Mike, The string is not many degrees off horizontal..... so I don't quite follow a comparison with a vertical object.
Surely the term "trailing" is most appropriate, as it not only describes the physical situation, including its movement as a result of air flow direction, but also provides the left and right sense we refer to in discussion. Bob On Thu, 17 Jan. 2019, 10:49 am Mike Borgelt <[email protected] wrote: > Bob, > > The thing is in front of you pivoted at the front which is at the bottom > from your point of view. > Stand a pencil on your desk in front of you. Pivot it clockwise some > degrees less than 90 about the point where it rests on the desk. Which > direction is it pointing? > > > I used to fly with a little slip in thermals as a result of some advice by > George Moffat/ Klaus Holighaus/Dick Johnson. > > Some flight tests have made me realise what you are really doing here. I > don't think it is good. > > Mike > > > > > > > > > At 09:33 AM 1/17/2019, you wrote: > > Good points Richard, > > However I still find the use of the word "pointing" very ambiguous. > > I suggest that "pointing" indicates a direction radiating from the > viewpoint. > This would have us discussing the forward direction of the string, while > it is more common to consider the rearward direction of the string..... ie > it's trailing direction. > > > > On Thu, 17 Jan. 2019, 10:18 am Richard Frawley <[email protected] wrote: > the string can be either pointing in to the thermal centre or pointing out > away from the core > > there is some conjecture that with some aircraft (I read that it was > mainly older pre-1980 craft) that with the string pointing to the outside, > they may be more efficient in the climb. > > There are also some views that say that polyhedral vs straight wings tend > to set up a balance that has the string pointing out. > > I have not yet seen any empiric data or detailed theory that speaks to > these suppositions, I expect it exists somewhere tho. > > More questions and less answers still….. > > > > > > > > > Richard Frawley > [email protected] > > We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from > our children > > > > > > > > On 17 Jan 2019, at 10:12 am, Bob Dircks <[email protected]> wrote: > > Mike, > In your original question, > > Part b, > > By "pointing" I presume you mean "trailing" ? > > To me, in this case "pointing" could be the direction of the forward end > of the string. > > > On Thu, 17 Jan. 2019, 9:54 am Mike Borgelt < > [email protected] wrote: > So how about answering the questions? > > > Mike > > At 08:51 AM 1/17/2019, you wrote: > > and what is the expected differential (gain/loss) with say a 10degree slip > indication variation, given all the other factors that determine climb rate. > > This might b able to be worked out mathematically given the airflows angle > on the wing and fuselage drags differences > > I suspect that are several aerodynamic factors would have to be > considered, especially given the the thermal core is dynamic. > > A question for modern designers perhaps, especially when all aviation > design is a trade off > > > > > > > > > > > Richard Frawley > [email protected] > > We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our > children > > > > > > > > On 17 Jan 2019, at 9:43 am, Mike Borgelt < [email protected]> > wrote: > > At 07:36 AM 1/17/2019, you wrote: > > Perhaps the more important question is how to you tell if one technique is > better than another. What is a useful baseline? > > > > > > Climbing better than the other gliders is the test but what if everybody > is using the same less than optimum technique? > > Mike > > > > > > > On 17 Jan 2019, at 7:16 am, Mike Borgelt < [email protected]> > wrote: > > When circling in a thermal, do you > a) keep the string centered > b) fly with it pointing to the outside of the turn > c) why? > > > Your technique may not be doing what you think it is. > > Mike > > > > > > > Borgelt Instruments - design & manufacture of quality soaring > instrumentation since 1978 > www.borgeltinstruments.com > tel:  07 4635 5784     overseas: int+61-7-4635 5784 > mob: 042835 5784                : int+61-42835 5784 > P O Box 4607, Toowoomba East, QLD 4350, Australia > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > _______________________________________________ Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > Borgelt Instruments - design & manufacture of quality soaring > instrumentation since 1978 > www.borgeltinstruments.com > tel:  07 4635 5784     overseas: int+61-7-4635 5784 > mob: 042835 5784                : int+61-42835 5784 > P O Box 4607, Toowoomba East, QLD 4350, Australia > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > _______________________________________________ Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > Borgelt Instruments - design & manufacture of quality soaring > instrumentation since 1978 > www.borgeltinstruments.com > tel:  07 4635 5784     overseas: int+61-7-4635 5784 > mob: 042835 5784                : int+61-42835 5784 > P O Box 4607, Toowoomba East, QLD 4350, Australia > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > _______________________________________________ Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring > > *Borgelt Instruments* - > *design & manufacture of quality soaring instrumentation since 1978 * > www.borgeltinstruments.com > tel: 07 4635 5784 overseas: int+61-7-4635 5784 > mob: 042835 5784 : int+61-42835 5784 > P O Box 4607, Toowoomba East, QLD 4350, Australia > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.base64.com.au/listinfo/aus-soaring >
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