
> BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
> jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
> m.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=0_YH6
> IZI7Lxy5elO-n3Ncs30aXU03EcGQdV8Tua6pek=
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
> em.com_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
> lBeIyA=Gq9YaxWiO1d-lilhxIivNgjNRmHGBXG5pCHG

Re: Softimage - not going away...

se who use
>> Softimage, and those who never tried.
>> 
>> S
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Morten Bartholdy <x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
>> Reply-to: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>> 
>>  
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=QE3ckC9GK7WPFXoMa4iFbvFLcjJpaa5u98JrEqLaEuw=;
>> 
>>  <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>> 
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=
>> .com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)
>> 
>> Amen to that!!
>> 
>> If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make sure they had
>> flat tires for a year.
>> If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest they admit
>> themselves to a mental facility.
>> Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also flog with
>> wet newspapers for a year.
>> 
>> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
>> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
>> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like
>> some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the
>> viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are
>> blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could have been if
>> things had been different.
>> 
>> 
>> Morten
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> Den 24. oktober 2017 klokken 21:59 skrev Mirko Jankovic >> t...@gmail.com>:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I do believe that there is still ton of Softimage people that are
>>> pushed
>>> into hell of maya that would give a leg to have a chance to work
>>> again in
>>> Softimage so..  :)
>>> ᐧ
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:47 PM, David Gallagher Softimage <
>>> davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Great work!
>>>> 
>>>> Big high-five for using Softimage still. I do too!
>>>> Curious though, how do you handle new employees? Do you only bring
>>>> in
>>>> people who know Softimage already? I'm just imagining a new
>>>> employee
>>>> learning your pipeline with EOL software and how they handle that.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 10/24/2017 7:16 AM, Jean-Louis wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi list,
>>>> 
>>>> Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem:
>>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
>>>> m.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
>>>> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
>>>> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=xNkb2
>>>> ahCYupFGKwPqnIZyYQ8bR_QW7V_uRaMaaQW44k=
>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
>>>> em.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
>>>> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
>>>> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
>>>> lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs=>
>>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> JL
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Jean-Louis Billard
>>>> -
>>>> *Digital Golem*
>>>> BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
>>>> jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
>>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
>>>> m.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
>>>> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
>>>> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=0_YH6
>>>> IZI7Lxy5elO-n3Ncs30aXU03EcGQdV8Tua6pek=
>>>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
>>>> em.com_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
>>>> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
>>>> 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Ognjen Vukovic

Mathieu Leclaire+1
Its time to move on.

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 7:00 PM, phil harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
wrote:

> Do you do character animation in Houdini,  I am hesitant to change to
> another program if I can't get
> near the character animation workflow as Softimage, just wondering I don't
> know much about Houdini's
> strengths in that department other than it is behind and a work in
> progress,
> maybe they are fine with that not being
> their niche. Of all the nightmares I hear about about working in Maya I am
> not crazy about spending a ton of time (and money)
> changing to Maya for character animation to have it worse.
>
> thanks
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mathieu Leclaire
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 12:16 PM
> To: Official Softimage Users
> MailingList.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/
> url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-
> 5Flist=DwICaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_
> 32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=w__nc6mCMrINpx5xEp-
> sXoo5sEeL0el9ETqHSc8sMX4=ZOLCGskRP-KFcopiYRgs8bJ9N8OrwFUu6F1EGrD5DOY=
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
>
> Hi guys,
>
> I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
> offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
> by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:
>
> I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
> industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
> still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
> handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
> will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
> support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
> current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
> you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
> you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
> relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
> the outside looking in.
>
> I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
> But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
> with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
> love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.
>
> Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
> lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
> with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
> get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing
> it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated,
> there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they
> prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a
> price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in
> Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that
> this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot because he's
> too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision is putting
> a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to
> overcharge for his shots anymore.
>
> This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few
> years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an
> old typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels
> like taking a few steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to
> eventually move forward where you are standing still in Softimage. I
> hated having to go through all this, but eventually Houdini open my eyes
> to a world of new possibilities that never would have been available in
> Softimage and I couldn't be happier that I finally made that move. Don't
> make the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of working. It'll
> become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys out
> there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and
> move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at
> first, but you just might find one that will blow your mind and change
> your life for the better, but you have to take that leap first and give
> it a fair chance.
>
> That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to
> manage your career.
>
> -Mathieu
>
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread phil harbath

Do you do character animation in Houdini,  I am hesitant to change to 
another program if I can't get
near the character animation workflow as Softimage, just wondering I don't 
know much about Houdini's
strengths in that department other than it is behind and a work in progress, 
maybe they are fine with that not being
their niche. Of all the nightmares I hear about about working in Maya I am 
not crazy about spending a ton of time (and money)
changing to Maya for character animation to have it worse.

thanks

-Original Message- 
From: Mathieu Leclaire
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 12:16 PM
To: Official Softimage Users 
MailingList.https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwICaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=w__nc6mCMrINpx5xEp-sXoo5sEeL0el9ETqHSc8sMX4=ZOLCGskRP-KFcopiYRgs8bJ9N8OrwFUu6F1EGrD5DOY=
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take
offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times
by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now
still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to
handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers
will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't
support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with
current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve,
you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before
you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily
relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on
the outside looking in.

I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself.
But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable
with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now
love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.

Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a
lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to
with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I
get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing
it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated,
there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they
prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a
price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in
Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that
this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot because he's
too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision is putting
a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to
overcharge for his shots anymore.

This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few
years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an
old typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels
like taking a few steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to
eventually move forward where you are standing still in Softimage. I
hated having to go through all this, but eventually Houdini open my eyes
to a world of new possibilities that never would have been available in
Softimage and I couldn't be happier that I finally made that move. Don't
make the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of working. It'll
become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys out
there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and
move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at
first, but you just might find one that will blow your mind and change
your life for the better, but you have to take that leap first and give
it a fair chance.

That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to
manage your career.

-Mathieu



--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hi guys,

I don't want to crash your rant here and hope you guys don't take 
offense to what I have to say. I'm sure you heard this a million times 
by now, but if you would allow me to share my perspective:

I highly recommend you guys move on and learn the other softwares. This 
industry and it's technology is changing so fast. Sure Softimage now 
still feels like the best option, but soon Softimage won't be able to 
handle all the new file formats, new geometry features, latest renderers 
will stop being supported, new hardware and operating systems won't 
support it, etc. It will eventually become impossible to keep up with 
current production needs using that software. If you guys don't evolve, 
you will become dinosaurs and you'll have a long way to catch up before 
you'll be able to get work again. We work in an industry that heavily 
relies on new technologies so we have to evolve with it or you end up on 
the outside looking in.

I understand your frustration. I do. I have gone through it all myself. 
But after going through a hard learning curve to become as comfortable 
with Houdini as I was with Softimage (and I'm still learning), I now 
love Houdini probably more then I ever loved Softimage.

Trust me, it took me a long time to let it go. We still use Softimage a 
lot here at Hybride, but we are slowly migrating out of it. We have to 
with all the new requirements in our pipeline with other vendors. Now I 
get pissed off when colleagues decide to use Softimage instead of doing 
it directly in Houdini or in Maya. Like yourself, they are frustrated, 
there's a lot of pressure to deliver in short timelines and so they 
prefer not to get out of their comfort zone. But it already comes with a 
price to pay. For example, we had a scene that took an hour to load in 
Softimage where it loaded in a few seconds in Houdini. That means that 
this artist takes about twice the time allocated per shot because he's 
too hard headed to switch software. Trust me that supervision is putting 
a lot of pressure on that guy to learn Houdini so they don't have to 
overcharge for his shots anymore.

This is just the beginning. It'll get worst and worst in the next few 
years and eventually, you'll become like the guy who still types on an 
old typewriter instead of using a computer. I know that switching feels 
like taking a few steps backwards, but at least you'll be able to 
eventually move forward where you are standing still in Softimage. I 
hated having to go through all this, but eventually Houdini open my eyes 
to a world of new possibilities that never would have been available in 
Softimage and I couldn't be happier that I finally made that move. Don't 
make the mistake of being too comfortable in your ways of working. It'll 
become obsolete sooner then you think. There's a ton of new toys out 
there waiting to be discovered. Your ex broke up with you. Accept it and 
move on. Sure, you'll date a few girls that will underwhelm you at 
first, but you just might find one that will blow your mind and change 
your life for the better, but you have to take that leap first and give 
it a fair chance.

That's my rant/recommendation. Now it's on you to decide how you want to 
manage your career.

-Mathieu

On 25/10/2017 10:46 AM, Stefan Kubicek wrote:
> There are only two kinds of CG artist in the world: Those who use
> Softimage, and those who never tried.
>
> S
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Morten Bartholdy <x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
> Reply-to: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>
>   
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=QE3ckC9GK7WPFXoMa4iFbvFLcjJpaa5u98JrEqLaEuw=;
>
>   <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>  
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=
> .com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)
>
> Amen to that!!
>
> If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make sure they had
> flat tires for a year.
> If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest they admit
> themselves to a mental facility.
> Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also flog with
> wet newspapers for a year.
>
> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya pu

Re: Softimage - not going away...

Hehehe - I can’t imagine you without it!

JL



Jean-Louis Billard
-
Digital Golem
BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oqi6BmhuKjBekNIN9EjKTYCU40LViKL3zH-irMz2Q00=5A5AIRz1kM-rt4y8JbmdqdmSX30e3ON4zhXhFfDOPPE=
53 Rue Gustave Huberti
1030 Brussels
-



> On 25 Oct 2017, at 16:42, adrian wyer <adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com> wrote:
> 
> Looking good Jean-Louis!!
>  
> i still use Soft every day... "from my cold dead hands" etc etc
>  
> a
>  
> Adrian Wyer
> Fluid Pictures
> 4th Floor
> 4 Bath Place
> Rivington Street
> London
> EC2A 3DR 
> ++44(0) 207 684 5575 
> 
> adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com <mailto:adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com>
> www.fluid-pictures.com 
> <blocked::blocked::blocked::blocked::blocked::https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.fluid-2Dpictures.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oqi6BmhuKjBekNIN9EjKTYCU40LViKL3zH-irMz2Q00=8GVRrBRf6lQPG9CtLtNRblz-Ob5FBs-bLfbKMqI1jgU=>
>  
> Fluid Pictures Limited is registered in England and Wales.
> Company number:5657815
> VAT number: 872 6893 71
> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
> [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jean-Louis
> Sent: 24 October 2017 14:17
> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> Subject: Softimage - not going away...
>  
> Hi list,
>  
> Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem: 
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oqi6BmhuKjBekNIN9EjKTYCU40LViKL3zH-irMz2Q00=VB_97vXirPyhcBA3i7yKemEcbbFJG06p6QqJHFC2F5Y=
>  
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs=>
>  
> Cheers,
> JL
>  
>  
> Jean-Louis Billard
> -
> Digital Golem
> BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
> jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com <mailto:jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=oqi6BmhuKjBekNIN9EjKTYCU40LViKL3zH-irMz2Q00=5A5AIRz1kM-rt4y8JbmdqdmSX30e3ON4zhXhFfDOPPE=
>  
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-lBeIyA=Gq9YaxWiO1d-lilhxIivNgjNRmHGBXG5pCHGZKI47qE=>
> 53 Rue Gustave Huberti
> 1030 Brussels
> -
>  
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread skuby

I have modeling down pretty well in Blender now.  It's superior to even
Softimage (and that's no joke) but it takes the requisite growing pains to
get that far along.

I'm thinking my favorite way forward is Blender for Modeling.  Houdini for
semi-auto UV creation, Rigging, Exporting (and possibly animation) and some
3rd party renderer or game engine for final output.  And (for the time
being) ZBrush or Mudbox for sculpting/painting maybe with Substance
Painter.  All the while taking time out to automate as many repetitious
things as possible using Houdini.

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 9:46 PM, Stefan Kubicek <s...@tidbit-images.com>
wrote:

> There are only two kinds of CG artist in the world: Those who use
> Softimage, and those who never tried.
>
> S
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Morten Bartholdy <x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
> Reply-to: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.
> google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVM
> srMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=
> QE3ckC9GK7WPFXoMa4iFbvFLcjJpaa5u98JrEqLaEuw="
>
> <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-
> 3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_
> IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=
> QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=
> NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=
> .com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
> Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
> Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)
>
> Amen to that!!
>
> If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make sure they had
> flat tires for a year.
> If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest they admit
> themselves to a mental facility.
> Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also flog with
> wet newspapers for a year.
>
> I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
> some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like
> some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the
> viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are
> blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could have been if
> things had been different.
>
>
> Morten
>
>
>
>
> > Den 24. oktober 2017 klokken 21:59 skrev Mirko Jankovic  > t...@gmail.com>:
> >
> >
> > I do believe that there is still ton of Softimage people that are
> > pushed
> > into hell of maya that would give a leg to have a chance to work
> > again in
> > Softimage so..  :)
> > ᐧ
> >
> > On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:47 PM, David Gallagher Softimage <
> > davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Great work!
> > >
> > > Big high-five for using Softimage still. I do too!
> > > Curious though, how do you handle new employees? Do you only bring
> > > in
> > > people who know Softimage already? I'm just imagining a new
> > > employee
> > > learning your pipeline with EOL software and how they handle that.
> > >
> > >
> > > On 10/24/2017 7:16 AM, Jean-Louis wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi list,
> > >
> > > Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem:
> > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
> > > m.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> > > t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> > > 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=xNkb2
> > > ahCYupFGKwPqnIZyYQ8bR_QW7V_uRaMaaQW44k=
> > > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
> > > em.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
> > > t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> > > 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
> > > lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs=>
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > JL
> > >
> > >
> > > Jean-Louis Billard
> > > -
> > > *Digital Golem*
> > > BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
> > > jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
> > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
> > > m.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> > > t2x0ciWn7KFdC

Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Stefan Kubicek

There are only two kinds of CG artist in the world: Those who use
Softimage, and those who never tried.

S

-Original Message-
From: Morten Bartholdy <x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
Reply-to: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_forum_-23-21forum_xsi-5Flist=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=QE3ckC9GK7WPFXoMa4iFbvFLcjJpaa5u98JrEqLaEuw=;

<softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google=DwIDaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=QlldJiBL18aXEJ17DNGup4yl49-idQLqvaXfTwQeJQ0=NxAaMqkq9iQETVUC7EXDQ2ptrv8PXk3QHLlJlEpq8VQ=
.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Softimage - not going away...
Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 09:20:56 +0200 (CEST)

Amen to that!!

If I knew the people who decided to EOL Soft I would make sure they had
flat tires for a year.
If I knew those who designed Maya I would strongly suggest they admit
themselves to a mental facility.
Oh, and the ones who decided to EOL Softimage I would also flog with
wet newspapers for a year.

I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then
some. After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like
some modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the
viewport - the rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are
blissfully oblivious to how much easier their lives could have been if
things had been different.

Morten

> Den 24. oktober 2017 klokken 21:59 skrev Mirko Jankovic  t...@gmail.com>:
> 
> 
> I do believe that there is still ton of Softimage people that are
> pushed
> into hell of maya that would give a leg to have a chance to work
> again in
> Softimage so..  :)
> ᐧ
> 
> On Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 9:47 PM, David Gallagher Softimage <
> davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > Great work!
> > 
> > Big high-five for using Softimage still. I do too!
> > Curious though, how do you handle new employees? Do you only bring
> > in
> > people who know Softimage already? I'm just imagining a new
> > employee
> > learning your pipeline with EOL software and how they handle that.
> > 
> > 
> > On 10/24/2017 7:16 AM, Jean-Louis wrote:
> > 
> > Hi list,
> > 
> > Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem:
> > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
> > m.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> > t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> > 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=xNkb2
> > ahCYupFGKwPqnIZyYQ8bR_QW7V_uRaMaaQW44k=
> > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
> > em.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
> > t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> > 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
> > lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs=>
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > JL
> > 
> > 
> > Jean-Louis Billard
> > -
> > *Digital Golem*
> > BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
> > jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
> > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgole
> > m.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-
> > t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> > 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zxoKUURPDY_p7pajTkkFnh2ByLCrbBLVKAszjFx6zOA=0_YH6
> > IZI7Lxy5elO-n3Ncs30aXU03EcGQdV8Tua6pek=
> > <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgol
> > em.com_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-
> > t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P
> > 0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-
> > lBeIyA=Gq9YaxWiO1d-lilhxIivNgjNRmHGBXG5pCHGZKI47qE=>
> > 53 Rue Gustave Huberti
> > 1030 Brussels
> > -
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-request@listproc.autodesk.
> > com with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-request@listproc.autodesk.
> > com
> > with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> > 
> 
> 
> 
&g

RE: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread adrian wyer

Looking good Jean-Louis!!

 

i still use Soft every day... "from my cold dead hands" etc etc

 

a

 

Adrian Wyer
Fluid Pictures
4th Floor
4 Bath Place
Rivington Street
London
EC2A 3DR 
++44(0) 207 684 5575 


adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com

www.fluid-pictures.com
<blocked::blocked::blocked::blocked::blocked::https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.fluid-2Dpictures.com_=DwICAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=FyidsWi8FzAx7tX84qr2icUZFjEjPa5zWvj3EfwIr0Q=dc9xY9hpLxqcf4x1JOURSpvRGcoj_aiTpaseDiQj9fg=
>  

 

Fluid Pictures Limited is registered in England and Wales.
Company number:5657815
VAT number: 872 6893 71

  _  

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jean-Louis
Sent: 24 October 2017 14:17
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Softimage - not going away...

 

Hi list,

 

Softimage still alive and well over here at Digital Golem:
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_portfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwICAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=FyidsWi8FzAx7tX84qr2icUZFjEjPa5zWvj3EfwIr0Q=woZb-yjvB68YC-AaliOQSvR1-uFfU3hknWN0-_9t_lM=
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_po
rtfolio_range-2Drover-2Dfireflies_=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a
_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7Hf
KwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-lBeIyA=WurWJJ6SCwAekkwmyOjODKH5Zz2HhLUn46A5Cd-uYjs&
e=> 

 

Cheers,

JL

 

 

Jean-Louis Billard

-

Digital Golem

BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563

jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_=DwICAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=FyidsWi8FzAx7tX84qr2icUZFjEjPa5zWvj3EfwIr0Q=_Zo6qU9hBr85atVkTbK2W_IdQqq0CEvNeH1wan8l6ms=
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_
=DwMFAg=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529Roh
sPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=zX2AFFJUH4U7HfKwQjxPRdohiYSqEOMJ8eEO-lBeIyA=Gq9Y
axWiO1d-lilhxIivNgjNRmHGBXG5pCHGZKI47qE=> 

53 Rue Gustave Huberti

1030 Brussels

-

 

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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread Mirko Jankovic

well software is actual people behind it.. and SI team is destroyed, split
apart and scatter around so... even if by some chance they would sell
it.. but lets get real... it still could't get back on track where it was
so.. yea AD did too good job at killing it..
ᐧ

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 4:29 PM, Michael Amasio 
wrote:

> Something that I find funny and then immediately sad is, if I have a dream
> about winning the lottery or suddenly acquiring a billiion dollars, the
> first thing I fantasize about doing isn't boarding a yacht full of
> beautiful women, buying a mansion, or even helping my aging mother...
>
> ...It's buying soft from AD, making it open source and paying a quality
> support and development team.
>
> On Oct 25, 2017 5:53 AM, "Gerbrand Nel"  wrote:
>
>>
>> > I read the stories by people who had the bad fortune to have to learn
>> Maya earlier and I have to say everything they wrote is true and then some.
>> After 3 months+ of everyday Maya punishment I actually only like some
>> modeling tools and being able to see layered textures in the viewport - the
>> rest is a horrible mess. And our Maya artists are blissfully oblivious to
>> how much easier their lives could have been if things had been different.
>> >
>> >
>> > Morten
>>
>> If you read on, the story splits.
>> Kinda like a "choose your own adventure"
>> Some people choose Maya, and THEY DIE
>> Others choose NOT-Maya and live.
>> Honestly I would rather use bryce and poser.
>> Why not Houdini or Blender, Morten?
>> G
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>



-- 
Mirko Jankovic
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*

Need to find freelancers fast?
www.cgfolio.com

Need some help with rendering an Redshift project?
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

2017-10-25 Thread skuby

Someone over at AD with some common sense should bring it back.  If they
did a cooperate Kickstarter to gauge interest and guarantee paid support
before committing to anything -the investors/executives would be stunned at
the financial response.  Japan and Vancouver markets alone would be enough
to justify a comeback even if they purposely over-priced the software.
Someone should go lobby the top execs about it.

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 5:46 PM, Jean-Louis  wrote:

> Excellent - thanks!
>
>
> Jean-Louis Billard
> -
> *Digital Golem*
> BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
> jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=KPBBzmFScdq7lfT8U8N-exwhQG60oW_DOuMW89SJaqE=uaTUoQFobDwWq3lEns06zuugJf2sP5mrYGQ0tXyGjl8=
> 
> 53 Rue Gustave Huberti
> 1030 Brussels
> -
>
> On 25 Oct 2017, at 12:06, Mirko Jankovic 
> wrote:
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cgfolio.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=KPBBzmFScdq7lfT8U8N-exwhQG60oW_DOuMW89SJaqE=gI_Cm9NR4SChRl_bFi8RHZrVin3GEAX1zZ7FBdaRJ2M=
> 
>
> Just filter out softimage as software and there is a bit of softimage
> people around :)
> This started as kinda list of softimage people on trello but then expanded
> as simple and fast filter to try and find people when needed for specific
> tasks without going through whole ad posting and reply waiting process.
> hope it helps.
> ᐧ
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
>
> --
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> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
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Re: Softimage - not going away...

Excellent - thanks!


Jean-Louis Billard
-
Digital Golem
BE: +32 (0) 484 263 563
jean-lo...@digitalgolem.com
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.digitalgolem.com_=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=wd4Tt_W9ZPlt6aY2d-_XSE8zupUTBK2mKQJfqv9dwO0=cMX_wVaVF5iV0kqTYMFSQFSdq747fhqS4wF9ufD778o=
53 Rue Gustave Huberti
1030 Brussels
-

> On 25 Oct 2017, at 12:06, Mirko Jankovic  wrote:
> 
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.cgfolio.com=DwIFaQ=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA=wd4Tt_W9ZPlt6aY2d-_XSE8zupUTBK2mKQJfqv9dwO0=-lMVXvfh9wePI1vnKrhj8mUbCMiVqM7zRn4Ky95PW6c=
>  
> 
> 
> Just filter out softimage as software and there is a bit of softimage people 
> around :)
> This started as kinda list of softimage people on trello but then expanded as 
> simple and fast filter to try and find people when needed for specific tasks 
> without going through whole ad posting and reply waiting process. 
> hope it helps. 
> ᐧ
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Re: Softimage - not going away...