Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-21 Thread Buddha Buck
At 10:13 AM 08-12-2002 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] you wrote: Jack Campin wrote - OK, I'm with you and it's growing on me. It would be necessary for something I saw the other day which would need to be written [d6z2]2[B2G2][B2G2] although there would still need to be intelligence within

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-13 Thread Laurie (ukonline)
] Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 10:35 AM Subject: Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation something else that's common in piano and guitar music: a hanging tie to the right of a note that means Let this note sound for an unspecified time. There's no way that I know to say

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-13 Thread Henrik Norbeck
Laurie Griffiths wrote: Shortest determines length works because you can always add a rest to delay things, but we don't have negative rests to make things happen sooner. e.g. [G4B]zcd (melody is Bzcd) Or even an invisible rest [G4B]xcd in some cases. Melody note first pretty much demands

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-13 Thread John Chambers
Henrik Norbeck writes: | Laurie Griffiths wrote: | Melody note first pretty much demands shortest determines length (or | else some new mechanism such as numbers after the close bracket) because the | melody note may be longer than the accompaniment. | | Very good point. Indeed. It sounds

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Henrik Norbeck
Laurie Griffiths wrote: Can someone explain why first note determines length is better than shortest determines length. A counter example that doesn;t work the other way would be nice, especially if it were not contrived. Hear, hear! Can anyone find us that example? So two of the most used*

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Jack Campin
Well, I can think of a simple example of how one might use this: [A4G2E2]2[F2D2] This would have a 4-count melody note above the [G2E2][F2D2] chord change. With L:1/8, the first chord could be drawn on a single stem, with an open oval for the A4 note and filled ovals for the G2 and E2

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Jack Campin
There is a lot of abc that would give strange results from the shortest-note rule. Recently someone pointed out that some of my files have notation like [A3G] with no length for the second note. There's a reason for this. It doesn't matter what the reason is, there can't be so

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread John Chambers
Jack writes: | There is a lot of abc that would give strange results from the | shortest-note rule. Recently someone pointed out that some of my | files have notation like [A3G] with no length for the second note. | There's a reason for this. | | It doesn't matter what the

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Laurie (ukonline)
Muse as released does *not* use the shortest note wins rule. In fact it's pretty restrictive which can make it a pain for keyboard users. At the moment I'm doing a major rewrite (called Muse2) which is aimed at 1. Choral singers (better control over playback - done) 2. Keyboard players (live

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread John Chambers
Laurie wrote: | ... In fixing the restrictions on within-staff, | within-voice polyphony - and in particular in trying to type in various | keyboard parts (The Messiah being the biggest) I found that the rule that | seemed to work was shortest note wins. So that is the rule used within | the

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Starling
John Chambers [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: : Starling wrote - : is about. Look at the Subject line. The topic is abc bracketed chord : notation. The melody note in a chord is the one that a monphonic : player plays. There's nothing deeper than that. Alright, I just wanted to get that clear.

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Phil Taylor
I really think we're wasting a lot of time on this. The only use for it is to notate an odd chord or brief passage of double-stopping in a piece which is otherwise monophonic. Anything more complex than this should always be notated using multivoice abc, which lets you define absolutely any

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-12 Thread Laurie (ukonline)
Bryan wrote I know you've been away Laurie but this has been discussed at some length for over a week now. A variety of people have given their reasons and examples. Perhaps if you would care to read the whole thread you could come up with specific reasons why you disagree and why you think

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Starling
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: : Starling wrote - : : I'm afraid that you have come in part way through this discussion. The : proposal is that each individual note should have its specified duration : which left the question open as to what defined the overall length of the : chord, i.e. time

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Phil Taylor
Laurie wrote: I've been transcribing choruses of The Messiah. The voices are of course monophonic, but piano accompaniments have all sorts of nasties. I have found that shortest note determines when next note starts works well. You can always add a rest or two if that's not what you wanted.

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Phil Taylor
Starling wrote: Almost. I had one question. What is a melody note? I have always known melodies as defined by context, and subject to much interpretation, rather than being defined by a specific type of notation. Two different people can call a section of music melody or accompaniment, and

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Laurie (ukonline)
Laurie: I've been transcribing choruses of The Messiah. Phil: If you're doing something that complicated you have to be using multiple voices anyway...to represent the two hands unambiguously. Well Muse has a serious problem in using multiple voices for a piano part. (I would guess Bryan's

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Phil Taylor
Laurie wrote: Well Muse has a serious problem in using multiple voices for a piano part. (I would guess Bryan's Noteworthy to ABC converter would have the same problem). The problem is how do you decide what counts as a voice? This is from near the end of His Yoke is easy and his Burthen is

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Richard Robinson
On Sun, 11 Aug 2002, Phil Taylor wrote: Starling wrote: Almost. I had one question. What is a melody note? I have always known melodies as defined by context, and subject to much interpretation, rather than being defined by a specific type of notation. Two different people can call a

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread John Chambers
Starling wrote - | ... I had one question. What is a melody note? I have always | known melodies as defined by context, and subject to much | interpretation, rather than being defined by a specific type of | notation. Two different people can call a section of music melody or | accompaniment,

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-11 Thread Laurie (ukonline)
Is it legal abc to have a rest in a chord? For instance: X:0 T:Example L:1/8 M:4/2 K:G [zG8 B8 d8]gfe dcBA G8 Failing that we really do need the number on the end like X:1 T:Example L:1/8 M:4/2 K:G [G8 B8 d8]1gfe dcBA G8 Note that one might need single note chords with a length. This leads

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-10 Thread Laurie (ukonline)
- Original Message - From: Phil Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 3:50 PM Subject: Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation Bryan Creer wrote: Henrik Norbeck wrote - The alternatives highest note and first-listed note will cause problems

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-09 Thread John Chambers
Bryan Creer wrote: | Starling (?) wrote - | | It might be better to have the duration of the chord | equal to the shortest duration within the chord. That way | [L:1/4][A4G2E2] is implicitly equal to a half note, just as in | keyboard music the shortest note in the chord is considered the length

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-09 Thread Starling
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: : Starling (?) wrote - : : Whoops! Back to the dawing board. Well that'll teach me for jumping in the middle of a discussion. :) I was going to bring up the subject anyway, so I figured what the heck? I'll just hop in here. Go easy on me though, I have no idea

Re: [abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-08 Thread Starling
John Chambers [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: : Well, I can think of a simple example of how one might use this: : [A4G2E2]2[F2D2] : This would have a 4-count melody note above the [G2E2][F2D2] chord : change. With L:1/8, the first chord could be drawn on a single stem, : with an open oval for

Re: [abcusers] re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation

2002-08-03 Thread Phil Taylor
Bryan Creer : I've gone for highest note prevails in the counting of the times so you can do things like - X:1 T:The Cotillion C:Trad (Bosham Band) M:4/4 L:1/8 K:G [G4D4][d4B,4]|[B2D4]AB [G2B,4]AB|[c2E4]B2[A2D4]G2|[FD4]GAF [D3A,3]D| The trouble with this is that there are an awful lot of