Hi Steve, Sorry, I misread then. In the Portuguese based records, you are looking for parents named João de Souza and Maria da Silva, but I doubt she's listed that way. She'll be a Maria Religious Middle Name.
Cheri Mello Listowner, Azores-Gen Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada On Fri, Jan 3, 2020 at 1:15 PM Steve Stevens <[email protected]> wrote: > Cheri, > > Thanks again. His parents were John Soza and Mary Silva. I will search > the site you referenced, thanks. > > On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 2:19:06 PM UTC-5, Cheri Mello wrote: >> >> Hi Steve, >> >> Thanks for the timeline. That helps a lot. These are all records you've >> done from online searches? Not everything is online, especially the >> naturalizations. Currently, it's around $65 to do a search (and no >> guarantee they'll find the right Manuel). The fees are slated to go to a >> few HUNDRED for just a search. $300 or so. >> >> Even though your Manuel did not personally provide the information for >> the obituary, I'd use that. The person telling his life story probably got >> the island right. But to search for Manuel de Souzas leaving Terceira >> between 1885-1887 will turn up a lot. You said his parents were Joao Souza >> and Maria Reis. It will be tedious, but you can go page by page, looking >> for a Manuel de Souza born to a Joao de Souza and Maria Reis: >> >> http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/PASSAPORTES-TER-1884-1890/PASSAPORTES-TER-1884-1890_item1/index.html >> >> However, for that time period, I don't think his mom will be listed as >> Maria Reis. She'll be Maria Religious Name. She was probably a daughter of >> a Reis and that information is not listed in the passaportes. >> >> Do you have Manuel's siblings' information? That might turn up clues. >> Because he's a Manuel de Souza though, DNA is probably going to be your >> best bet. >> >> Cheri Mello >> Listowner, Azores-Gen >> Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, >> Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada >> >> >> On Fri, Jan 3, 2020 at 10:29 AM Steve Stevens <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Yeah I'm sure A Manuel Sousa entered 2 Dec 1887 on Ship Bark Sarah 19/1 >>> Male Laborer Fayal, Fall River Forward 2 bags, but not sure it is My Manual >>> Sousa. >>> >>> Let me start from my beginning journey on researching him. >>> >>> 1. 1900 Census Massachusetts, Barnstable County, Town of Falmouth, Sht >>> 34B, ED 9, shows my g-grandfather on line 51 as Souza, Manuel, b. Feb 1868, >>> age 32, married 9 years, births of he, father and mother Western Islands, >>> year of immigration given as 1890, been here 10 years and still Alien and a >>> laborer. >>> >>> 2. 1910 Census Massachusetts Barnstable County, Town of Falmouth, Sht >>> 11B, ED 10, line 60, Soza, Manuel this time year of immigration is 1887 and >>> he is still an alien. >>> >>> 3. 1920 Census Massachusetts Barnstable County, Town of Falmouth, Sht >>> 16B, ED 12, line 76, Soza, Manuel back to 1885 and naturalized 1919 >>> >>> 4. Obituary reveals this information: Born 28 Jan 1868 (note conflict >>> with 1900 Census of Feb 1868) in Terceira, Azores >>> >>> Now given a birth date of either 28 Jan or Feb 1868, immigration between >>> 1885 and 1887 and naturalized in 1919, I turned to immigration and >>> naturalization records: >>> >>> Index to Naturalization Records: >>> Massachusetts State and Federal Naturalization Records, 1798-1950, >>> >>> closest match Manoel de Souza, country of birth or allegiance Portugal, >>> birth 28 Feb 1868, date of naturalization 5 Nov 1897 (conflict with 1920 >>> Census >>> >>> Name: Manoel De Souza >>> Petition Age: 30 >>> Record Type: Petition >>> Birth Date: 28 Feb 1868 >>> Birth Place: St Michael Azores >>> Arrival Date: 16 Apr 1885 >>> Arrival Place: Boston >>> Petition Date: 9 Nov 1897 >>> Petition Place: Boston, Massachusetts, USA >>> Boston Passenger List 1820-1943- >>> July 1884, Ship Acoriano, Manuel de Souza, 18, Male, Laborer, St >>> Meguells, US, Steerage >>> November 1885, Ship Benguella, Manuel S 18, M, Tourist, Portugal, >>> Portugal, Cuba, 3, Cabin,,V >>> April 1886, Ship Bark Sarah, Manuel B de Sousa, 18/3, Male Laborer, , >>> Flores, , , Steerage Forward, >>> 2 Dec 1887, Ship Bark Sarah, Manuel Sousa, 19/1, Male, Laborer, Fayal, >>> Fall River, Forward, 2 bags >>> April 1888, Ship Forest Fairy, Manuel da Souza, 18, Male, Laborer, >>> Grasiosa, Grasiosa, USA, Steerage >>> April 1889, Ship Forest Fairy, Manuel de Souza, 18, Male, Laborer, >>> Portugal, Western Islands >>> >>> There is a Manoel de Souza vermintol who matches almost identically >>> much, but don't undersrtand the "vermintol" on the British Basque Paladin >>> and he is from Sao Miguel >>> >>> Name >>> Manoel De souza vemintol >>> Birth >>> abt 1868 >>> Departure >>> Azores >>> Arrival >>> Boston, Massachusetts, USA 17 Apr 1885 >>> >>> >>> Going to cut it short here to hear what you have to say. Thanks a bunch >>> for the help, I think it cleared things up in my own mind at least >>> >>> >>> On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 6:22:11 PM UTC-5, Cheri Mello wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi Steve S, >>>> Are you sure about that? I can't find a Manuel Souza coming into Boston >>>> on 2 Dec 1887 on the Sarah from Flores. But I found a Manuel Souza coming >>>> into Boston on 2 Dec 1887 on the Sarah from FAIAL. It's getting to be >>>> confusing. First you said it was Sao Miguel island, then Flores island, but >>>> I find Faial island. What documents do you have that say Sao Miguel? What >>>> documents say Flores? Depending on your answers to those questions will >>>> point to the right solution. Otherwise, it's a wild goose chase. >>>> >>>> You did a Y-DNA test with which company? Family Tree DNA or Ancestry? >>>> They are 2 different companies. Ancestry did Y-DNA testing years ago, but >>>> they didn't test 64 markers. FTDNA has a Y-DNA 67 test, if that is what you >>>> mean. If you did it with Ancestry, you can transfer their Y-DNA 33 or Y-DNA >>>> 46 over to FTDNA (if you downloaded the raw data file). You won't get 33 or >>>> 46 markers though, as they aren't all compatible. You can make them >>>> compatible by providing a swab and paying a fee: >>>> [image: image.png] >>>> >>>> If you did a Y-DNA test with FTDNA, you can join the Azores DNA >>>> Project. You didn't directly say that your Stephens is a corruption of >>>> Souza though. I'm guessing by your signature. And if you did test with >>>> FTDNA, you need to add the Family Finder test. It's another tool to use. >>>> Y-DNA testing is a direct line test - your father's father's father's line >>>> only. Family Finder (autosomal DNA testing) covers all your lines going >>>> back about 200 years from your birth. You'd have to tease them apart. If >>>> you did an Ancestry DNA test (like the ones you see on TV), you did an >>>> autosomal DNA test and these transfer over to FTDNA. You get matches for >>>> free. The tools and ethnicity estimates are $19. >>>> >>>> Set me straight on your island and hopefully I can point you in the >>>> right direction. >>>> >>>> Cheri Mello >>>> Listowner, Azores-Gen >>>> Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira >>>> Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 3:00 PM Steve Stevens <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Thanks for the information you provided. I have some other >>>>> information, but is does not match up to San Miguel. It saya Terceira. >>>>> >>>>> I did the 64 Y-DNA test years ago and Ancestry chose not to use these >>>>> with their new DNA test. I can provide the results if it would help, but >>>>> it >>>>> looks like I can not join the DNA group without a new test. I believe I >>>>> have his entry into Boston, from Flores on the bark Sarah 2 dec 1887 >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Steve Stevens >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 11:38:54 AM UTC-5, Cheri Mello wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Steve S, >>>>>> >>>>>> Sousa is the modern Portuguese spelling. Before 1911 you will see >>>>>> Souza. At least in the Portuguese records. The set of records you'll be >>>>>> dealing with won't be the Civil Registers but the Church records. >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, Souza/Sousa and Silva are 2 of the most common names. Records >>>>>> over there are organized on the village level. You have to know the >>>>>> village, especially when you are dealing with Sao Miguel island. That >>>>>> island alone holds half the population of the Azores and has >>>>>> approximately >>>>>> 70 churches to look through. It's a needle in a haystack. >>>>>> >>>>>> You have the immigration date. Unfortunately, the emigration leaving >>>>>> the port of Ponta Delgada on the island of Sao Miguel has some gaps in >>>>>> the >>>>>> records. That 1885-1886 is one gap. The records are simply missing. >>>>>> >>>>>> If none of your research has turned up a village (called a freguesia) >>>>>> on your Manuel, you'll have to research his sisters and find their >>>>>> immigration and naturalizations. And you'll most likely have to use DNA. >>>>>> Your matches might point towards a particular region on Sao Miguel. Or >>>>>> maybe you'll find a cousin. If your parent(s) are alive test them first. >>>>>> If >>>>>> they are not alive, test their sibling(s). If they are not alive, then >>>>>> you >>>>>> are the best candidate for the DNA test. Order through the Azores DNA >>>>>> Project on Family Tree DNA. Use this link: >>>>>> https://www.familytreedna.com/group-join.aspx?Group=AzoresIslands >>>>>> You want the Family Finder which is on sale for $49 (+$12.95 S&H - >>>>>> includes return postage if you still reside in the U.S.). The sale ends >>>>>> tonight (Jan. 2) at 11:59 pm PST. >>>>>> Cheri Mello >>>>>> Listowner, Azores-Gen >>>>>> Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira >>>>>> Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 8:23 AM Steve Stevens <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello all! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I just found this group while digging for Azores civil records or >>>>>>> information. My great-grandfather Manuel/Manoel de Sousa/Souza was born >>>>>>> about 28 February 1868 in ST. Michael/Sao Miguel, Azores, Portugal and >>>>>>> immigrated to the US about 16 April 1885/86 at Boston, MA. He was >>>>>>> naturalized 5 Nov 1897. According to marriage records, his parents were >>>>>>> John Soza and Mary Silva. Knowing that these names are like Smith and >>>>>>> Jones >>>>>>> in the US, I was hoping for some help locating Portuguese records for >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> family. He had three sisters, Mary (abt1871-1933), Marion Augusta (abt >>>>>>> 1875-1943) and Gertrude Alice (???-aft 1943). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Any help would be most appreciated. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Steve Stevens (Souza) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/01aba5af-ace1-446e-b253-ccf5c66bc1ee%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/01aba5af-ace1-446e-b253-ccf5c66bc1ee%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/5ea0d2cf-f18f-4b04-8e34-2149ebc4e6b1%40googlegroups.com >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/5ea0d2cf-f18f-4b04-8e34-2149ebc4e6b1%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> . >>>>> >>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/0195b844-67b1-4814-9fa4-b697dca243ec%40googlegroups.com >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/0195b844-67b1-4814-9fa4-b697dca243ec%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Azores Genealogy" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/fa2a3371-ca85-47ed-9ef4-de1db5434bc3%40googlegroups.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/fa2a3371-ca85-47ed-9ef4-de1db5434bc3%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Azores Genealogy" group. 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