On Fri, Apr 1, 2011 at 1:38 PM, Mark Ty-Wharton <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > On 1 April 2011 13:20, roomsearching <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> On Fri, Apr 1, 2011 at 11:08 AM, Mark Ty-Wharton <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On 31 March 2011 14:48, roomsearching <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> *Universal consciousness is a part of your body-mind and the whole >>>> universe. >>>> The one who asks the question is the temporary construction of the >>>> mind-body- the "I am" ness which is made up of food essence. * >>> >>> >>> What is FOOD ESSENCE? >>> >> * >> Its just food. The body is just food. Food has the **latent **universal >> consciousness **in it along with the five elements which provide you with >> the "I am"ness.The Universal consciousness of the body is one with the >> universal consciousness of the universe. There is no seperation. * >> > > Sorry, I am still not getting this. I am food? Okay I can see that as a > possibility if I am being eaten by a leopard - what does five elements mean? > What are the five elements? Can you break it down a bit to basics for me, > thanks. > *That basically means, your body is a bunch of cells acting according to the laws of chemistry - biochemistry. According to the scriptures, the five elements are air, fire, water, earth and sky or whatever. But basically it means chemical reactions. The body is really a cluster of cells. It does not need much except your breathing. It can be quite comfortable without you doing anything at all. Leave the body alone. * > > >> >> >>> >>>> *Your questions are of no value. It is not going to change anything. >>>> The body-mind is dying and withering away and you are worried - this is >>>> not required because you are not it. >>>> When there is no food, your questions will stop. When there is no food, >>>> the body and mind will disappear. >>>> * >>> >>> >>> That's not strictly true. I have a friend who knows a breathearian who is >>> fit and healthy without food. His mind (and ego) work rather too well :) >>> >> * >> how long can he survive without food ? Has he never eaten food all his >> life ?* >> > > I do not know > > >> >> >>> >>> >>>> *Then you are back in the universal consciousness. Then you will not >>>> even know that you exist. >>>> It is only by accident that the "I am" ness was created and you are able >>>> to somehow see your true state. >>>> Nobody knows why the body-mind was created. >>>> Most animals have this kind of body-mind. >>>> But only humans have been intelligent enough to ask intelligent >>>> questions. >>>> Even a dog knows "I am". * >>> >>> >>> Do we know that for sure? >>> >> >> *According to the scriptures, Trees are in deep sleep, animals are >> dreaming and only humans have the consciousness of fully awakened state. >> The dog may actually not know the "I am". * >> > > Okay > >> >> >>> >>>> *But it does not go beyond it. Humans can do that because some weirdos >>>> did go beyond it and encouraged the rest of the humans to try it out.Some >>>> do >>>> try it out. But 99% of humans live like animals. Just behaving like >>>> body-minds. >>>> In the end, everything is meaningless. Which is why Karma is not >>>> required. One who discovers his true state understands the futility of all >>>> human activity and sits still - that is when all your Karma dissolves. The >>>> rest of the humanity is busy in their activities of finding glory, fame, >>>> money and fulfilling all their desires. >>>> * >>> >>> >>> Why stop doing that though? If you understand it is meaningless why fight >>> against the futility? Surely you are making it mean something that it is >>> meaningless. If you find yourself in a good job earning millions with two >>> gorgeous girlfriends who will do anything you want them to etc and karma >>> isn't required... >>> >> *That requires lots of effort, planning, struggle and suffering. And >> whatever action you do will have its repurcussions. It leads to addiction, >> dissatisfaction and breeds more desire. Desire is suffering. Whatever is to >> be desired is inside our hearts - The Self. There is nothing outside but >> illusion. * >> > > Okay, yes I get that. I think the point I was making is why not allow the > futility instead of fighting against it. > *The futile actions are directed by the misguided mind or the ego. The five senses are like horses which pull you around everywhere without any control. The real controller is the Soul who has to control the five senses. But your ignorance makes you think that you are the horse. One horse wants good food. Another horse wants to get drunk. Another horse wants to have sex. It is just the sense organs being fuelled more and more by your desires. Desire breeds more desire. * > > >> >> >>> >>> Let's bang some seven gram rocks, rent some porn stars and put the video >>> on You Tube... >>> >> *And risk getting addicted to drugs or getting STD's. More complications >> and suffering. * >> > > Sure, but again the point I am making is if it truly is meaningless then > why worry about that? > *If you had really realized it is meaningless, you would not ask questions like that. Peace is your real nature. All this wild excitement is the temptations created by the senses and the desire for pleasure. When you get some pleasure, you get fed up with it. You want something different. You want something better. There is no end to it. A realized man would just sit down, have a cup of tea and enjoy the beingness. Beingness is blissful. Why do you need anything more than that ? Any sense pleasure is subject to the material world - 5 elements. Why do you want such temporary illusory experiences ? And pleasure and pain are defined by you. Pain can be pleasureable. But pain is guaranteed in life. Pleasure comes very seldom. * > > >> >>> >>>> * At the end of the day, when you go to sleep, you will not ask any >>>> question. That shows we have 0% control on 50% of our lives. Why do we >>>> worry >>>> about our body-mind in the remaining 50% ? * >>> >>> >>> We worry because we have no control over the worry. >>> >> *You can control them if you know who you are. You are not the worries. Say good bye to them. Just hold on to the "I am" because that is the only thing you know is true. Don't hold on to anything you know is unreal. * > >>> Why do you think ZEN is a discipline? >>> >> >> *Sure . Zen is not a discipline. It is the end product. The goal of >> having no goal is Zen. * *Until then you are just a student of Zen. Until >> a man learns to fly a plane, he is not yet a pilot. Until one is spiritually >> awakened, nobody is doing Zen. >> Zen is not a practice. It is the final stage. >> * >> > > I think Zen is a process and once spiritual awakening happens then and only > then nobody is doing ZEN > *Dont concentrate on the process. The goal is right there. Reach it. Why do you need a 107 different steps to reach the reality ?* > > >> ** >> >>> >>> Because taking on a discipline is a choice :) >>> >> >> *A spiritual choice like Zen is made after a lot of suffering or when >> someone decides to reach the eternal peaceful state. >> There is no choice here. Life gives u pain. One way or the other, all >> roads lead to the Self. People are only trying to escape it using drugs, >> desires, and all these temporary things. Ultimately, u have to come back to >> the Zen state. >> It is not a choice. You had no choice to begin with. You are the Self. You >> can only be that. Nothing else. >> * >> >>> >>> Think about it... >>> >> >
