Hi Carl, I'm sorry we can't keep Web SQL going any further in its present form. As you know, it's been deprecated for years and only Chromium still supports it. It sees little use; almost any site that wants sophisticated storage wants it to work on all browsers, and so people build things on top of indexedDB. Despite the relatively small usage, it takes us time to keep up with updates, and security problems demand our attention rather frequently. We don't have enough engineers to merit keeping it going.
On the other hand, we're quite excited about the new SQLite-over-Wasm, and some developers of other databases have told us they're interested in following this example. After years in which browser vendors tried to create sophisticated storage solutions, often without success, the possibility that databases that are available on other platforms might become available on the web, created and supported by the developer community, is quite exciting. Sorry that doesn't help with your HTML-file application :-/ If you're curious, it is possible to embed Wasm in an HTML page: - https://stackoverflow.com/questions/52582367/a-single-file-webassembly-html-demo - https://gist.github.com/dio/ae79cf546e808a9bc46515bf9400ad5d Of course, this isn't as simple or as small as simply using Web SQL, but it miiiiiight work? All best, Ben On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 11:06 AM Carl Turechek <carlturec...@gmail.com> wrote: > I don't think that the increased security will have an effect on my app, > but the removal all together is my concern. Sorry if I haven't been clear > enough. > > On Thursday, December 8, 2022 at 7:28:58 PM UTC-5 mo...@google.com wrote: > >> Yes. Carl, does your app depend on Web SQL, webkitStorageInfo, or >> something else? >> >> On Thu, Dec 8, 2022 at 6:55 PM Carl Turechek <carltu...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> You'll break an app I developed to be passed around as a single html >>> file. Hope you'll provide us plebs some guidance on finding a replacement >>> solution. >> >> >>> >>> On Wednesday, November 16, 2022 at 1:22:34 PM UTC-5 mo...@google.com >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I've done a more thorough search for examples of webkitStorageInfo and >>>> of WebSQL in insecure contexts on the web. Among the top 10K sites, the >>>> only usage I found was from standard libraries - and, in these cases, >>>> removal wouldn't cause an error or affect any functionality. >>>> >>>> No one in Enterprise at Google, Microsoft, or Salesforce has uncovered >>>> usage among their partners either. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 11:51 AM 'Thomas Steiner' via blink-dev < >>>> blin...@chromium.org> wrote: >>>> >>>>> The developer-facing documentation is being updated in >>>>> https://github.com/GoogleChrome/developer.chrome.com/pull/4299. >>>>> >>>>> On Sat, Nov 12, 2022 at 12:26 AM Ayu Ishii <ay...@chromium.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> We've done some extra communications with enterprise partners and >>>>>> have come up with a new target milestone. >>>>>> The new target milestone for this removal is M110, with enterprise >>>>>> policy available for 2 milestones (M110-111). >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks! >>>>>> Ayu >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 7:49:00 PM UTC-7 Ayu Ishii wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Thank you all for the approvals! >>>>>>> And thank you miketaylr@ for the HTTPArchive analysis! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 1:12:55 PM UTC-7 Mike Taylor wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 6/1/22 3:52 PM, Yoav Weiss wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> LGTM3 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Jun 1, 2022 at 8:58 PM Mike Taylor <mike...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 6/1/22 1:34 PM, Chris Harrelson wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 8:26 PM Ayu Ishii <ay...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Mike! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> With the current usage measurements we see, we hadn't considered >>>>>>>>>> any enterprise policy for opt-out. >>>>>>>>>> But certainly can follow the process to do so if you feel that >>>>>>>>>> there may be risk of undercounting. >>>>>>>>>> Deprecation of WebSQL in third-party contexts added a policy that >>>>>>>>>> lasted 3 milestones after deprecation before full removal as an >>>>>>>>>> example. >>>>>>>>>> Although the usages were quite different from that deprecation, >>>>>>>>>> we can follow the same process if this sounds reasonable. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I think this plan sounds good. LGTM1 once you have an enterprise >>>>>>>>> opt-out in place that will remain for 3 milestones. Also please make >>>>>>>>> sure >>>>>>>>> to communicate this change in the enterprise notes and other >>>>>>>>> communication >>>>>>>>> channels. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> A couple of notes I took last Friday and forgot to post: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I dumped the list of sites from HTTPArchive (query below) and >>>>>>>>> after de-duping them, ended up with 835 sites. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I then ran a script which naively looks at response codes, and got >>>>>>>>> the following results: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> 2XX count: 685/835 >>>>>>>>> 3XX to HTTP endpoint count: 74/835 >>>>>>>>> 4XX count: 3/835 >>>>>>>>> 5XX count: 2/835 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> So, from this dataset, roughly 9% of those redirect to an HTTP >>>>>>>>> endpoint. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This should say HTTPS, not HTTP. I am bad at typing. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> That said, I think reducing risk of breakage for enterprise >>>>>>>>> environments is a useful and friendly thing to do. LGTM2 w/ that done. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> SELECT >>>>>>>>> rank, >>>>>>>>> url, >>>>>>>>> FROM >>>>>>>>> `httparchive.blink_features.features` >>>>>>>>> WHERE feature = 'OpenWebDatabaseInsecureContext' >>>>>>>>> ORDER BY rank ASC >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> - Ayu >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:57:01 PM UTC-7 Mike West wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I'm happy to see this moving forward, thanks for pushing it >>>>>>>>>>> ahead! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> That said, this seems like the kind of thing that's >>>>>>>>>>> likely-enough to impact enterprise that we should include a >>>>>>>>>>> temporary >>>>>>>>>>> opt-out to give ourselves some wiggle room if it turns out that >>>>>>>>>>> we're >>>>>>>>>>> undercounting usage. Have y'all already put something like that >>>>>>>>>>> together? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -mike >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, May 27, 2022 at 2:18 AM Ayu Ishii <ay...@chromium.org> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Contact emails *ay...@chromium.org, jsb...@chromium.org, >>>>>>>>>>>> ajayra...@google.com >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Specification *https://www.w3.org/TR/webdatabase/ >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Summary *We intend to deprecate and remove usage of WebSQL in >>>>>>>>>>>> non-secure contexts. Deprecation is targeted for M105 and removal >>>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>>> targeted for M107. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Blink component *Blink>Storage>WebSQL >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Blink%3EStorage%3EWebSQL> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Motivation *The Web SQL Database standard was first proposed >>>>>>>>>>>> in April 2009 and abandoned in November 2010. Gecko never >>>>>>>>>>>> implemented this >>>>>>>>>>>> feature and WebKit deprecated this feature in 2019 >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/commit/761bce943c0696a6bb93116eb0576ed07dbfdc65>. >>>>>>>>>>>> The W3C encouraged those needing web databases to adopt Web >>>>>>>>>>>> Storage <https://www.w3.org/TR/webstorage/> or Indexed Database >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.w3.org/TR/IndexedDB/>. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> WebSQL has been deprecated and removed >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/blink-dev/c/TM6YDx1Hh08> >>>>>>>>>>>> for third-party contexts in M97. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> We hope to entirely deprecate and remove WebSQL at some future >>>>>>>>>>>> point when usage is low enough. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *TAG review *N/A >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Risks >>>>>>>>>>>> Based on usage measurements >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/4073> >>>>>>>>>>>> rolled out in M97, 0.005% of page loads use WebSQL in a non-secure >>>>>>>>>>>> context. Less than 0.01% of top sites have adopted this feature. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Out of the 20 top sites listed for the month of April 2022, 11 >>>>>>>>>>>> of the sites use a feature detection library Modernizr 1.5 >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://modernizr.com/news/modernizr-15>, on a version >>>>>>>>>>>> released in 2010. This would create a test database to check >>>>>>>>>>>> feature >>>>>>>>>>>> availability. I was unable to reproduce the creation of other >>>>>>>>>>>> WebSQL >>>>>>>>>>>> databases outside of the one created by Modernizr on these sites. >>>>>>>>>>>> 4 sites >>>>>>>>>>>> that seem to use an outdated private mode detection script >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://stackoverflow.com/q/48169810> which was intended for >>>>>>>>>>>> older versions of iOS. All the scripts I have found checked if >>>>>>>>>>>> window.openDatabase existed before usage, likely due to the lack >>>>>>>>>>>> of support >>>>>>>>>>>> in Gecko and WebKit. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Gecko: Never implemented >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> WebKit: Deprecation shipped in iOS 13 and Safari 13 >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://trac.webkit.org/changeset/277564/webkit> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Web developers: No signals >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Debuggability *N/A >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Is this feature fully tested by web-platform-tests >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/main/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md> >>>>>>>>>>>> ? >>>>>>>>>>>> Not fully, one test >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/web_tests/external/wpt/clear-site-data/support/test_utils.sub.js;l=136> >>>>>>>>>>>> checks the availability of the feature. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Tracking bug *https://crbug.com/1212492 >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Link to related intents >>>>>>>>>>>> Intent to Deprecate and Remove: WebSQL in third-party contexts >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/g/blink-dev/c/TM6YDx1Hh08> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status * >>>>>>>>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5175124599767040 >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to blink-dev+...@chromium.org. >>>>>>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/bc5f407d-e6fe-4743-ae46-84541d271a92n%40chromium.org >>>>>>>>>>>> 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