[Vo]:Ecat production will be robotized...

2012-01-11 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hi all, Rossi made the following statement on his journal: /Andrea Rossi January 10th, 2012 at 4:05 PM/ /Dear Keith W: We are making the certification . Attention: I did not say that we will begin to deliver in August, I said we can be ready to make order confirmations

Re: [Vo]:Ecat production will be robotized...

2012-01-11 Thread Wolf Fischer
. Not as good as the 35th of May. Peter On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 3:57 PM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Hi all, Rossi made the following statement on his journal: /Andrea Rossi January 10th, 2012 at 4:05 PM/ /Dear Keith W

Re: [Vo]:Ecat production will be robotized...

2012-01-11 Thread Wolf Fischer
you not agree with what I have stated and I am ready to discuss - with pleasure. Robotization is good, the great drawback is that you need robots. Peter On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 4:22 PM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Dear Peter, could you elaborate

Re: [Vo]:video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion)

2012-01-12 Thread Wolf Fischer
It is even directly featured on the Technologygateway main site: http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/ On the right, headlined with the words: *NASA's Method for a Clean Nuclear Energy For Your Power Operated Technology http://technologygateway.nasa.gov/media/CC/lenr/lenr.html* Wolf David, I

Re: [Vo]:video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion)

2012-01-12 Thread Wolf Fischer
I didn't follow the discussions on the potential catalyst here (as I am no physicist), but could carbon be the missing ingredient (as C is being mentioned in the video)? Have there ever been publications on a H-Ni-C LENR experiment? Or is this something that NASA is working on and hasn't

Re: [Vo]:I wish Krivit would come out of the closet pertaining to the WL theory

2012-01-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
Excellent post! I wondered about Krivits behavior too. Some days ago I wanted to post a comment on one of his articles, where he started to repeat himself. I just wanted to show what I think of Rossi and his behavior (just to give a little IMHO reasonable counter weight to his article) and how

Re: [Vo]:video from NASA about lenr (cold fusion)

2012-01-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
I am a little bit surprised to see such comments... The technologygateway is not intended for scientists or for details on science which is going on at NASA. It is for showing the / a broader public what NASA is doing. It's a kind of advertisement place for NASA to a broader public! This is,

Re: [Vo]:Rossi : customer can refill

2012-01-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
Also if it is just an extra dose of powder: How do you contain the vacuum..? What kind of cheap and save mechanism could it be to contain the vacuum? Or to create a new one after refueling? Or will the reactor core completely be replaced and recycled in a factory? Wolf At a minimum a

Re: [Vo]:Request volunteer assistance revamping LENR-CANR.org website

2012-01-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hi Jed, I think, what you are looking for, is a Content Management System (CMS), e.g. Joomla http://www.joomla.org/, which is free and seems to have a nice and big community. Once you have a layout (there are also websites which provide free standard and minimalistic layouts), you can easily

Re: [Vo]:1MW delay

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
Didn't Ampenergo put some cash into Rossi last year in May? Here it is: http://www.e-catworld.com/2011/05/fast-facts-about-ampenergo-andrea-rossis-north-and-south-american-commercial-partner/ Wolf On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 8:30 PM, Alan J Fletchera...@well.com wrote: January 13th, 2012 at

Re: [Vo]:1MW delay

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
Where did you get the information that the customer sent the 1MW plant back? Are you an employee of the customer? (as you mention the word we) Wolf Why read something else into this? LOL. You must be joking. Because Rossi spoke it, for one thing - and because it is misleading for another,

Re: [Vo]:1MW delay

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
: Wolf Fischer Where did you get the information that the customer sent the 1MW plant back? Are you an employee of the customer? (as you mention the word we) Wolf Why read something else into this? LOL. You must be joking. Because Rossi spoke it, for one thing - and because it is misleading

Re: [Vo]:1MW delay

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
. Rossi has mentioned the N-word before. Another clue is that the report - which others on vortex know about, apparently comes out of Brussels. A hint: there could be some kind of Payola involved. Use the Italian spelling.g -Original Message- From: Wolf Fischer Thanks for the info! Can you

Re: [Vo]:1MW delay

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hi AG, Jones gave a lot of hints in his answer to my questions 4:30 hours earlier. The customers name seems to start with N, is an organization in Brussel, Rossi also once mentioned the name in the context of the 28th october 1MW test while talking about the Colonel (my guess, the name has

Re: [Vo]:1MW delay

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
the plant. Later he stated, he, the customer's engineer and NI are working on the advanced control system and they have made excellent progress. AG On 1/15/2012 9:17 AM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Hi AG, Jones gave a lot of hints in his answer to my questions 4:30 hours earlier. The customers name

[Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show

2012-01-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hi there, Rossi was just on the Smart Scarecrow Show. There were some new information / clarification (although I can't remember them all; the information below should be correct however I sometimes had problems understanding Rossi because of a pretty low audio quality and me not being a

Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show

2012-01-15 Thread Wolf Fischer
On 1/15/2012 10:29 AM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Hi there, Rossi was just on the Smart Scarecrow Show. There were some new information / clarification (although I can't remember them all; the information below should be correct however I sometimes had problems understanding Rossi because of a pretty

Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show

2012-01-15 Thread Wolf Fischer
-Cat has a 30 year expected life. Customer price between $400 to $500 for a home E-Cat 10 kW thermal unit. AG On 1/15/2012 10:29 AM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Hi there, Rossi was just on the Smart Scarecrow Show. There were some new information / clarification (although I can't remember them all

Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show

2012-01-15 Thread Wolf Fischer
Mary, aren't you getting tired of repeating yourself all the time? Wolf Mary Yugo maryyu...@gmail.com schrieb: On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 3:34 PM, Alan Fletcher wrote: Last I heard, Rossi was still saying you need a WATER line to the eCat. I hope that's changed. If it hasn't, I'm sure it

Re: [Vo]:Rossi on the Smart Scarecrow Show

2012-01-16 Thread Wolf Fischer
Can't this type of gamma rays be shielded (I think he meant 511 keV gammas)? Using google I found, e.g., the following (although I don't know how well the shielding works): http://www.corning.com/specialtymaterials/products_capabilities/radiation_shielding_glass/Med_Pet.aspx Further here

Re: [Vo]:Forbes and Gibbs Garbage: NASA says Cold Fusion is Nothing Useful

2012-01-17 Thread Wolf Fischer
This depends on how you classify the statement. If you expected it to help in the Rossi case, sure, it's not useful. But this was not NASA intentions. In the other case, where they are promoting LENR, this is tremendously helpful / useful. Therefore, I think, Gibbs headline is misleading and

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
S.A., thanks for the vid! I have taken the liberty of creating a little collage where I try to compare pictures of the different 1 MW units which I have found (one version from mid september, one from the beginning of october, then the 1MW plant from the end of october as well as the newest

Re: [Vo]:New Krivit Stuff : National Instruments

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
The National Instruments press release (although interesting) is quite old (from November 14th). Here is the original: http://digital.ni.com/worldwide/bwcontent.nsf/websearch/2c6b449a3f0f8f3a862579480060a07f Wolf At 12:19 PM 1/18/2012, Akira Shirakawa wrote: On 2012-01-18 21:12, Alan J

Re: [Vo]:New Krivit Stuff

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
I don't like Krivits behavior, still: Why don't they just throw him out / cancel his membership / whatsoever? Shouldn't be too difficult, or? Also, if information should be kept confidential, then why post it on any kind of semi-public forum? Wolf It wouldn't be the first time that Krivit

Re: [Vo]:Congress responds quickly to opposition to SOPA and PIPA -- how this relates to cold fusion

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
Jed, I agree with you that it all depends on how fast the LENR community gets the truth out. Therefore, as much as I would prefer your scenario over Eds, getting the truth out is exactly the problem IMHO: The media will brainwash people and the big energy lobby will brainwash the

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
Just some speculation from my side, but I think that the reactor has been moved at least once. In the following video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t19C-7WJPTMfeature=related taken from the october 28th, the camera man starts at the back of the BBB and then moves along the left side of the

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
I did some further analysis of the picture and I am now pretty sure that the Ecat has either NOT been moved or it has been put back to exactly the same position. I have reuploaded the picture in the following link: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/696/ecatcollage.png/ The important stuff is

RE: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
I think, this is the first time for me that Rossi was caught in a direct lie... Or is it just me, remembering Rossi saying that the container had been shipped? Of course this also sheds some light on all the insider sources ;) Or Rossi is lieing again... Wolf -- Diese Nachricht wurde von

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
I searched a little bit online. I can find some websites claiming that the Ecat was delivered to the customer. However I am not capable of finding a statement from Rossi where he says that the plant had been delivered to the customer. Just that the customer is happy and so on... Wolf I

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
AG, Can you give us a link where he said that? I can't find any except for some websites (not directly related to Rossi) which say so. Wolf EL, Rossi has stated the plant was shipped and installed in the customers US location and that he attended to do the install. AG On 19/01/2012

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
(hiring) in the US? Best wishes, Luke Mortensen AG On 19/01/2012 10:38 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: AG, Can you give us a link where he said that? I can't find any except for some websites (not directly related to Rossi) which say so. Wolf

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
I think, this is actually one of the better explanations pro Rossi so far that I have heard of... Then the question remains where he did build the other 1MW cats..? In the US directly? And the more general question to me is, why he has a place in Italy at all if he is seemingly doing most the

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
Frank, Thanks for the info! Just for verification: When did you write Rossi the Mail and when was has this same interpretation been posted here on vortex? There was a user which thought of the same interpretation... Wolf I emailed Andrea Rossi this morning about this issue and recieved the

Re: [Vo]:Interesting new video from ecat.com

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
. On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:30 AM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Frank, Thanks for the info! Just for verification: When did you write Rossi the Mail and when was has this same interpretation been posted here on vortex? There was a user which

Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
Some of us tried to find where he said that the thing was shipped. The only thing that we found was his answer on the question Is it gone? -- Yes. The question leaves a little room for interpretation in my opinion, but really - it's only very little room... Wolf On 12-01-19 10:11 AM, Jed

Re: [Vo]:Rossi's behavior is more tragic than deceptive

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
Mary, NI is not publishing _such_ a press release on any NI customer (again: Remember the mentioning of CERN / LHC in the same section as Leonardo Corporation). We had this topic here before. Wolf On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 11:28 AM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com

Re: [Vo]:Rossi's behavior is more tragic than deceptive

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
Jed, Great statement! And (just to point this one out again): The cherry on the pie in the press release is the mentioning of CERN / LHC in the sentence prior to the one about Leonardo Corporation / Rossi. Wolf Chemical Engineer cheme...@gmail.com mailto:cheme...@gmail.com wrote: As

Re: [Vo]:Lewan Mats says he never thought the reactor shipped

2012-01-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
Jed, you have to admit that it just must be difficult for some people to believe in Rossi because of the way he behaves (and therefore also separating the behavior from his claimed inventions as this requires some abstract and very rational thinking, no harm intended). The fact that you have

Re: [Vo]:Ian Bryce and Rossi

2012-01-21 Thread Wolf Fischer
Shaun, Bryce may be well respected but he is doing a very poor job regarding his research on the technology (and LENR in general). Regarding his calculation: This is also no prove of Rossi conducting a scam but just leaves the possibility that there could still be something else going on. And

Re: [Vo]:Ian Bryce and Rossi

2012-01-21 Thread Wolf Fischer
:) There are still perfectly valid interpretations for both sides of the coin. Wolf On 21/01/2012 11:01 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Shaun, Bryce may be well respected but he is doing a very poor job regarding his research on the technology (and LENR in general). Regarding his calculation: This is also

Re: [Vo]:Re: Rossi and the 6 Oct data is so busted

2012-01-22 Thread Wolf Fischer
Shaun, I don't know if you know the following thread but this topic has been analyzed before: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg52981.html Further, Rossi answered to a question regarding the thermocouple placement: http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg52669.html

Re: [Vo]:Re: Rossi and the 6 Oct data is so busted

2012-01-22 Thread Wolf Fischer
Shaun, I didn't say anything about believing or not Rossi. I was more kind of questioning if this topic has to be discussed once more. Wolf On 22/01/2012 10:15 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Shaun, I don't know if you know the following thread but this topic has been analyzed before: http

Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog

2012-01-22 Thread Wolf Fischer
This is were you clearly crossed the line. Get some air and do something else besides insulting people and repeating yourself! Wolf You are not very bright are you Jed. *From:* Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com *To:*

Re: [Vo]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog

2012-01-22 Thread Wolf Fischer
]:University testing of the E-cat question asked on Rossi blog +1 On 01/22/2012 07:45 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: This is were you clearly crossed the line. Get some air and do something else besides insulting people and repeating yourself! Wolf You are not very bright are you Jed

Re: [Vo]:The 1MW container is not from old footage.

2012-01-22 Thread Wolf Fischer
Yup. The way they argue I think Shaun Taylor and Eff Wivakeef are actually the same persons... I think I might also start creating a kill list like Jed although perhaps there is a time when one of both might actually have something worthwhile to contribute to a discussion (although this seems

Re: [Vo]:insightful and concise...

2012-01-24 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hi Mark, there have been two different news lately: The first one being that Ampenergo seemingly has gone inactive (although I don't know what this exactly means, if this is even the company which is related to Leonardo, how this would affect Rossi, etc.): http://ecatnews.com/?p=1897 Second:

Re: [Vo]:Rossi's Best Chance

2012-01-24 Thread Wolf Fischer
being the first to market it commercially. Rossi is his own worse enemy.It may be as Jed said that he could be doing this deliberately to keep people off his back and to keep competitors from homing in. On 24/01/12 12:18, Vorl Bek wrote: Wolf Fischer wrote: there have been two different news

Re: [Vo]:Rossi's Best Chance

2012-01-24 Thread Wolf Fischer
Jones, I also agree. However one question: Why does DGTs reactor provide an inferior ratio? As far as I remember, DGT claims a COP larger than 20 for a single reactor, whereas Rossi speaks of 6. Wolf Thank you, Robert. This is essentially what I have been saying for many weeks: Rossi has

Re: [Vo]:A huge Rossi (bad) thing to be revealed soon. (Daniele Passerini)

2012-01-29 Thread Wolf Fischer
On the LENR Facebook page, someone wrote that it perhaps is not a bad thing but more of a joke: http://www.facebook.com/EnergyCatalyzer Giuliano Bettini @Patrick. It's not properly a "bad news". In Italian it's something like a joke IMO

Re: [Vo]:Ni-64 enrichment

2012-01-30 Thread Wolf Fischer
Jones, if they don't know Rossis catalyst - why do they allow independent parties to test the reactor? They seem to be pretty sure about what they are doing. Perhaps they are just trying to optimize the reaction? Wolf This thread on isotopic enrichment of nickel, from a couple of weeks

[Vo]:Ian Bryce's Agenda

2012-01-31 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hi Vortex, as it seems, Ian Bryce got hold of the possiblities of the Internet and tries to spread his word... He makes appearances in some of the Ecat-News-Site's comment sections as well as, e.g., on the Defkalion forum. To be honest - i am a little bit surprised by the effort that he puts

Re: [Vo]:Sterling Allan / S-African Free Fuel Generator FFG trip

2012-02-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
I don't understand the comment about the amount of Hydrogen being consumend by a 5KW unit... Does Defkalion really not know how much Hydrogen it consumes if running at full power for 6 month? About the temperature: I think this is quite interesting as Rossi somewhen stated that his reaction

Re: [Vo]:Sterling Allan / S-African Free Fuel Generator FFG trip

2012-02-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
Thank you for the clarification! Wolf I believe the hydrogen loss they are referring to is centered about hydrogen containment, not hydrogen consumption. As for Rossi's 60°C reaction point, that was the temperature of his surrounding water during the EK testing. At around 60°C water temp,

Re: [Vo]:Defkalion GT willing to accept Dick Smith's offer + Official tests info

2012-02-18 Thread Wolf Fischer
It seems to me as Dick Smith doesn't want to understand what Defkalion offers: http://ecatnews.com/?p=2068 Where do they talk of a minimum COP of 3? They just say, that 3 will definitely be met and even surpassed... This is totally in line with the proclaimed COP of 20 and above as Defkalion

Re: [Vo]:NI and Rossi not related anymore

2012-02-19 Thread Wolf Fischer
Hm if NI was working under an NDA they would use another choice of words to deny a relationship with Rossi, I think, wouldn't they? Betts words are pretty clear (if it is correct what Krivit states on NET) and do not seem to leave much room for interpretation... Further as they explicitly

Re: [Vo]:[JONP] About Leonardo Corp. property + end of partnership with NI

2012-02-20 Thread Wolf Fischer
Some weeks ago, Rossi said that NI, he and the customer were working together on the 1MW plant. And now the customer wants something different? Why change a running system (if it ever was running)? And why is it important to the customer, which company supplies the controlling mechanism for a

Re: [Vo]:[JONP] About Leonardo Corp. property + end of partnership with NI

2012-02-22 Thread Wolf Fischer
, Feb 20, 2012 at 7:42 AM, Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Some weeks ago, Rossi said that NI, he and the customer were working together on the 1MW plant. And now the customer wants something different? Why change a running system (if it ever

Re: [Vo]:Test day in Greece time

2012-02-24 Thread Wolf Fischer
I wonder where the test protocols are... It's by now nearly 16:00 in Athens, so when do the tests start? The protocols should be published before the tests begin AFAIK. The way i see it (thanks to Jed) the first paper about Ni-H goes back to 1979, and the first Focardi paper about Ni-H was

Re: [Vo]:Test day in Greece time

2012-02-24 Thread Wolf Fischer
. also maybe the testers don't wan't to be identified before the test succeed to avoid looking ridiculous... cold fusion is really frightening for corp and officials... I feel like a kid waiting for santa klaus in front of the chimney. 2012/2/24 Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc

Re: [Vo]:Andrea Rossi and Siemens working together.and more

2012-02-26 Thread Wolf Fischer
As long as there is not at least a press release from Siemens about this, i wouldn't consider this being more than some very early discussions about a potential future working relation. Wolf

[Vo]:Defkalion closes forum

2012-02-29 Thread Wolf Fischer
http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4t=1278sid=5d586d1c2c35f0d82953353c6d922a99 Understandable on one side, however what did they expect with those actions which they took?... Wolf

Re: [Vo]:More Rosey Piccys

2012-07-17 Thread Wolf Fischer
This again looks like the exact same container at the exact same spot as from last october. Shouldn't this one have been shipped by now? Wolf Along with his Behemoth: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=257289961053144set=a.257289254386548.58520.255415831240557type=3permPage=1

Re: [Vo]:More Rosey Piccys

2012-07-17 Thread Wolf Fischer
Sorry, my bad. They're from february... nothing new here. 2012/7/17 Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de This again looks like the exact same container at the exact same spot as from last october. Shouldn't this one have been shipped by now? Wolf

[Vo]:Re: [Vo]:Rossi’s E-Cat Technology to be Presented in Zurich, Switzerland on September 8-9

2012-08-01 Thread Wolf Fischer
It seems to be that none of the speakers is from a company with reputation... Not a good sign in my opinion. Wolf Hello group, This is via E-CW (as most of the text below). In a different thread here on Vortex-L I hinted that a conference which might involve Rossi and his products would be

Re: [Vo]:Defkalion GT at NIWeek2012

2012-08-09 Thread Wolf Fischer
Did they say anything new? The audio quality is pretty bad, so I didn't understand everything: They are a) Talking to several countries (79 if I remember correctly) b) Trying to build production lines (which might take several years? I thought they were already building one...) c) Are they

Re: [Vo]:The secret colonel of 1MW powerplant is the leaker of the 1000C photo

2012-08-11 Thread Wolf Fischer
Did anybody read the 100+ mails between Roger Green, the Australian E-Cat licencee and Robert K. on shutdownrossi.com? http://shutdownrossi.com/?page_id=759 Just some more hints as to how the scam might work... Wolf So, he's a NATO Colonel, a Professor, an engineer the secret customer (used

Re: [Vo]:The secret colonel of 1MW powerplant is the leaker of the 1000C photo -- SHUTDOWN ROSSI

2012-08-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
Roger Green will be one of the presenters at the Ecat gathering / conference in September in Zurich, so there seems to / must? be some stronger connection between Rossi and him... http://www.borderlands.de/Links/Kongress080912M-e.pdf Wolf Wasn’t impressed with the shutdownrossi.com site...

Re: [Vo]:no evidence yet of safety certificate.

2012-09-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
Still - didn't SGS have to test this prototype in some way to find out if it runs within their safety parameters? How did they run these tests? Wolf Akira Shirakawa shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com mailto:shirakawa.ak...@gmail.com wrote . . . or translated, I guess, the small print: This

Re: [Vo]:no evidence yet of safety certificate.

2012-09-13 Thread Wolf Fischer
Out of curiosity: Has there ever been a scam in which a safety certificate from a big and independent organization has been granted? Wolf At 02:58 PM 9/13/2012, Craig Haynie wrote: Can someone confirm the power output? The certificate says: Power In: 200 kw (max) Power Out: 1MW Water flow

Re: [Vo]:no evidence yet of safety certificate.

2012-09-14 Thread Wolf Fischer
Thanks for this answer! Very informative! On a side note: The shutdownrossi.com site has been deleted. I of course don't know why, perhaps it has been hacked... ;) Wolf Wolf Fischer wolffisc...@gmx.de mailto:wolffisc...@gmx.de wrote: Out of curiosity: Has there ever been a scam