an ultra high level general purpose language today,
we wouldn't use Squeak or any other Smalltalk as a model or a starting place.
Cheers,
Alan
From: karl ramberg karlramb...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
It's worth noting that this was the scheme at PARC and was used heavily later
in Etoys.
This is why Smalltalk has unlimited numbers of Projects. Each one is a
persistant environment that serves both as a place to make things and as a
page of desktop media.
There are no apps, only objects
Kenneth Clarke once remarked that People in the Middle Ages were as
passionately interested in truth as we are, but their sense of evidence was
very different.
Marshall McLuhan said I can't see it until I believe it
Neil Postman once remarked that People today have to accept twice as much on
Check out Smallstar by Dan Halbert at Xerox PARC (written up in a PARC
bluebook)
Cheers,
Alan
From: John Carlson yottz...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Monday, September 9, 2013 3:47 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Software Crisis
From: Paul Homer paul_ho...@yahoo.ca
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org; Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Saturday, September 7, 2013 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Final STEP progress report abandoned?
Hi Alan,
I can't predict
AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Final STEP progress report abandoned?
That's great news! We desperately need fresh air. As you know, the way a
problem is framed bounds its solutions. Do you already know what problems to
work on or are you soliciting proposals?
Jonathan
From: Alan Kay alan.n
of my time right now is being spent in extending environments for
research.
Cheers
Alan
From: Kevin Driedger linuxbox+f...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Monday, September 2, 2013 2:41 PM
Subject
Yes, the communication with aliens problem -- in many different aspects -- is
going to be a big theme for VPRI over the next few years.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Tristan Slominski tristan.slomin...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New
Hi Dan
It actually got written and given to NSF and approved, etc., a while ago, but
needs a little more work before posting on the VPRI site.
Meanwhile we've been consumed by setting up a number of additional, and wider
scale, research projects, and this has occupied pretty much all of my
This is how Smalltalk has always treated its primitives, etc.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Casey Ransberger casey.obrie...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 1:22 PM
Subject: [fonc] Deoptimization as fallback
The only really good -- and reasonable accurate -- book about the history of
Lick, ARPA-IPTO (no D, that is went things went bad), and Xerox PARC is
Dream Machines by Mitchel Waldrop.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Miles Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net
To:
Hi David
This is an interesting slant on a 50+ year old paramount problem (and one that
is even more important today).
Licklider called it the communicating with aliens problem. He said 50 years
ago this month that if we succeed in constructing the 'intergalactic network'
then our main
of
wonderful things in Biology that are out of scale with our computer
technologies. So we should find the things in both Bio and Anthro that will
help us think.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Jeff Gonis jeff.go...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals
) than the ones that need to be dealt with
when trying for human to human or human to alien overlap.
Cheers,
Alan
From: David Barbour dmbarb...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2013
Yep, it had some good ideas.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Francisco Garau fga...@gmail.com
To: fonc@vpri.org fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 12:51 AM
Subject: [fonc] Old Boxer Paper
It reminds me of scratch etoys
thesis I'd love to know
about it. My searches have been fruitless.
Monty
On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 10:04 AM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote:
...
Dave Fisher's thesis A Control Definition Language CMU 1970 is a very
clean approach to thinking about environments for LISP like languages. He
The first ~100 pages are still especially good as food for thought
Cheers,
Alan
From: Duncan Mak duncan...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Cc: mo...@codetransform.com mo...@codetransform.com
Sent
And of course, for some time there has been Croquet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Croquet_project
... and its current manifestation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Cobalt
These are based on Dave Reed's 1978 MIT thesis and were first implemented about
10 years ago at Viewpoints.
Besides
One of the original reasons for message-based was the simple relativistic
one. What we decided is that trying to send messages to explicit receivers had
real scaling problems, whereas receiving messages is a good idea.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Eugen Leitl
,
Alan
From: Jeff Gonis jeff.go...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Cc: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Terminology: Object Oriented vs Message Oriented
I see no one
Hi John
Or you could look at the actual problem a web has to solve, which is to
present arbitrary information to a user that comes from any of several billion
sources. Looked at from this perspective we can see that the current web design
could hardly be more wrong headed. For example, what is
Or the (earlier) Smalltalk Models Views Controllers mechanism which had a
dynamic language with dynamic graphics to allow quite a bit of flexibility with
arbitrary models.
From: David Harris dphar...@telus.net
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals
On 02/14/2013 02:26 AM, Alan Kay wrote:
Hi Thiago
I
think you are on a good path.
One
way to think about this problem is that the broker is a human
programmer who has received a module from half way around the world
that claims to provide important services. The programmer would confine
@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2013 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Design of web, POLs for rules. Fuzz testing nile
Alan Kay wrote:
Or you could look at the actual problem a web has to solve, which is to
present arbitrary information to a user that comes from any of several
billion
My suggestion is to learn a little about biology and anthropology and media as
it intertwines with human thought, then check back in.
From: Miles Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, February 13,
Message Oriented
This question was prompted by a quote by Joe Armstrong about OOP[1].
It is for Alan Kay, but I'm totally fine with a relevant link. Also,
I don't know and I don't have time for this are perfectly okay.
Alan, when the term Object oriented you coined has been hijacked by
Java and Co
easier
than AI, but has some tinges of it.
Got any ideas?
Cheers,
Alan
From: Jeff Gonis jeff.go...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Cc: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc
Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 11:05 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Terminology: Object Oriented vs Message Oriented
Alan Kay wrote:
A little more history ...
The first Smalltalk (-72) was modern (as used below
Looks nice to me!
But no ivory towers around to pillage. (However planting a few seeds is almost
always a good idea)
Cheers,
Alan
From: Charles Perkins ch...@kuracali.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Friday, February 8, 2013 3:52
Yes indeed, I quite agree with David.
One of the main points in the 2012 STEPS report (when I get around to finally
finishing it and getting it out) is exactly David's -- that it is a huge design
task to pull off a good DSL -- actually it is a double design task: you first
need to come up
It turns out that the due date is actually a due interval that starts Jan
1st and extends for a few months ... so we are working on putting the report
together amongst other activities ...
Cheers,
Alan
From: Mathnerd314 mathnerd314@gmail.com
To:
Sliding deadlines very often allow other pursuits to creep in ...
Cheers,
Alan
From: Dale Schumacher dale.schumac...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Friday, January 4, 2013 8:59 AM
Subject: Re
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2013 11:09 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Current topics
On Tue, Jan 1, 2013 at 7:53 AM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote:
As humans, we are used to being sloppy about message creation and sending
The most recent discussions get at a number of important issues whose
pernicious snares need to be handled better.
In an analogy to sending messages most of the time successfully through noisy
channels -- where the noise also affects whatever we add to the messages to
help (and we may have
Oh yes ... I'd forgotten that I'd given this paper to the 1401 restoration
group at the Computer History Museum (the 1401 was my first computer more than
50 years ago now -- it was a bit odd even relative to the more diverse
designs of its day)
http://ibm-1401.info/AlanKay-META-II.html
accomplishments as well, so the destruction was total.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Jarek Rzeszótko jrzeszo...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2012 6:59 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Interview with Alan Kay
Hi,
Very
Hi Carl
Just to keep on saying it ... the STEPS project had/has completely different
goals than the Smalltalk project -- STEPS really is a science project -- or a
collection of science projects -- that has never been aimed at a deployable
artifact, but instead is aimed at finding better and
is quite different
from steel string jazz chops -- it's taken a while to unlearn some spinal
reflexes that were developed a lifetime ago.
Cheers,
Alan
From: John Zabroski johnzabro...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
and faculty and students were very hospitable,
and it was fun to help them dedicate the building.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Eugen Leitl eu...@leitl.org
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 7:19 AM
Subject: [fonc] Alan Kay
feels very different physically, but
also mentally, and has many extra dimensions of nuance and color that is both
its charm, and also makes it quite a separate learning experience.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Long Nguyen cgb...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n
From: Shawn Morel shawnmo...@me.com
To: Kevin Jones investtcart...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Cc: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 6:50 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Question about the Burroughs B5000 series and
apability
(Hi Toby)
And don't forget that John McCarthy was one of the very first to try to
automatically compute inverses of functions (this grew out of his PhD work at
Princeton in the mid-50s ...)
Cheers,
Alan
From: Toby Schachman t...@alum.mit.edu
To:
=sM1bNR4DmhU .:( Mom Loved Him Best - w/ Alan
in the audience! ):.
cheers*
Jb
Le 20 avr. 2012 à 03:20, Fernando Cacciola a écrit :
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 9:43 PM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote:
Well, part of it is that the 15 year old was exceptional -- his name is
Steve Putz
Well, part of it is that the 15 year old was exceptional -- his name is Steve
Putz, and as with several others of our children programmers -- such as Bruce
Horn, who was the originator of the Mac Finder -- became a very good
professional.
And that Smalltalk (basically Smalltalk-72) was quite
This is a good idea (and, interestingly, was a common programming style in the
first Simula) ...
Cheers,
Alan
From: David Barbour dmbarb...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 11:03 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc]
Hi John
The simple answer is that Tom's stuff happened in the early 80s, and I was out
of PARC working on things other than Smalltalk.
I'm trying to remember something similar that was done earlier (by someone
can't recall who, maybe at CMU) that was a good convincer that this was not a
Yes, that was part of Tom's work ...
Cheers,
Alan
From: John Zabroski johnzabro...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org; Alan Kay
alan.n...@yahoo.com
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 4:46 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Kernel Maru
What does
The survey paper is just a survey. Dave's thesis is how to make all the control
structure by extending a McCarthy like tiny kernel. Still gold today.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Eugene Wallingford walli...@cs.uni.edu
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 9:06 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Kernel Maru
This one seems to be available as a technical report as well:
http://infolab.stanford.edu/TR/CS-TR-65-20.html
Monty
On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 4:44 AM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote:
One more
,
Alan
From: Shawn Morel shawnmo...@me.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Cc: Florin Mateoc fmat...@yahoo.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2012 11:52 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Kernel Maru
This thread is a real treasure
Croquet does replicated distributed computing. LOCUS did freely migrating
system nodes.
One actually needs both (though a lot can be done with today's capacities just
using the Croquet techniques).
Cheers,
Alan
From: Shawn Morel shawnmo...@me.com
To: Alan
Hi Julian
(Adding to Ian's comments)
Doing as Ian suggests and trying out variants can be an extremely illuminating
experience (for example, BBN Lisp (1.85) had three or four choices for what was
meant by a lambda closure -- three of the options I remember were (a) do
Algol -- this is
One of the motivations is to handle some kinds of scaling more gracefully. If
you think about things from a module's point of view, the fewer details it has
to know about resources it needs (and about its environment in general) the
better.
It can be thought of as a next stage in going from
Hi Benoit
This is basically what publish and subscribe schemes are all about. Linda is
a simple coordination protocol for organizing such loose couplings. There are
sketches of such mechanisms in most of the STEPS reports
Spreadsheets are simple versions of this
The Playground language
] Barbarians at the gate! (Project Nell)
On 15/03/2012 14:20, Alan Kay wrote:
Alex Warth did both a standard Prolog and an English based language one using
OMeta in both Javascript, and in Smalltalk.
I must have a look at these. Thanks for all of the references. I was
working my way through
...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2012 10:13 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] [IAEP] Barbarians at the gate! (Project Nell)
On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 5:23 AM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote:
You don't want to use assert
, March 15, 2012 3:59 PM
Subject: [fonc] Dynabook ideas
Le 15/03/2012 00:44, Alan Kay a écrit :
To me the Dynabook has always been 95% a service model and 5% physical
specs (there were three main physical ideas for it, only one was the
tablet).
Err, what those ideas were? I have seen videos of you
/iPad has persuaded them
that this will be (commercially) viable as a model for general public
distribution of trustable software.
In that world, the Squeak plugin could be certified as safe to download in a
way that System Admins might believe.
On Feb 29, 2012, at 3:09 PM, Alan Kay wrote
Hi Scott
This seems like a plan that should be done and tried and carefully evaluated. I
think the approach is good. It could be not quite enough to work, but it
should give rise to a lot of useful information for further passes at this.
1. Psychologist O.K. Moore in the early 60s at Yale and
...@laptop.org
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Cc: IAEP SugarLabs i...@lists.sugarlabs.org; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org; Viewpoints Research a...@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [IAEP] [fonc] Barbarians at the gate! (Project Nell)
On Wed, Mar 14
:17 AM
Subject: [fonc] Apple and hardware (was: Error trying to compile COLA)
Alan Kay wrote on Wed, 14 Mar 2012 05:53:21 -0700 (PDT)
A hardware vendor with huge volumes (like Apple) should be able to get a CPU
vendor to make HW that offers real protection, and at a granularity that
makes
more
martin.mccl...@vmware.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Cc: Viewpoints Research a...@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:26 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Talking Typwriter [was: Barbarians at the gate! (Project
Nell)]
On 03/14/2012 09:54 AM, Alan Kay wrote:
1. Psychologist O.K
)
Alan Kay wrote on Wed, 14 Mar 2012 11:36:30 -0700 (PDT)
Yep, I was there and trying to get the Newton project off the awful ATT chip
they had first chosen.
Interesting - a few months ago I studied the datasheets for the Hobbit
and read all the old CRISP papers and found this chip rather cute
71 apart so dramatically. -Shaun
On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com wrote:
Hi Scott --
1. I will see if I can get one of these scanned for you. Moore tended to
publish in journals and there is very little of his stuff available on line.
2.a. if (ab
Admins might believe.
On Feb 29, 2012, at 3:09 PM, Alan Kay wrote:
Windows (especially) is so porous that SysAdmins (especially in school
districts) will not allow teachers to download .exe files. This wipes out the
Squeak plugin that provides all the functionality.
But there is still the browser
Hi Loup
Someone else said that about links.
Browsing about either knowing where you are (and going) and/or about dealing
with a rough max of 100 items. After that search is necessary.
However, Ted Nelson said a lot in each of the last 5 decades about what kinds
of linking do the most good.
My friend Peter Norvig is the Director of Research at Google.
I told him that I had heard of an astounding jump in the penetration of
Chrome.
He says the best numbers they have at present is that Chrome is 20% to 30%
penetrated ...
Cheers,
Alan
don't know. It could even be domain-dependent.)
I agree however that having both (POLs + tools) would be much better,
and is definitely worth pursuing. I'll think about it.
Loup.
Alan Kay wrote:
With regard to your last point -- making POLs -- I don't think we are
there yet. It is most
From: Duncan Mak duncan...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, February 29, 2012 11:50 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Error trying to compile COLA
Hello Alan,
On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 4:30 PM, Alan Kay alan.n
trying to compile COLA
Alan Kay wrote:
Hi Loup
As I've said and written over the years about this project, it is not
possible to compare features in a direct way here.
Yes, I'm aware of that. The problem rises when I do advocacy. A
response I often get is but with only 20,000 lines
Hi Reuben
Yep. One of the many finesses in the STEPS project was to point out that
requiring OSs to have drivers for everything misses what being networked is all
about. In a nicer distributed systems design (such as Popek's LOCUS), one would
get drivers from the devices automatically, and
of these ideas were done better later. I think by Leler, and
certainly by Joe Goguen, and others.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Jakob Praher ja...@praher.info
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 12:52 PM
Hi Julian
I should probably comment on this, since it seems that the STEPS reports
haven't made it clear enough.
STEPS is a science experiment not an engineering project.
It is not at all about making and distributing an operating system etc., but
about trying to investigate the tradeoffs
to
receive messages, but should not have to send to explicit receivers. This is a
kind of multi-cast I guess (but I think of it more like publish/subscribe).
Cheers,
Alan
From: Tony Garnock-Jones tonygarnockjo...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Hi Tony
I like what the BOOM/BLOOM people are doing quite a bit. Their version of
Datalog + Time is definitely in accord with lots of our prejudices ...
Cheers,
Alan
From: Tony Garnock-Jones tonygarnockjo...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Cc
...@loup-vaillant.fr
To: fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 1:29 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Raspberry Pi
Jecel Assumpcao Jr. wrote:
Alan Kay wrote:
We have done very little of this so far, and very few optimizations. We can
give
live dynamic demos in part because Dan Amelang's Nile
--
for Problem Oriented Languages) is why we took this approach.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Loup Vaillant l...@loup-vaillant.fr
To: fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Raspberry Pi
Alan Kay wrote:
Hi Loup
Actually, your last guess
Hi Jecel
In the difference between research and engineering department I think I would
first port a version of Smalltalk to this system.
One of the fun side-projects done in the early part of the Squeak system was
when John Maloney and a Berkeley grad student ported Squeak to a luggage tag
Yes, Jack was a driving force and quite a character in so many ways.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Long Nguyen cgb...@gmail.com
To: fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Thursday, December 22, 2011 9:47 AM
Subject: [fonc] PARC founder Jacon Goldman dies at 90
to be used).
Cheers,
Alan
From: Casey Ransberger casey.obrie...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 9:07 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] History of computing talks at SJSU
Below.
On Dec
looking to hear more from Alan Kay -- you'll find a talk
from him and several other big names in computer science here -- thanks to
San Jose State University.
http://www.sjsu.edu/atn/services/webcasting/archives/fall_2011/hist/computing.html
-- Kim
loved that little system. This led to the ST-72
eval really being a kind of cascaded apply ...
And there's no question that once
you aim at real objects a distributed eval makes great sense.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Carl Hewitt hew...@concurrency.biz
To: Alan Kay
Schumacher dale.schumac...@gmail.com
Cc: Programming Language Design pi...@googlegroups.com; The Friday Morning
Applied Complexity Coffee Group fr...@redfish.com;
computational-actors-gu...@googlegroups.com
computational-actors-gu...@googlegroups.com; Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com;
Fundamentals
We've already discussed this in other contexts. This is what I meant when I
talked about levels of meta and why invoking a function is more benign than
using a global assignment (which is tantamount to redefining a function under
program control), etc.
And certainly to allow unprotected
Yep.
Cheers,
Alan
From: David Barbour dmbarb...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2011 1:50 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Tension between meta-object protocol and encapsulation
On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 12:48 PM,
I hate to be the one to bring this up, but this has always been a feature of
all the Smalltalks ... one has to ask, what is there about current general
practice that makes this at all remarkable? ...
Cheers,
Alan
From: Murat Girgin gir...@gmail.com
To:
PhDs in the 60s when he was an ARPA funder).
Cheers,
Alan
From: Jecel Assumpcao Jr. je...@merlintec.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Cc: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Thursday, September 1, 2011 3:17 PM
Subject: a little more FLEXibility
=93gCOAAACAAJ
Cheers,
Alan
From: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
To: Jecel Assumpcao Jr. je...@merlintec.com
Cc: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Friday, September 2, 2011 8:23 AM
Subject: Re: a little more FLEXibility (was: [fonc] Re: Ceres
I'm so glad I never read this before (and am looking for ways to forget that I
just did )
Cheers,
Alan
From: John Zabroski johnzabro...@gmail.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Cc: Jecel Assumpcao Jr. je
Subject: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon
Alan Kay wrote:
I'm glad that he has finally come to appreciate OOP.
There are two kinds of people on this list. Those who can tell when Alan
is joking and those that can't. :-D
Don't know which I am but I can at least say that the OOP that is in
Oberon
From: Eduardo Cavazos wayo.cava...@gmail.com
To: fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 12:54 AM
Subject: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon
Alan Kay wrote:
I'm glad that he has finally come to appreciate OOP.
There are two kinds of people on this list. Those who can
From: Jecel Assumpcao Jr. je...@merlintec.com
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon
Alan,
thanks for the detailed history!
1966 was the year I entered grad school (having
I'm glad that he has finally come to appreciate OOP.
Cheers,
Alan
From: Jakob Praher ja...@praher.info
To: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com; Fundamentals of New Computing
fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Ceres and Oberon
(For example)
Try to imagine a system where the parts only receive messages but never
explicitly send them.
This is one example of what I meant when I requested that computer people pay
more attention to what is in between the parts, than to the parts -- the
Japanese have a great short word
One way to try to think about the idea of Lisp and the larger interesting
issues, is to read the Advice Taker paper by John McCarthy (ca. 56-58
Programs With Common Sense) which is what got him thinking about interactive
intelligent agents, and got him to start thinking about creating a
ight travel, cool space ship, 3d printers, alien super brain race that had disappeared (the Krell), monsters from the ID.To me Lisp is like
something created by the Krell. "As though my ape's brain could contain the secrets of the Krell."I asked John if he had seen the movie and he had.
Take a look at Landin's papers and especially ISWIM (The next 700 programming
languages)
You don't so much want to learn Lisp as to learn the idea of Lisp
Cheers,
Alan
From: karl ramberg karlramb...@gmail.com
To: Fundamentals of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
of New Computing fonc@vpri.org
Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2011 10:33 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] Physics and Types
Oh awesome! Thank you both. That's got to be one of the single most
profound uses of computers I've ever run across.
Warm regards,
~Simon
On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 6:19 PM, Alan Kay alan.n
, Aug 05, 2011 at 03:43:04AM -0700, BGB wrote:
On 8/4/2011 6:19 PM, Alan Kay wrote:
Here's the link to the paper
[1]http://www.vpri.org/pdf/rn2005001_learning.pdf
inference:
it is not that basic math and physics are fundamentally so difficult to
understand
: Alan Kay alan.n...@yahoo.com
Sent: Sat, July 30, 2011 3:09:39 PM
Subject: Re: [fonc] HotDraw's Tool State Machine Editor
On Thursday 28 Jul 2011 10:27:26 PM Alan Kay wrote:
Well, we don't absolutely need music notation, but it really helps many
things. We don't need the various notations
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