I disagree. For example, since a university student is one of the examples cited and is entirely appropriate, I would argue that even though the student may have the same address assigned persistently to a desktop computer in a dorm room for months or even years, I believe it is still within policy intent. As such, I believe that “temporary” without clarification as to definite time period is more appropriate.
Does this open up some abuse possibilities and loop-holes? Sure. It does, but so do many of our other policies. In general we’ve decided that benefiting the community and creating policy with a clear intent for people of good will to follow is superior to attempting to address every corner case and close every loophole. I see no reason not to follow that modus operandi here. Owen > On May 11, 2018, at 7:14 AM, David Farmer <[email protected]> wrote: > > I'd suggest "temporary, in a timeframe of days or weeks," is what we should > say. In my mind, implying something like 90 days would probably be > approaching an outer limit, and many months or a year exceeds the policy > intent we have. That said, I don't think there is a good reason for a bright > line within the policy either. > > Thanks. > > On Fri, May 11, 2018 at 4:31 AM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via ARIN-PPML > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > We don’t care if temporary is taken as “hours, minutes, days, months or > years”? > > > > When we have the examples as “students, employees, etc.”, I think it is clear > the intent but removing them we are missing this piece, unless the staff > interprets the policy manual looking at the original “complete” justification > text of the policy proposal. However, that has the disadvantage that the > community (a newcomer) it not recalling the background of the policy > proposal, that’s why I was using the examples in my original text. > > > Regards, > > Jordi > > > > > > De: Owen DeLong <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > Fecha: jueves, 10 de mayo de 2018, 17:19 > Para: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> > CC: <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > Asunto: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2018-4: Clarification on IPv6 > Sub-Assignments > > > > I think the best word would be temporary. > > > > As you have said, it denotes a connection which is transient in nature. You > come, you get an address while you’re connected, then you leave. > > > > This is temporary. Even if you’re there for several days (as in a hotel guest > network), it’s still temporary in nature. > > > > Owen > > > > > > > On May 10, 2018, at 8:29 AM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via ARIN-PPML > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > I don’t think that will help, on the contrary … you can use both static or > dynamic mechanism for both temporary and non-temporary assignments. > > > > What I think it was clear is the differentiation between a “permanent > broadband service” and a temporary service (you come to your workplace and > get connectivity while you’re there, same if you are a “guest visitor”). > > > > So it still looks to me that “non-permanently” is more obvious? Maybe > “non-continuously”? > > > > > Regards, > > Jordi > > > > > > De: Chris Woodfield <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > Fecha: jueves, 10 de mayo de 2018, 15:19 > Para: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> > CC: <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > Asunto: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2018-4: Clarification on IPv6 > Sub-Assignments > > > > The two terms, from my reading, are synonymous but carry different > implications, with the term “non-permanently” implying a longer period of > time than “temporarily". In practice, It will most likely be a distinction > built into how addresses are assigned by the organization (i.e. static or > dynamic assignment); would using that as our distinction be a useful avenue > to explore? > > > > -C > > > > > > On May 10, 2018, at 8:07 AM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > When I first used “temporarily” in a preliminary version of the proposal, I > was argued that it is not clear then if it is “minutes, hours, days, …”, so > non-permanently, looks like clearer in that sense … It may be a matter of not > being native English speaker. > > > > > Regards, > > Jordi > > > > > > De: ARIN-PPML <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> en nombre de John Santos <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> > Fecha: jueves, 10 de mayo de 2018, 15:01 > Para: <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > Asunto: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2018-4: Clarification on IPv6 > Sub-Assignments > > > > I find the word "temporarily" even more obvious than "non-permanently". If > those two words don't mean the same thing, then we definitely need a > definition. > > > > On 5/10/2018 5:08 AM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: > > What will be your opinion if I amend this proposal, so it works for both IPv4 > and IPv6, having this text in section 2.5 (Allocate and Assign), make it > shorter and more generic: > > > > “A unique IPv4 or IPv6 address or a unique IPv6 /64 prefix, which is > non-permanently provided to third parties, shall not be considered an > assignment” > > > > Alternatively, if we don’t want to go so far as to define the “size”: > > > > “An IPv4 or IPv6 block of address, which is non-permanently provided to third > parties, shall not be considered an assignment” > > > > I didn’t found short-term defined in the NRPM. Do you still think we need to > define “permanently” ? I think saying non-permanently it is quite obvious, > but maybe folks disagree … > > > Regards, > > Jordi > > > > > > De: ARIN-PPML <[email protected]> > <mailto:[email protected]> en nombre de Jo Rhett > <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]> > Fecha: miércoles, 9 de mayo de 2018, 20:37 > Para: <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]> > CC: <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]> > Asunto: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2018-4: Clarification on IPv6 > Sub-Assignments > > > > "Nominative, verb indirect" isn't English ;) Clean english structure would be: > > " <>A unique address or a unique /64 prefix that is non-permanently provided > to third parties shall not be considered an assignment. " > > > Or if you really want a descriptive phrase that modifies the nominative you > can get commas like so: > > > > > > > > "A unique address or a unique /64 prefix, which is non-permanently provided > to third parties, shall not be considered an assignment." > > I would also argue that this phrase is very vague unless "permanently" is > defined elsewhere in the document. Wasn't there some phrasing around > short-term assignment? (sorry, too busy/too lazy to grab the entire doc right > now) > > > > On Fri, May 4, 2018 at 6:40 PM Andrew Dul <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > I'd like to suggest that the proposed policy text be shorted and clarified. > I don't believe all the examples are necessary in the definition section. > > Add to the end of NRPM Section 2.5 - > https://www.arin.net/policy/nrpm.html#two5 > <https://www.arin.net/policy/nrpm.html#two5> > > Current draft text: > > The fact that a unique address or even a unique /64 prefix is non-permanently > provided to third parties, on a link operated by the original receiver of the > assignment, shall not be considered a sub-assignment. This includes, for > example, guests or employees (devices or servers), hotspots, and > point-to-point links or VPNs. The provision of addressing for permanent > connectivity or broadband services is still considered a sub-assignment. Only > the addressing of the point-to-point link itself can be permanent and that > addressing can't be used (neither directly or indirectly) for the actual > communication. > > My suggested rewrite: > > A unique address or a unique /64 prefix that is non-permanently provided to > third parties, shall not be considered an assignment. > > > > On 4/24/2018 11:57 AM, David Farmer wrote: > > I note that the text in question is the subject of an editorial change that > the AC has recently forwarded to Board for review, at a minimum the policy > text need to be updated to account for this editorial change. Further, I do > not support the text as written. > > I support a change to section 2 that is not quite so IPv6 specific and > focused more on the idea that providing hotspot, guest access, or other such > temporary access does not necessitate the making of re-assignments from a > policy perspective. Furthermore, such uses are not in conflict with the > conditions of an assignment (made by ARIN) or re-assignment (made by an ISP > or LIR). Also, If the details of RFC8273 need to be mentioned at all, they > should be someplace in section 6, not in section 2, the definitions of > assign, allocate, re-assign and re-allocate should remain agnostic about IP > version. > > Thanks. > > > > On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 2:22 PM, ARIN <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > wrote: > > On 18 April 2018 the ARIN Advisory Council (AC) accepted "ARIN-prop-254: > Clarification on IPv6 Sub-Assignments" as a Draft Policy. > > Draft Policy ARIN-2018-4 is below and can be found at: > https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2018_4.html > <https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2018_4.html> > > You are encouraged to discuss all Draft Policies on PPML. The AC will > evaluate the discussion in order to assess the conformance of this draft > policy with ARIN's Principles of Internet number resource policy as stated in > the Policy Development Process (PDP). Specifically, these principles are: > > * Enabling Fair and Impartial Number Resource Administration > * Technically Sound > * Supported by the Community > > The PDP can be found at: > https://www.arin.net/policy/pdp.html <https://www.arin.net/policy/pdp.html> > > Draft Policies and Proposals under discussion can be found at: > https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/index.html > <https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/index.html> > > Regards, > > Sean Hopkins > Policy Analyst > American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN) > > > > Draft Policy ARIN-2018-4: Clarification on IPv6 Sub-Assignments > > Problem Statement: > > When the policy was drafted, the concept of assignments/sub-assignments did > not consider a practice very common in IPv4 which is replicated and even > amplified in IPv6: the use of IP addresses for point-to-point links or VPNs. > > In the case of IPv6, instead of unique addresses, the use of unique prefixes > (/64) is increasingly common. > > Likewise, the policy failed to consider the use of IP addresses in hotspots, > or the use of IP addresses by guests or employees in Bring Your Own Device > (BYOD) and many other similar cases. > > Finally, the IETF has recently approved the use of a unique /64 prefix per > interface/host (RFC8273) instead of a unique address. This, for example, > allows users to connect to a hotspot, receive a /64 such that they are > “isolated” from other users (for reasons of security, regulatory > requirements, etc.) and they can also use multiple virtual machines on their > devices with a unique address for each one (within the same /64). > > Section 2.5 (Definitions/Allocate and Assign), explicitly prohibits such > assignments, stating that “Assignments... are not to be sub-assigned to other > parties”. > > This proposal clarifies this situation in this regard and better define the > concept, particularly considering new uses of IPv6 (RFC8273), by means of a > new paragraph. > > 5. Policy Statement > > Actual Text > > • Assign - To assign means to delegate address space to an ISP or > end-user, for specific use within the Internet infrastructure they operate. > Assignments must only be made for specific purposes documented by specific > organizations and are not to be sub-assigned to other parties. > > New Text > > • Assign - To assign means to delegate address space to an ISP or > end-user, for specific use within the Internet infrastructure they operate. > Assignments must only be made for specific purposes documented by specific > organizations and are not to be sub-assigned to other parties. > > The fact that a unique address or even a unique /64 prefix is non-permanently > provided to third parties, on a link operated by the original receiver of the > assignment, shall not be considered a sub-assignment. This includes, for > example, guests or employees (devices or servers), hotspots, and > point-to-point links or VPNs. The provision of addressing for permanent > connectivity or broadband services is still considered a sub-assignment. Only > the addressing of the point-to-point link itself can be permanent and that > addressing can't be used (neither directly or indirectly) for the actual > communication. > > > > 6. Comments > > a. Timetable for implementation: > > Immediate > > b. Anything else: > > Situation in other regions: This situation, has already been corrected in > RIPE, and the policy was updated in a similar way, even if right now there is > a small discrepancy between the policy text that reached consensus and the > RIPE NCC Impact Analysis. A new policy proposal has been submitted to amend > that, and the text is the same as presented by this proposal at ARIN. Same > text has also been submitted to AfriNIC, LACNIC and APNIC. > _______________________________________________ > PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > <http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml> > Please contact [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> if you experience any > issues. > > > > > > > -- > > =============================================== > David Farmer Email:[email protected] > <mailto:email%[email protected]> > Networking & Telecommunication Services > Office of Information Technology > University of Minnesota > 2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815 > Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952 > =============================================== > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > <http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml> > Please contact [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> if you experience any > issues. > > > _______________________________________________ > ARIN-PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > <https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml> > Please contact [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> if you experience any > issues. > > _______________________________________________ ARIN-PPML You are receiving > this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN Public Policy Mailing > List ([email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>). 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The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the > individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, > copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if > partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be > considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware > that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this > information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly > prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the > original sender to inform about this communication and delete it. > > _______________________________________________ > ARIN-PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > <https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml> > Please contact [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> if you experience any > issues. > > > > > ********************************************** > IPv4 is over > Are you ready for the new Internet ? > http://www.consulintel.es <http://www.consulintel.es/> > The IPv6 Company > > This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or > confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the > individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, > copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if > partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be > considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware > that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this > information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly > prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the > original sender to inform about this communication and delete it. > > > _______________________________________________ > ARIN-PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > <https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml> > Please contact [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> if you experience any > issues. > > > > > -- > =============================================== > David Farmer Email:[email protected] > <mailto:email%[email protected]> > Networking & Telecommunication Services > Office of Information Technology > University of Minnesota > 2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815 > Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952 > =============================================== > _______________________________________________ > ARIN-PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues.
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