The BMW UUC Digest Volume 2 : Issue 687 : "text" Format Messages in this Issue: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: E36 M3 oil pressure issue. Re: <E36> new cat? Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Re: <E36> new cat? Re: e46 Hidden V1
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 11:28:52 -1000 From: Jay G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> i once attended a track day where the inexperienced "tech inspector" ( all he did was make sure there was nothing loose in the cabin, and checked tire pressures) kept arguing with me to bump up my tire pressure...i kept telling him i was running r compunds and they'd heat up quickly and increase in pressure, but he didnt want to listen...he had to call the guy who was running the track event to come and talk to me...the guy who was running the event knew me, and knew that i was experienced, and agreed with me once i explained the situation... that day, i was at about 30psi cold, and 40-41 hot on MPSCs. ----- Original Message ----- From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > but now that you mention it, last summer event on a hot day I was around > 30psi before heading out on the track and had to back off a few times > because > the tires were going away.. so 10-15 psi increase was probably where I was ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 14:37:07 -0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [email protected] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Jim, I have to partly semi-disagree with you. RA-1s are known to come from the factory with the worst case of mold release compound known to humankind. If they are at full tread depth, you'd be foolish not to do a serious heat-cycling. The last set of RA-1s I used (around 15 years ago, not that things could not have changed since then) were un-shaved, un-heat-cycled, and were like driving on Teflon-coated grease. No one had told me about mold release compound or heat cycling at that time. Having semi-said that, my new ones have been shaved to 6/32" tread depth (full depth is 8/32"). I just picked them up at AIM (at Sears Point/Infineon/whatever it is called this week), where they are preparing to support 3 major races in the next 2 weekends. Wow, they've got a lot of tires! But I digress. So my heat cycling question has nothing to do with the mold release compound aspect, but just the prep for autocross use. You are the second person to say no heat cycling is required. You're the first to quote a seemingly authoritative source. Thanks, Scott Miller GGC BMW CCA P.S. Are you the same Jim Patterson who used to tow the GGC autocross trailer with a station wagon? >Date: Wed, 08 Jun 2005 19:47:55 -0700 >From: Jim Patterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Scott, > >I talked to the Toyo rep (Dave Taylor, frequently seen at Southern Cal >Drivings Schools) at O'fest last year and asked him that question. He >told me that the RA1s don't need to be heat cycled. > >Jim ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 15:04:19 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jim Bassett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> On Thu, June 9, 2005 2:37 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > Jim, I have to partly semi-disagree with you. RA-1s are known to come > from > the factory with the worst case of mold release compound known to > humankind. If they are at full tread depth, you'd be foolish not to do a > serious heat-cycling. The last set of RA-1s I used (around 15 years ago, > not that things could not have changed since then) were un-shaved, > un-heat-cycled, and were like driving on Teflon-coated grease. No one had > told me about mold release compound or heat cycling at that time. Again, you're confusing "heat-cycling" with "scrubbing-in". What you are describing, getting rid of mold release compound (or in general, getting new tires ready for use) is "scrubbing-in". Any tire should have this done, even street tires. "Heat-cycling" is different (usually, although both could be done at the same time, assuming you get the tires hot enough). Here you have to get the tire up to operating temperature and then let it cool, and it's purpose is to work on the tire rubber at the molecular level. From Tire Rack's web site: Running new tires through an easy heat cycle first, and allowing them to relax allows the rubber bonds to relink in a more uniform manner than they were originally manufactured. It actually makes them more consistent in strength and more resistant to losing their strength the next time they are used. I'm sure Gary or another tire engineer will correct me <g>, but the above is based on my own somewhat-extensive use of RA-1s and other R-compound tires for DE/racing/autox. My 2 cents, Jim Bassett 1998 M3/4 1993 325is #44 JP ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 15:30:48 -0700 From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I'm with the others who don't think the RA-1's need to be heat-cycled and 'rested' initially. My novice understanding of the motiviation for heat-cycling (which I do do for Hoosiers) is that you're trying to stabilize the rubber so that subsequent heat-cycles result in less degradation of adhesion. It seems that with RA-1s this doesn't happen much anyway, even if you don't heat cycle first. My experience is that if you start with an enduro shave, you'll run out of tread before that kind of degradation occurs in a measurable way. In fact, they'll often be fastest just about when you're out of tread. Starting with full-tread tho, I have experienced a significant loss of adhesion before running out of tread, so I guess there are limits. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Bassett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 3:04 PM Subject: Re: [UUC] Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s > On Thu, June 9, 2005 2:37 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: >> Jim, I have to partly semi-disagree with you. RA-1s are known to come >> from >> the factory with the worst case of mold release compound known to >> humankind. If they are at full tread depth, you'd be foolish not to do a >> serious heat-cycling. The last set of RA-1s I used (around 15 years ago, >> not that things could not have changed since then) were un-shaved, >> un-heat-cycled, and were like driving on Teflon-coated grease. No one >> had >> told me about mold release compound or heat cycling at that time. > > Again, you're confusing "heat-cycling" with "scrubbing-in". > > What you are describing, getting rid of mold release compound (or in > general, getting new tires ready for use) is "scrubbing-in". Any tire > should have this done, even street tires. > > "Heat-cycling" is different (usually, although both could be done at the > same time, assuming you get the tires hot enough). Here you have to get > the tire up to operating temperature and then let it cool, and it's > purpose is to work on the tire rubber at the molecular level. From Tire > Rack's web site: > Running new tires through an easy heat cycle first, and allowing them to > relax allows the rubber bonds to relink in a more uniform manner than they > were originally manufactured. It actually makes them more consistent in > strength and more resistant to losing their strength the next time they > are used. > > I'm sure Gary or another tire engineer will correct me <g>, but the above > is based on my own somewhat-extensive use of RA-1s and other R-compound > tires for DE/racing/autox. > > My 2 cents, > Jim Bassett > 1998 M3/4 > 1993 325is #44 JP > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 15:36:04 -0700 From: JKerouac <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> What about products like Formula-V to bring back traction to a worn or over-heat cycled tire? Barry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I'm with the others who don't think the RA-1's need to be heat-cycled > and 'rested' initially. My novice understanding of the motiviation for > heat-cycling (which I do do for Hoosiers) is that you're trying to > stabilize the rubber so that subsequent heat-cycles result in less > degradation of adhesion. It seems that with RA-1s this doesn't > happen much anyway, even if you don't heat cycle first. > My experience is that if you start with an enduro shave, you'll run > out of tread before that kind of degradation occurs in a measurable > way. In fact, they'll often be fastest just about when you're out of > tread. Starting with full-tread tho, I have experienced a > significant loss of adhesion before running out of tread, so I guess > there are limits. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 15:41:58 -0700 From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> shhhhhhhhhhhhhh -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of JKerouac Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 3:36 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC] Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s What about products like Formula-V to bring back traction to a worn or over-heat cycled tire? Barry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I'm with the others who don't think the RA-1's need to be heat-cycled > and 'rested' initially. My novice understanding of the motiviation for > heat-cycling (which I do do for Hoosiers) is that you're trying to > stabilize the rubber so that subsequent heat-cycles result in less > degradation of adhesion. It seems that with RA-1s this doesn't > happen much anyway, even if you don't heat cycle first. > My experience is that if you start with an enduro shave, you'll run > out of tread before that kind of degradation occurs in a measurable > way. In fact, they'll often be fastest just about when you're out of > tread. Starting with full-tread tho, I have experienced a > significant loss of adhesion before running out of tread, so I guess > there are limits. Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 16:15:38 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jim Bassett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Ahh, so you think it's snake oil, too? :-) Jim Bassett On Thu, June 9, 2005 3:41 pm, Marco Romani said: > shhhhhhhhhhhhhh > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of JKerouac > Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 3:36 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Cc: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [UUC] Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s > > > What about products like Formula-V to bring back traction to a worn or > over-heat cycled tire? > Barry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 14:40:40 -0700 From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 M3 oil pressure issue. Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Not sure if you have gotten an answer to this question yet. Have you put a mechanical gauge on the car to make sure you actually have oil pressure? You should be able to thread it into the same port the stock sender uses. The light should go out at anything over 7.5psi IIRC (I think, it may be 15psi). I would guess you do have pressure (unless you have a really bad bearing somewhere in the motor that isn't allowing pressure to build) since you've replaced the oil pump, but who knows. To me it sounds like you have a bad wire in the harness if you really have oil pressure. BTW - the pan gasket shouldn't have anything to do with your pressure until it allows all the oil to leak out. ;-) Marco -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Peter Wheeler Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 9:55 AM To: BMW List; E36M3 Subject: [UUC] E36 M3 oil pressure issue. 1997 M3/4 Automatic 120k miles Can't seem to get the oil pressure light off. Have replaced: Switch (twice) Oil Pan Gasket Oil Pump No change. Is this a common problem? Is there some part I should be looking to replace other than what I have already? Sorry for the cross post, any help is greatly appreciated. Peter Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 11:54:41 -1000 From: Jay G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: <E36> new cat? Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> maybe it's aftermarket brake pads?!? and what you're seeing is the brake dust...some pad's dust turns into a rust like color when wet... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Ruiz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> After driving it a few days, there is black > dust all over it again, and it has about the > consistency of soot. uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 20:19:36 -0400 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Norm Reini" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Heat Cycling Toyo RA-1s Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Weight, camber, wheel width, etc affects the optimal pressure. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for all. Gary Derian > Carlos and Rich, > > I received some coaching from a racer in TX, who has found that if he > keeps the RA1 under 36psi hot, that their traction and life is > significantly better. > > When I've run the RA1 on an 88M5, the early track events (prior to summer) > always offered significantly better traction and wear. Only after several > 90+degree days, did I find that they would go off 10-12 minutes into the > run. In fact, this was the only time that the pressure exceed 36psi > (maybe as high as 40). > > I have a brand new set for this year and I am going to see if this > approach works. > > -norm > > Carlos Lopez wrote: >> --- Scott & Charlotte Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >>>Here's my question: How important is the 24 hours part? What if one >>>only had 18 hours available? Or only 12 hours? How do the tires >>>know how long they've been sitting? >>> >>>Scott Miller >>>GGC BMW CCA >>>Probably with insufficient time for a complete cool-down for proper >>>heat-cycling of new tires >> >> >> Bah. That's the good thing about RA1s, mount 'em and run 'em. I >> wouldn't bother with the heat cycle. Do whatever you can if you think >> it'll help but I mounted mine up, drove 3 hours to Mid-Ohio and beat >> the crap out of them w/o any worries. They look fine after the weekend >> and mine weren't shaved so I got to beat up on everyone in my run group >> in the rain. :-) >> >> Carlos. >> >> >> >> >> __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps >> protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail >> Search the >> ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] >> >> >> __________________________________________________________________________ >> In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. >> >> UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate >> Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! >> 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com >> > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 21:55:44 -0400 From: Chris Pawlowicz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: UUC Digest <[email protected]> Cc: Brian Ruiz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: <E36> new cat? Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> brian, running rich = soot out the tailpipe (cat or no cat) running wide open throttle = running rich (from the factory, often more so with aftermarket chips). At WOT you ignore the o2 sensor, so rich=safe. been enjoying the M3 have you ? :) some other sources -if the car has not been used hard it will often have a buildup of sooty stuff in the exhaust.. running it WOT can blast this stuff out -if the car has been abused or is old, oil can get sucked past the valvetrain (esp on hard shifts) and a puff of oil smoke can burp out the exhaust This stuff usually collects around the tailpipe.. not sure about the whole rear of the car. Drive it like a maniac and see if it mostly clears up :) ('italian tune-up') chris '89 325i '99 z3 2.8 Brian Ruiz wrote: > Hey all, > > I had noticed when I had bought my car a few months > ago that there was some rusty-colored junk that was > adhered to the paint on the horizontal parts of the > rear of my car (i.e. bumper, edge of the trunklid). I > got around to trying to clean it up the other night by > using some clay on it. It came off with some > hesitance, and I was much happier to see it cleaned > off, as I was afraid it was really eating into the > paint. After driving it a few days, there is black > dust all over it again, and it has about the > consistency of soot. Does this indicate that the cat > is in need of replacement, or does it more indicate a > problem with fuel/air ratio? The car is running a > Dinan chip and CAI, and runs rich. > > Thanks, > Brian > 95 M3 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Jun 2005 08:52:21 -0700 From: Alex Koreneff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: e46 Hidden V1 Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > You still have the V1 box to mount in some place > with a good field of view, so why bother? I installed a V1 in my e46 330ci in a very nice looking installation, but I've run into an issue - the included suction cups are clear and catch the light, making the installation rather obvious. Does anyone know where I might find black suction cups that would fit the v1 mount? For those of you who might be interested, I put the direct wire power adapter above the headliner, next to the universal transmitter remote. I tapped that remote's power (green is ignition +12, brown is ground), and ran a hand-made black power cable out under the headliner lip and to the v1, which I placed on the passenger side, with its rear sensor peeking out just past the mirror. I tucked grey cable under the headliner down to the passenger a-pillar, where I then ran it down under the innermost weatherstripping, then across under the Titanium trim (there's a channel in mine perfect for phone cable. To the right of the steering wheel, under the trim, is a hole through the dash which comes out right under the gauge cluster. I ran the grey power cable into there, used crimp connectors to change to black, and ran the power cable out under the gauge cluster itself, and affixed the remote display to the dash directly in front of the auto transmission display (I have a manual). The included 'velcro' is useless, so I picked up some 3m velcro from my local BMW dealer -- it looks better and actually sticks to the dash. I also put some electrical tape over the display on the v1 itself so the POST didnt display there. The result is a very clean installation with cable the same color as the surrounding area... as invisible as it gets without cutting. Of course, those (&*^ng clear suction cups make it obvious from the outside. =/ ------------------------------ End of [bmwuucdigest] digest(12 messages) **********
