Steve, If I understand you correctly, Cycorp's code should be *public domain*, and as such, I should be able to simply mine for the features that I am looking for. It sounds like Cycorp doesn't have a useful product (yet) whereas it looks like I do, so it is probably I who should be doing this, not Cycorp.
Any thoughts? Who should I ask for code from? Steve Richfield ================== On 12/1/08, Stephen Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Steve Richfield said: > KRAKEN contains lots of good ideas, several of which were already on my > wish list for Dr. Eliza sometime in the future. I suspect that a merger of > technologies might be a world-beater. > > I wonder if the folks at Cycorp would be interested in such an effort? > > If you can find a sponsor for the effort and then solicit Cycorp to join in > collaboration, I believe that they would be interested. The Cycorp business > model as I knew it back in 2006, depended mostly upon government research > sponsorship to (1) accomplish the research that the sponsor wanted, e.g. > produce deliverables for the DARPA Rapid Knowledge Formation project, and > (2) incrementally add more facts and rules to the Cyc KB, write more > supporting code for Cyc. Cycorp, did not then, and likely even now does not > have internal funding for non-sponsored enhancements. > > -Steve > > > Stephen L. Reed > > Artificial Intelligence Researcher > http://texai.org/blog > http://texai.org > 3008 Oak Crest Ave. > Austin, Texas, USA 78704 > 512.791.7860 > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Steve Richfield <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > *To:* agi@v2.listbox.com > *Sent:* Monday, December 1, 2008 3:19:37 PM > *Subject:* Re: [agi] Seeking CYC critiques > > Steve, > > The KRAKEN paper was quite interesting, and has a LOT in common with my own > Dr. Eliza. However, I saw no mention of Dr. Eliza's "secret sauce", that > boosts it from answering questions to solving problems given symptoms. The > secret sauce has two primary ingredients: > 1. The syntax of differential symptom statements - how people state a > symptom that separates it from similar symptoms of other conditions. > 2. Questions, the answers to which will probably carry #1 above > recognizable differential symptom statements. > Both of the above seem to require domain *experienced* people to code, as > book learning doesn't seem to convey what people typically say, or what you > have to say to them to get them to state their symptom in a differential > way. Also, I suspect that knowledge coded today wouldn't work well in 50 > years, when common speech has shifted. > > I finally gave up on having Dr. Eliza answer questions, because the "round > trip error rate" seemed to be inescapably high. This is the product of: > > 1. The user's flaws in their world model. > 2. The user's flaws in formulating their question. > 3. The computer's errors in parsing the question. > 4. The computer's errors in formulating an answer. > 5. The user's errors in understanding the answer. > 6. The user's errors from filing the answer into a flawed world model. > > Between each of these is: > > x.5 English's shortcomings in providing a platform to accurately state the > knowledge, question, or answer. > > While each of these could be kept to <5%, it seemed completely hopeless to > reduce the overall error rate to low enough to actually make it good for > anything useful. Of course, everyone on this forum concentrates on #3 above, > when in the real world, this is often/usually swamped by the others. Hence, > I am VERY curious. Has KRAKEN found a worthwhile/paying niche in the world > with itsw question answering, where people actually use it to their benefit? > If so, then how did they deal with the round trip error rate? > > KRAKEN contains lots of good ideas, several of which were already on my > wish list for Dr. Eliza sometime in the future. I suspect that a merger of > technologies might be a world-beater. > > I wonder if the folks at Cycorp would be interested in such an effort? > > BTW, http://www.DrEliza.com <http://www.dreliza.com/> is up and down these > days, with plans for a new and more reliable version to be installed next > weekend. > > Any thoughts? > > Steve Richfield > ================== > On 11/29/08, Stephen Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> Hi Robin, >> There are no Cyc critiques that I know of in the last few years. I was >> employed seven years at Cycorp until August 2006 and my non-compete >> agreement expired a year later. >> >> An interesting competition was held by Project >> Halo<http://www.projecthalo.com/halotempl.asp?cid=30>in which Cycorp >> participated along with two other research groups to >> demonstrate human-level competency answering chemistry questions. Results >> are >> here<http://www.projecthalo.com/content/docs/ontologies_in_chemistry_ISWC2.pdf>. >> Although Cycorp performed principled deductive inference giving detailed >> justifications, it was judged to have performed inferior due to the >> complexity of its justifications and due to its long running times. The >> other competitors used special purpose problem solving modules whereas >> Cycorp used its general purpose inference engine, extended for chemistry >> equations as needed. >> >> My own interest is in natural language dialog systems for rapid knowledge >> formation. I was Cycorp's first project manager for its participation in >> the the DARPA Rapid Knowledge Formation project where it performed to >> DARPA's satisfaction, but subsequently its RKF tools never lived up to >> Cycorp's expectations that subject matter experts could rapidly extend the >> Cyc KB without Cycorp ontological engineers having to intervene. A Cycorp >> paper describing its KRAKEN system is >> here<http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cyc.com%2Fdoc%2Fwhite_papers%2Fiaai.pdf&ei=IDgySdKoIJzENMzqpJcL&usg=AFQjCNG1VlgQxAKERyiHj4CmPohVeZxRyw&sig2=o50LFe4D6TRC3VwC7ZNPxw> >> . >> >> I would be glad to answer questions about Cycorp and Cyc technology to the >> best of my knowledge, which is growing somewhat stale at this point. >> >> Cheers. >> -Steve >> >> >> Stephen L. Reed >> >> Artificial Intelligence Researcher >> http://texai.org/blog >> http://texai.org >> 3008 Oak Crest Ave. >> Austin, Texas, USA 78704 >> 512.791.7860 >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> *From:* Robin Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> *To:* agi@v2.listbox.com >> *Sent:* Saturday, November 29, 2008 9:46:09 PM >> *Subject:* [agi] Seeking CYC critiques >> >> What are the best available critiques of CYC as it exists now (vs. soon >> after project started)? >> >> Robin Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://hanson.gmu.edu >> Research Associate, Future of Humanity Institute at Oxford University >> Associate Professor of Economics, George Mason University >> MSN 1D3, Carow Hall, Fairfax VA 22030-4444 >> 703-993-2326 FAX: 703-993-2323 >> >> ------------------------------ >> *agi* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/> | >> Modify<https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;>Your Subscription >> <http://www.listbox.com/> >> >> ------------------------------ >> *agi* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> >> <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/> | >> Modify<https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;>Your Subscription >> <http://www.listbox.com/> >> > > ------------------------------ > *agi* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> > <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/> | > Modify<https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;>Your Subscription > <http://www.listbox.com/> > > ------------------------------ > *agi* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> > <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/> | > Modify<https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;>Your Subscription > <http://www.listbox.com/> > ------------------------------------------- agi Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=120640061-aded06 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
