----- Original Message ----- From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Brin-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 3:03 PM Subject: Re: Tragedy in Israel
> At 11:14 2-12-01 -0500, Tom Beck wrote: > > ><< Will we then also be allowed to refer to certain groups of Israelis (and > >individual Israelis) as the evil sons of bitches they are, whenever > >Palestinians get killed? >> > > > >Sigh. Not this again. There's a difference between what the two sides are > >doing, and if you can't (or, in this case, more likely, *WON'T*) see that, > >then there's really no point in our discussing this issue. Because you're > >just another fucking Nazi. > > In your own words: Sigh. Not this again. > > Tom, what are you trying to accomplish here? If you are trying to polarise > the Israel/Palestine debate, you are doing an excellent job. Calling anyone > who shows even a hint of criticism of Israel "a fucking Nazi" does not > exactly contribute to an increase in mutual understanding. > I suggest you read the posts again. In his own post, Tom criticized Israel. Since he did not call himself a Nazi, then by definition, he could not call everyone who critized Israel Nazis. > I most certainly do not. I do not believe *anyone* should be persecuted >and killed for their religious beliefs. But, why do you find nothing right at all with Israel? Why do you have such a double standard? > > Sigh. Not this again. Note that I criticize Israel's politics, not its > religion. Anti-Semitism means hating Jews; I do not hate Jews (why should > I?) If you want to look at the reason that you appear anti-Semetic to many, you might want to look at a fundamental asymmetry in your arguements. You strain at every Israelie gnat and swallow Palestinian camels. Thus, it is very reasonable to conclude that you have a double standard. As for the reason, you live in a country where, for the most part, Jewish people are afraid to live. There use to be a flourishing Jewish community, which has shrunk to near zero. Is it unreasonable to assume that you have accidently picked up anti-Semetic memes that are floating around? > If someone is critical of America's politics, does that make a person > anti-American? I can choose any government in this world, and find > something about their politics I disagree with. Does that mean I am > anti-everyone? > You could, but you don't. You have a set of standards that seems like: Any excuse can be made for those that oppose the United States or Israel. Israel and the United States must be perfect to be barely acceptable. Why? And, to repeat my question from earlier, does targeting armed warriers who refuse to abide by the Geneva convention equate with targeting civilians going about their daily business? If so, why? Oh, just to show you that I do criticize Israel, I think adding to the settlements in the West Bank is both provacative and counter-productive. It is the single biggest mistake made by the government of Israel and has hurt the peace process. Dan M.
