Ray, I think arguments could be made for a couple species / morphs based on the backlit photos, and I have my opinion, but as you heard the bird call my bet would be whatever the vocalization indicates. I don’t know if you are solid on the calls, but to my ear the Broad-winged “p-seeee” and juvenile Red-tail squeals can sound similar. Red-shouldered Hawks sound completely different and the unlikely Zone-tailed even more so.
Gary From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dave Nutter Sent: Monday, June 16, 2014 4:32 AM To: CAYUGABIRDS-L Subject: Re: [cayugabirds-l] dark red-tailed hawk Good point about the primary barring showing at the molt. If the slaty color of the wing linings and underside of the body & head is true, not just reddish which appears so dark because it's dull, backlit, and distant (as our usual Broad-wingeds appear gray instead of pink on the breast when high overhead), then I must admit that Zone-tailed seems possible. I think Red-shouldered, although darker than Broad-winged, shouldn't be so extensively dark, either. I'm just not familiar enough with Zone-tailed to be confident. --Dave Nutter On Jun 15, 2014, at 11:28 PM, Rbakelaar <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: The photos seem to demonstrate barring on the primaries, more so than I would expect on even a dark phase Broad-wing. The molted out feather allows this characteristic to be seen somewhat well. This bird's proportions seem to weigh against B-wing too. The wings seem long and narrow, with only a slight bulge of the secondaries. Tail seems long as we'll. The photos also seem to show a black body. Any of our resident experts care to weigh in? Ryan. Sent from my iPhone On Jun 15, 2014, at 10:57 PM, Dave Nutter <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I couldn't reconcile the red tail of photo 1 with the black and white stripes of photo 3, even though I have seen various effects of looking through backlit feathers. The reason I didn't say Red-shouldered Hawk is that the white tail-band appeared too wide to me (but this may be a focus issue, or may judgement may be wrong), and the white mark in the otherwise even-colored primaries appears to me due to a molted missing feather on each side, not a "window" across the primaries. The reason I said "the only species of Buteo around here" is that Zone-tailed Hawk is way out of range, and also is less familiar to me. My guess was that Zone-tailed would not look so pale on the flight feathers of the wings. I am open to correction on all points. --Dave Nutter On Jun 15, 2014, at 08:28 PM, Sandy Podulka <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: As you know, I'm really just a beginner at hawks...... but... What about a Red-shouldered Hawk? It's got the white windows and the banded tail. The reddish appearance of the tail could just be sunlight shining through brownish feathers, which can really play tricks on the eye. It seems like the distribution of light and dark on the underside of the wings matches that of Red-shouldered Hawk. Sandy At 08:09 PM 6/15/2014, Ann Mitchell wrote: I agree with Dave regarding a Broad-winged Hawk. Ann Mitchell Sent from my iPhone On Jun 15, 2014, at 5:28 PM, Dave Nutter <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I am NOT an authority on raptors, but that has never stopped me from commenting before, so here's my guess: I think the first blurry photo looks like a dark type of Red-tailed Hawk more typically found out west. I think the second and third photos are of a different bird with a feather missing from primaries on each side. The only species of Buteo around here with such a wide bold white stripe in the tail is Broad-winged Hawk, which also shows a black outline to the ends of the flight feathers on the entire wing, as seen in the third photo. However, dark-type Broad-winged Hawks are rare, and the wing shape looks too long and rounded to me, so I'm not at all confident. I hope someone who really knows what they are talking about has a look at your photos and sets me straight. --Dave Nutter On Jun 15, 2014, at 03:23 PM, Ray Zimmerman <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Today around 12:30pm as I stepped outside (in Eastern Heights, Ithaca) the call of red-tailed hawk caught my attention and I quickly spotted it circling overhead. As I grabbed my binoculars, I soon realized that it was a very unusual red-tail (at least very different from the one’s I’m used to seeing). As you can see from very bad photos linked below, it was quit dark below. So is this a western bird, or is this just a variation I haven’t seen around here before? https://www.dropbox.com/sh/t7pw5hoifjpzeey/AABcyimp4JipHTo8DwZc0r8-a — Ray -- Cayugabirds-L List Info: http://www.NortheastBirding.com/CayugabirdsWELCOME http://www.NortheastBirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES> http://www.NortheastBirding.com/CayugabirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm ARCHIVES: 1) [email protected]<http://www.mail-archive.com/%3ca%20href=> /maillist.html'> http://www.mail-archive.com/ [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> /maillist.html 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/Cayugabirds 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/CAYU.html Please submit your observations to eBird: http://ebird.org/content/ebird/ -- -- Cayugabirds-L List Info: Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsWELCOME> Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm> Archives: The Mail Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html> Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/Cayugabirds> BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/CAYU.html> Please submit your observations to eBird<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>! ---- Cayugabirds-L List Info: Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsWELCOME> Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm> Archives: The Mail Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html> Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/Cayugabirds> BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/CAYU.html> Please submit your observations to eBird<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>! -- -- Cayugabirds-L List Info: Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsWELCOME> Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm> Archives: The Mail Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html> Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/Cayugabirds> BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/CAYU.html> Please submit your observations to eBird<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>! -- -- Cayugabirds-L List Info: Welcome and Basics<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsWELCOME> Rules and Information<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave<http://www.northeastbirding.com/CayugabirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm> Archives: The Mail Archive<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html> Surfbirds<http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/Cayugabirds> BirdingOnThe.Net<http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/CAYU.html> Please submit your observations to eBird<http://ebird.org/content/ebird/>! -- -- Cayugabirds-L List Info: http://www.NortheastBirding.com/CayugabirdsWELCOME http://www.NortheastBirding.com/CayugabirdsRULES http://www.NortheastBirding.com/CayugabirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm ARCHIVES: 1) http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/Cayugabirds 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/CAYU.html Please submit your observations to eBird: http://ebird.org/content/ebird/ --
