Ok, joking isn't helping. I'll be serious and try and explain better. An overlong post, I'm afraid. I don't do 'tl;dr'.
I _really mean_ what I say. I'm not just trying to wind you up (or others for that matter). Honestly, it is not my intention to make anyone (you, in this case) feel sad or to feel they've received hateful comments. I am not _trying_ to upset anyone in an emotional way for fun or anything like that. I actually don't get a kick from this sort of argument itself (a certain amount of pride and pleasure creating what I flatter myself to be the odd well-turned phrase, or pointed gag; hence my opening comment; sure). I also naturally tend to be jokey and feel there's no better way to be serious than "ha ha only serious". I get that sometime comes across as sarcasm but, hey, sometimes I intend it to. Actually, re-reading my posts I think I'm being quite clear: I don't like wishy-washy 'belief' statements and, you know what?, I actually do find to be arrogant statements that assert an understanding of reality on some 'deep' level that has no objective evidence for it, especially when the stater also insists that this be taken seriously, not mocked every time it is mentioned in polite company, and tries to use such statements as components of otherwise rational arguments. I've no doubt people who are into Buddhism, say, who mediate a lot and spend their time contemplating the lack of self and whatever, actually do come to believe they feel that way and they've accessed some deep truth. I've done my share of reading about it, meditating and hanging around at retreats etc and that seems to be somewhat repeatable and history also says as much. There's nothing that suggests to me that that this is actually true of reality, however, and isn't some self-induced state brought about by the activity itself combined with absorbing dogma in a supportive (often manipulative, in my experience, nefarious or not) social group and having a personal desire for it, or more likely anything 'meaningful', to be true. Often combined with a history of mental illness or a tragedy in life to be honest. At least, that seems to be plausible and a simpler explanation. So, if anything, what I find hateful is this 'random culturally-accepted belief system' (had to insert the hyphen, sorry) that says people's beliefs ought to be given respect automatically, and the whackier the belief the more respect they should get. Bullshit! You say something whacky and I'll call "bullshit!". I expect the same in return. If everyone I am with at a party says "STFU Colin, you're talking nonsense" (no, really, you'd be surprised - it has happened more than once!) then I tend to get the message and, sometimes, even go as far as changing my opinion! I know! How well adjusted am I? Whoops, that'll be that 'ego' I suppose. I do respect an individual's right to hold any opinion they care to but don't expect me to sit still and quiet while otherwise intelligent humans let themselves down when they choose to express these arbitrary, frequently contradictory and sometimes downright subversive statements that, if left unchallenged, have a nasty habit of causing actions that impede our otherwise 'God-given' right to figure out what is happening here and generally improve ourselves. I mean, it's a clear contradiction, isn't it?! I also realise I'm moving around a bit in the religious space here, but only in a desire to be fair! I'm afraid to say I don't feel responsible for how someone responds, emotionally or otherwise, if that is the situation. Of course 'offence' is likely to be had (not 'taken' - it is entirely a product of the receiver). Most people don't like to be told they're talking rubbish when they think they aren't. But! This nonsense of "what you said offended my beliefs" we seem to have got used to as a societal 'get out of argument free' card needs to be put down. Not saying that's what you are doing, of course: you're just not happy with what I say. And yes, that does make me feel a little bad but, importantly, not as bad as if I said nothing and then wondered later why people are happily saying we can't teach evolution or extract stem cells or whatever, as examples. And yes, I realise that isn't what _you_ are saying but it is just a spectrum of bullshit as far as I am concerned so I'll start at the end nearest to me and work my way down. Now, I honestly hope that makes you feel better in some way. After really hijacking this thread I'm going to go read Ben's paper now and next time hope to respond to that. Happy to discuss this if you feel inclined also but perhaps a separate thread at least, or private conversation, would suit the list better. Take care, Colin Sent from my iPhone > On 15 Mar 2016, at 5:16 pm, justcamel <[email protected]> wrote: > > Next time you craft three hateful postings in a row, try to sense your own > ego ... try to observe how your identification with form and your illusionary > self strengthens every time you define something as "other" and/or "enemy" > and every time you judge, ridicule and/or attack "other". > > "Colin has to do something about a posting Colin did not like. Colin can make > another person feel sad by attacking/ridiculing him/her. Yes, let's feel > alive by defining ourselves against the duality of 'other'." ... > > All the best! > >> On 15.03.2016 00:07, Colin Parr wrote: >> Excellent! You seem to have come on a long way in just a few email >> exchanges. The difference is something to take pride in. Well done you! >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On 14 Mar 2016, at 11:11 pm, justcamel <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> No worries. I don't find arrogant emails nor people who are satisfied with >>> a random set of culturally accepted belief systems to be very encouraging. >>> ;-) >>> >>>> On 14.03.2016 22:12, Colin Parr wrote: >>>> Well, OK, but you've still some work to do on that front, I fear. Please >>>> don't take that as encouragement. >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------- >>> AGI >>> Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now >>> RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/14513811-9a411e54 >>> Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; >>> Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com >> >> ------------------------------------------- >> AGI >> Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now >> RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/23508161-fa52c03c >> Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; >> Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com > > > > ------------------------------------------- > AGI > Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now > RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/14513811-9a411e54 > Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?&; > Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com ------------------------------------------- AGI Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/21088071-f452e424 Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=21088071&id_secret=21088071-58d57657 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
