This is interesting, and i think it mostly revolves around making
certain things clear beforehand.
Notice that whenever you do the math based on what an employee's rate
would be, you always come up
with ridiculously low sums of money from a freelance perspective.
At first glance, 100 eur/day to me feels like borderline insulting for
a freelance rate.
But, if we do a little basic math, at that rate, an employee would get
2k / month, and that includes healthcare and vacation. Which for
eastern european standards, is a very good salary.
Now as a freelancer, jobs are usually scarce (except if u're on a
roll, which i don't think happens that often).
So you need to plan your lifestyle accordingly. Backup plans and
savings are crucial. Also as a freelancer you have to add extra
expenses to your rates, like electricity, renderfarm costs (if u'r
pulling heavy stuff that you can't possibly render at home),
subcontracting costs (we all need a hand from time to time), rent for
the apt you're living in, food, heating or cooling expenses etc. That
adds a considerable amount of money to that rate. Something which does
not apply to an employee which basically gets all this for free at the
working place (apart from food maybe). The studio on the other hand
adds these to it's hourly rate, which includes employee expenses.
So while in theory, 100 eur/day sounds like a good fulltime salary,
for a freelancer, it would give a whole new meaning to life (survival
training might be necessary here).
Keep in mind, everything i wrote, is based on eastern european
experience, but i presume it's the same
everywhere else. Numbers vary, but the theory stays the same.
Peace,
O
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 10:32 AM, Szabolcs Matefy
<szabol...@crytek.com <mailto:szabol...@crytek.com>> wrote:
Wow, very nice information. However, there were times, when I was
told I am fairly expensive with my 100Euros (without VAT) rate per
day...And I'm in Eastern Europe as well, and the statement was
made by a company in the UK.
Cheers
Szabolcs
-----Original Message-----
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>] On Behalf Of
olivier jeannel
Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2012 4:41 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Semi OT : Charging the modelling
Thank's Tim :)
Pretty precize :D
Le 17/11/2012 16:06, Tim Leydecker a écrit :
> Given you´re mail account, you´re based in France.
>
> That´s EU territory. 19% VAT.
>
> I guess remote work, home office. Your own equipment, hardware and
> software.
>
> Your own hours plus the above overhead.
>
>
> You guess it would take you 4-5 days to complete the task.
>
> Adding 3 revision steps to that means another 3 days of handling
>
> your milestones, e.g. communication and revision loops with your
client.
>
> That´s 7-8 days for finishing a 3 D character model.
>
> That´s very fast and seems to not include the concept/art-direction
> bit too much.
>
> Especially when working with a fresh client who may only be able to
> judge
>
> finished, e.g. fully built, textured, shaded and lit renderings.
>
>
> I would suggest a small boutique shop price per day, which is at
least
> around 750 EUR/day.
>
> Because that´s what you do, besides modeling.
>
> Coming from a graphics design backround, list prices I can relate to
> range in the 60 EUR/hr range but would not include additional
fees for
> usage of artworks. These fees for, let´s say a worldwide, unlimited
> use of your character may easily be factor 10.
>
> For a reason.
>
> Cheers,
>
> tim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 17.11.2012 15:24, olivier jeannel wrote:
>> Ah thank's, that helps.
>> Well, the clients seems rather "new" in the 3d field. (nothing like
>> Lionsgate, or big studio) So I'm not sure how they'll react to the
>> range of price.
>> Thank's a lot for your examples :)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Le 17/11/2012 14:58, Octavian Ureche a écrit :
>>> I remember doing a commercial for a studio here (eastern europe),
>>> and we outsourced a horse model to a friend of mine who now
happens
>>> to work at lionhead. Point was, it took him 3 days, i recall,
to do
>>> it, and it cost 1000 euros.
>>> And that was 4 or 5 years ago, and it wasn't considered that
>>> expensive, and we're talking eastern europe here. Don't know
if the
>>> prices have changed that much since then in the modelling
area, but
>>> i thought it might be food for thought.
>>> But the guy had an impressive portfolio even back then.
>>> On the other hand, i had a friend who recently hired a ubisoft guy
>>> with a rather poor portfolio to model a toycar, and he did it for
>>> 400 in 4 days.
>>>
>>> Don't know if it matters whether it's cartoony or realistic, but i
>>> think your portfolio will also help dictate the amount of
money that
>>> you can or can't charge.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 3:02 PM, olivier jeannel
>>> <olivier.jean...@noos.fr <mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr>
<mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr <mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr>>>
wrote:
>>>
>>> Ok Thank you !
>>> So, 400$ * 4 or 5 days for 1 character is not over-priced
>>> according to you ?
>>>
>>>
>>> Le 16/11/2012 22:47, Stephen Davidson a écrit :
>>>> I would then price it per day. 8 hour days.
>>>> I charge approx. $400/day (314.2924 euros)
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 3:51 PM, olivier jeannel
>>>> <olivier.jean...@noos.fr <mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr>
<mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr <mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr>>>
wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I won't be able to be that precise, as I usualy don't
count
>>>> in hours.
>>>> Thus I think for modelling a 1 character 4 or 5 days is a
>>>> maximum.
>>>>
>>>> But, really I'd like someone to give me a price example.
>>>> are you usually speaking in hundreds or thousands of
euros
>>>> ? I don't really know...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Le 16/11/2012 16:36, Stephen Davidson a écrit :
>>>>> I always estimate per hour.
>>>>> I have found that I can be quite accurate with an hourly
>>>>> estimate
>>>>> by breaking down the modeling to it's most basic
components.
>>>>> For example, on a character model, how long to model
each
>>>>> eye.
>>>>> How long to model basic body shape. How long to
model hands,
>>>>> face, expressions (if needed), clothes... you get
the idea.
>>>>>
>>>>> Then, add up all the tasks, and you will have a fairly
>>>>> accurate estimate.
>>>>> It takes practice, as my early quotes were not so
>>>>> accurate. I have
>>>>> been working in 3D since before Softimage version 1 so I
>>>>> have gotten more
>>>>> accurate over the years.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 4:59 AM, olivier jeannel
>>>>> <olivier.jean...@noos.fr <mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr>
<mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr <mailto:olivier.jean...@noos.fr>>>
wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi guys,
>>>>>
>>>>> Now that I'm starting enjoying playing with Ice and
>>>>> particle stuff, clients are asking for ...modelling job ^^
>>>>>
>>>>> I realize I never charged separatly for this task
>>>>> alone. So my question is how much do you (freelance,
homeworkers)
>>>>> charge for 1 character modeling ? (How much do
>>>>> you keep in your pocket in the end (forget the
taxes))
>>>>>
>>>>> Typicaly, quadrupede / Biped, realistic proportions
>>>>> anatomy but rather for toon / NPA / stylized rendering results.
>>>>> In short, only polygonal modeling, (no Zbrush, no
>>>>> hair)
>>>>>
>>>>> How much do you cost :)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>> * Stephen P. Davidson**
>>>>> **(954) 552-7956 <tel:%28954%29%20552-7956>
>>>>> * sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com
>>>>> <mailto:sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com
<mailto:sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <http://www.3danimationmagic.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Best Regards,
>>>> * Stephen P. Davidson**
>>>> **(954) 552-7956
>>>> * sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com
>>>> <mailto:sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com
<mailto:sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com>>
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.3danimationmagic.com>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> visual | stuff
>>> www.okto.ro <http://www.okto.ro> <http://www.okto.ro>
>>
>
--
visual | stuff
www.okto.ro <http://www.okto.ro>
