+1billion!!! I second that Jeff. I too have had to use my weapon for self defense once upon a time. I would likely not be here myself if I didn't have it with me to scare off an armed mugger in Newark, NJ at 11PM.
Thank you, Brett A Mansfield > On Dec 7, 2015, at 10:09 AM, Jeff Broadwick - Lists <jeffl...@att.net> wrote: > > Since when is a discussion of our legal, Constitutional rights "pathetic" > Patrick? We are talking about a tool, like any other, that can be used to > protect ourselves and others. WISPs are often out in remote places in the > dead of night...or at inner city data centers. They are vulnerable. I know > that one person on this list would likely not be here right now if he hadn't > been able to show a gun to someone that was about to bash him with a baseball > bat outside a data center. > > Jeff Broadwick > ConVergence Technologies, Inc. > 312-205-2519 Office > 574-220-7826 Cell > jbroadw...@converge-tech.com > >> On Dec 7, 2015, at 11:58 AM, Patrick Leary <patrick.le...@telrad.com> wrote: >> >> I’ll just note this is a pathetic thread to have in any society that >> considers itself civil. Hell, even in the “wild west” the local law had >> people check their weapons into the sheriff when they came into town. In >> fact, formerly, states like Texas lead the country in banning open carry. >> >> “All the more surprising, then, that Texas was the first state to ban its >> citizens from carrying handguns, a restriction that remained on the books >> for 125 years.” >> http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/politics/texas/article/First-to-ban-open-carry-Texas-could-be-one-of-5974401.php >> >> And just read this scholarly article from 1999: >> >> Gun Control and the Old West >> By Ross Collins >> History News Service, Summer 1999. >> >> The smoke has cleared, and we peer down at the victim: another gun control >> bill, shot full ‘o holes. Just like in the old horse operas: a hero again >> shoots to protect a precious freedom, America’s right to bear arms. For many >> who keep a romantic image of America’s past, gun control is like that, a >> battle steeped in American tradition. It calls us back to those legendary >> days of the Old West, when cowboys defended their honor and their horses by >> way of their Colts >> . >> In fact, most historians see the cowboys of the Old West as THE defining >> heroes of 20th-century America. He’s used to sell everything from soap to >> hats. He’s apparently also an ideal American for anti-gun control groups: >> gun shows and gun advertising promote from a distinctive Old West flavor. >> >> Today’s anti gun control forces count their strongest support among >> society’s leaders from the states that once formed part of the Old West. >> The actual Old West pioneers of historical fact viewed matters differently, >> however. They would certainly hail the campaign to protect an American right >> to bear arms, but the record puts them behind "moderate, common-sense >> measures" for gun control—the very kind that President Clinton has proposed. >> >> Pioneer publications show Old West leaders repeatedly arguing in favor of >> gun control. City leaders in the old cattle towns knew from experience what >> some Americans today don't want to believe: a town which allows easy access >> to guns invites trouble. >> What these cow town leaders saw intimately in their day-to-day association >> with guns is that more guns in more places caused not greater safety, but >> greater death in an already dangerous wilderness. By the 1880s many in the >> west were fed up with gun violence. Gun control, they contended, was >> absolutely essential, and the remedy advocated usually was usually no less >> than a total ban on pistol-packing. >> The editor of the Black Hills Daily Times of Dakota Territory in 1884, >> called the idea of carrying firearms into the city a “dangerous practice,” >> not only to others, but to the packer himself. He emphasized his point with >> the headline, "Perforated by His Own Pistol." >> The editor of the Montana’s Yellowstone Journal acknowledged four years >> earlier that Americans have "the right to bear arms," but he contended that >> guns have to be regulated. As for cowboys carrying pistols, a dispatch from >> Laramie’s Northwest Stock Journal in 1884, reported, "We see many cowboys >> fitting up for the spring and summer work. They all seem to think it >> absolutely necessary to have a revolver. Of all foolish notions this is the >> most absurd." >> >> Cowboy president Theodore Roosevelt recalled with approval that as a Dakota >> Territory ranch owner, his town, at the least, allowed "no shooting in the >> streets." The editor of that town's newspaper, The Bad Lands Cow Boy of >> Medora, demanded that gun control be even tighter than that, however. Like >> leaders in Miles City and many other cow towns, he wanted to see guns banned >> entirely within the city limits. A.T. Packard in August 1885 called "packing >> a gun" a "senseless custom," and noted about a month later that "As a >> protection, it is terribly useless.” >> >> Old West cattlemen themselves also saw the need for gun control. By 1882, a >> Texas cattle raising association had banned six-shooters from the cowboy's >> belt. "In almost every section of the West murders are on the increase, and >> cowmen are too often the principals in the encounters," concurred a dispatch >> from the Texas Live Stock Journal dated June 5, 1884. "The six-shooter >> loaded with deadly cartridges is a dangerous companion for any man, >> especially if he should unfortunately be primed with whiskey. Cattlemen >> should unite in aiding the enforcement of the law against carrying of deadly >> weapons." >> >> This echoes President Clinton’s reaction following the failure in Congress >> of the most recent gun control proposals: “The American people will not >> stand for this.” So far they have, however, as recalled by the record of >> defeated attempts to legislate control. As U.S. Rep. Martin Sabo (D.-Minn.) >> noted, “there’s broad public support for it, but he opponents are much more >> intense about it.” >> >> The Old West’s leaders who argued for gun control knew that a long time ago. >> Their arguments sound as contemporary at the end of this century as they >> were earnest at the end of the last. But despite them, few packers have been >> persuaded to put away their pistols, then or now. >> >> Copyright 2004 by Ross F. Collins <www.ndsu.edu/communication/collins> >> >> Wayne LaPierre sure has done his job well. He’s made most of you fooled into >> thinking owning a gun is a patriotic act without you realizing you are just >> another tool for raking in the dough. He’s been so successful he’s converted >> gun ownership into a religious issue, to point that whether or not you own a >> gun is highly predictive of your being an evangelical Christian. >> >> https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/is-gun-ownership-christian/2013/01/25/c7afe7fe-6724-11e2-93e1-475791032daf_story.html >> >> Patrick >> >> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Cameron Crum >> Sent: Monday, December 7, 2015 11:38 AM >> To: af@afmug.com >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] WAY OT: Concealed Carry handguns - which to buy and why >> >> I carry a Colt 45 Defender. It is relatively small for a 45. An NSA buddy of >> mine, who had been in several close range shootouts in his career asked me >> one time why I carry a 45. I told him that I'd never been in a firefight. I >> don't train in high pressure situations, and while I'm proficient at the >> range, I don't train for situations like he did or the cops do. If I am in a >> situation where I have to pull a gun, my adrenaline is going to be pumping >> like crazy, and I may be moving to cover or trying to stay out of the way of >> bullets myself. I may only hit what I'm shooting at once if I'm lucky. I >> want the once to count. >> >> On Mon, Dec 7, 2015 at 10:30 AM, That One Guy /sarcasm >> <thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote: >> define legally >> If a bear shits in the woods, will tight shoes cause callouses? >> >> I dont know why any of you want these killing machines, the government has >> guns, and we pay them to protect us. Your gun, if you hand it to a bad guy, >> is 100% of the time going to be in the bad guys possession, and if that bad >> guy happens to be 5, youve just given a child a handgun, are you saying we >> should arm children? Why are you trying to kill children, children are the >> future, teach them well and let them lead the way. >> >> >> Imperialist scum be furthering decline humanity. Mighty leader will devour >> you in fear. >> >> <image002.jpg> >> >> >> On Mon, Dec 7, 2015 at 10:17 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> Can you legally own hand grenades? >> >> From: Mathew Howard >> Sent: Monday, December 07, 2015 9:15 AM >> To: af >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] WAY OT: Concealed Carry handguns - which to buy and why >> >> you do if you want to conceal it... :P >> >> On Mon, Dec 7, 2015 at 10:14 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote: >> You don’t need a CC to carry a Springfield 30-06.... >> >> From: Paul McCall >> Sent: Monday, December 07, 2015 9:03 AM >> To: af@afmug.com >> Subject: [AFMUG] WAY OT: Concealed Carry handguns - which to buy and why >> >> I am getting my CC permit (Florida) in a week or so. I took an absolutely >> excellent class from the main trainer at the Brevard county sheriff’s >> office. >> >> Now, I am looking for an excellent CC gun to use, as my long barrel Colt 38 >> is not a good fit for that. >> >> I am certain that this group probably has a LOT of expertise (and many >> opinions) on THE gun to use. >> >> J >> >> Paul McCall, Pres. >> PDMNet / Florida Broadband >> 658 Old Dixie Highway >> Vero Beach, FL 32962 >> 772-564-6800 office >> 772-473-0352 cell >> www.pdmnet.com >> pa...@pdmnet.net >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as >> part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team. >> >> >> >> >> ************************************************************************************ >> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by >> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer >> viruses. >> ************************************************************************************ >> >> >> >> >> >> ************************************************************************************ >> This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by >> PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer >> viruses. >> ************************************************************************************ >>
