Tony, I don't get why people might prefer immortality in a box, when it is probably easier to produce immortality in a robotic body. Perhaps you can explain?
Steve On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 11:57 AM, Tony Cole <[email protected]> wrote: > Marco – I think a significant number of people would choose potential > immortality in a box over mortality in flesh. > > Also, if one believes Ray Kurzweil’s predictions regarding the progress of > AGI, the technology for uploaded “immortality in a box” may come before the > cure of many life-ending diseases (cancer, dementia, etc.). > > Given a choice between an early demise due to disease, or complete > degeneration of my mental faculties, I, for one, would chose immortality in > a box. > > *From:* Marco Alpini <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Sunday, October 18, 2015 9:49 AM > *To:* AGI <[email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [agi] AGI and Cosmism > > Thanks Steve, I have been using the term uploading meaning downloading > being unaware about what the mainstream means with uploading which I also > think unconceivable and unnecessary. Why, the hell we should aim to end up > in a box? > > On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 2:11 PM, Steve Richfield < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Marco, >> >> *downloading*: placing a human consciousness into an electomechanical >> computerized body.that continues to function in the real world. This is the >> "live forever machine" that in production would probably be worth more than >> the total value of the Earth, because people would gladly mortgage their >> futures to have futures. >> >> *uploading*: placing a human consciousness into a VR computer system >> having no bodies or real-world presence. This appears to be at once >> probably more difficult than downloading because you would have to simulate >> EVERYTHING instead of "just" a human, and is little better than death for >> most people. >> >> *PR*: Acronym for *P*ublic *R*elations - the art and science of >> presenting a good image to the public. >> >> *Steve* >> ========= >> >> On Sat, Oct 17, 2015 at 6:09 PM, Marco Alpini <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> Steve, what do you mean with downloading? an augmentation of our brain >>> capabilities with internal or external devices? What is PR? >>> >>> On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 5:58 AM, Steve Richfield < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Logan, >>>> >>>> On Sat, Oct 17, 2015 at 8:50 AM, Logan Streondj <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Cosmism seems to be the religion espoused by top tier AGI researchers. >>>>> Namely Ben Goertzel and Hugo De Garis, though some others have also >>>>> written books about Cosmism recently. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Create-your-own God. Myself, I prefer our present godless world. Heaven >>>> would be SUCH a drag. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> I've always felt my life path was to be a spiritual leader, >>>>> >>>> >>>> Spiritual has to do with what can NOT be presently proven false. Now >>>> that there are solid proofs that present religions like Judaism, >>>> Christianity, and Islam are false, some people look to AGI. Of course once >>>> constructed, AGI will no longer be a religion - it will be technology. >>>> >>>> >>>>> and I'm rather interested in the PR of AGI. >>>>> >>>> >>>> What are the bounds on what you call AGI? Does this include uploading? >>>> Downloading? Enhancement of individuals (like you and me) to full AGI >>>> capability? Etc? >>>> >>>> Unless you have thought out these questions VERY carefully - MUCH more >>>> carefully than the people you now cite, PR will bring disaster to AGI as >>>> others with different opinions react in unfortunate ways. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Having a strong group of people that share the vision of beneficial >>>>> AGI future, is conducive to good legislation and funding. >>>>> >>>> >>>> No, the most likely result would be legislation AGAINST a potential >>>> world-ending technology. Just like bathroom atomic experimentation is now >>>> illegal, AGI research would become illegal. >>>> >>>> However, if you were to "succeed" in attracting "good" legislation and >>>> funding, you would then be up against the situation that SO many have >>>> written about - that there are countless ways that an AGI could destroy us >>>> all, and NO viable approach to protect us from that - leading to our >>>> eventual doom no matter WHAT we did to delay/avoid that end. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Turing Church and some Transhumanist associations seem to be what is >>>>> available. >>>>> >>>> >>>> What is REALLY needed is a leader pulling people to a more tractable >>>> path. There is WAY too much that is presently unknown about how we work to >>>> ever program a computer to emulate it, or even understand it, even with >>>> limitless intelligence. >>>> >>>> The one shining light I see is to concentrate on technologies leading >>>> to downloading - which is why I have put so much effort into a >>>> super-microscope capable of diagramming brains. My hope is that downloading >>>> outruns the current misdirected wave of people trying to program computers >>>> to think, so PEOPLE remain in charge, rather than a new specie of computer >>>> that has NO interest beyond simple curiosity in our preservation. >>>> >>>> In short, given the presence of hazards like Ben and Hugo, downloading >>>> becomes MUCH more than "just" about living forever or making LOTS of money. >>>> It becomes about saving the human race from the AGI that some fools on this >>>> forum seek to build. >>>> >>>> Steve >>>> ============= >>>> >>>>> tfgrq >>>>> *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >>>>> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/10443978-6f4c28ac> | >>>>> Modify <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> Your Subscription >>>>> <http://www.listbox.com> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Full employment can be had with the stoke of a pen. Simply institute a >>>> six hour workday. That will easily create enough new jobs to bring back >>>> full employment. >>>> >>>> *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >>>> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/27738727-35a82580> | >>>> Modify <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> Your Subscription >>>> <http://www.listbox.com> >>>> >>> >>> *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >>> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/10443978-6f4c28ac> | >>> Modify <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> Your Subscription >>> <http://www.listbox.com> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Full employment can be had with the stoke of a pen. Simply institute a >> six hour workday. That will easily create enough new jobs to bring back >> full employment. >> >> *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/27738727-35a82580> | >> Modify <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> Your Subscription >> <http://www.listbox.com> >> > > *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> > <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/27412372-12a484de> | > Modify <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> Your Subscription > <http://www.listbox.com> > *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> > <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/10443978-6f4c28ac> | > Modify > <https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;> > Your Subscription <http://www.listbox.com> > -- Full employment can be had with the stoke of a pen. Simply institute a six hour workday. 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