Michael, you got genes that tell you that you're a man, are you not controlled by that? Why are you attracted to women? Is that all learned behavior? I think you're confusing being gay with the behavior of some gay people. If a person decides to abstain from sex, that does not make him/her asexual, his/her brain still sends out the impluses for sexual behavior.
I'm not about to discount the gay gene therapy, I have no way to tell if it's true or not. I'm guessing I have the straight gene, therefore how can I tell how a gene affects someone else. Michael Dinowitz wrote: >Here's the problem. The way your making it sound below basically says we have no >choice in the matter. If you've got the 'gay gene(s)' then your going to be gay >no matter what. I just can not accept that scientifically. And that's besides >the 'it's determined early in pregnancy". >But that's just me. I believe that I am not a machine controlled by my genes. > > > >>All the available evidence suggest that whether you are attracted to >>the same or the opposite sex is determined very early on during >>pregnancy. If there is such a strong biological component to being >>straight or gay, then all the negative results with different >>conversion therapies fit. From what I remember, the only type of >>therapy that may have showed some promise was aversion therapy, where >>the client/victim would be shocked when they saw a picture of a >>naked man, and the shock was stopped, or the subject not shocked >>(relief conditioning) when shown a picture of a naked woman. >> >>Again no followup and there was no real details about the subjects. I >>suspect that over the long term the therapy did not work. >> >>larry >> >> >> >>>The story of that is a very interesting one. It basically involved a 'forced' >>>vote where those against were not allowed into the room. Once the >>>vote was made, >>>there was basically no turning back. Lots of controversy... >>> >>> >>> >>>> http://www.aap.org/policy/05072.html >>>> "In 1973, the American Psychiatric Association reclassified homosexuality >>>> >>>> >as > > >>>> a sexual orientation/expression rather than as a mental disorder. [1] The >>>> etiology of homosexuality remains unclear, but the current literature and >>>> the vast majority of scholars in this field state that one's sexual >>>> orientation is not a choice, that is, individuals no more choose to be >>>> homosexual than heterosexual." >>>> >>>> http://www.psych.org/pract_of_psych/copptherapyaddendum83100.cfm >>>> "...the American Psychiatric Association opposes any psychiatric >>>> >>>> >treatment, > > >>>> such as reparative or conversion therapy which is based upon the >>>> >>>> >assumption > > >>>> that homosexuality per se is a mental disorder or based upon the a priori >>>> assumption that the patient should change his/her sexual homosexual >>>> orientation." >>>> >>>> http://www.psych.org/public_info/homose~1.cfm >>>> "There are a few reports in the literature of efforts to use >>>> psychotherapeutic and counseling techniques to treat persons troubled by >>>> their homosexuality who desire to become heterosexual; however, results >>>> >>>> >have > > >>>> not been conclusive, nor have they been replicated. There is no evidence >>>> that any treatment can change a homosexual person's deep seated sexual >>>> feelings for others of the same sex. " >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> > http://www.apa.org/pubinfo/answers.html >>> >>> >>>> "Is Sexual Orientation a Choice? >>>> >>>> No, human beings can not choose to be either gay or straight. Sexual >>>> orientation emerges for most people in early adolescence without any prior >>>> sexual experience. Although we can choose whether to act on our feelings, >>>> psychologists do not consider sexual orientation to be a conscious choice >>>> that can be voluntarily changed." >>>> >>>> http://www.hrc.org/newsreleases/1998/981211apa.asp >>>> http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/resolution97_comment.html >>>> http://www.covenantnetwork.org/chgther.html >>>> >>>> -Kevin >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> > -----Original Message----- >>>> > From: Michael Dinowitz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>> > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 12:49 PM >>>> > To: CF-Community >>>> > Subject: Re: Warning: This may offend if religious >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > Actually, it is. No amount of research has shown for a fact that >>>> > you are forced >>>> > to be gay or not. There has been some research to show that there >>>> > are things >>>> > that may make someone more inclined in that area, but the same >>>> > can be said for >>>> > many other behavioral choices. >>>> > On that same note, there is research to indicate that religion, >>>> > or the belief in >>>> > the divine has a biological component as well. As this puts >>>> >>>> >>> > > homosexuality on the >>> > > same biological level as religion, to bash one is to allow the bashing >>> >>> >of > > >>> > > another. Lets add in left handed people as well just for good measure. >>> >>> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > > Homosexuality is usually not a choice. >>>> > > >>>> > > -Kevin >>>> > > >>>> > > > -----Original Message----- >>>> > > > From: William H. Bowen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>> > > > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 11:39 AM >>>> > > > To: CF-Community >>>> > > > Subject: Re: Warning: This may offend if religious >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > I find it interesting that homosexuality is considered a >>>> > > > "lifestyle" choice >>>> > > > whereas religious faith is not. >>>> > > > >>>> > > > <cf_flamesuit condition=on> >>>> > > > >>>> > > > will >>>> > > > ---- >>>> > > > >>>> > > > William H. Bowen >>>> > > > Webmaster >>>> > > > >>>> > > > ALSTOM's T&D Energy Automation & Information Business >>>> > > > >>>> > > > "Your friendly neighborhood Webmaster!" >>>> > > > >>>> > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>> > > > http://www.esca.com/ >>>> > > > >>>> > > > 425.739.3629 Voice >>>> > > > 425.466.7016 Cell >>>> > > > 425.739.3690 FAX >>>> > > > ----- Original Message ----- >>>> >>>> >>> > > > > From: "Matthew Small" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >>> >>>> > > > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>> > > > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 8:34 AM >>>> > > > Subject: RE: Warning: This may offend if religious >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > > Well, you got your flame :-) >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > First of all, I would say that you need to read the Bible >>>> > in order to >>>> > > > > understand it, and then there are things that either humans are >>>> >>>> >not > > >>>> > > > > meant to understand or their meaning has not been revealed yet. >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Second, I respect your right to disbelieve and disagree but >>>> > not to bash. >>>> > > > > Just two or three days ago, this list (publicly, at least) >>>> > was all about >>>> > > > > protecting the homosexual lifestyle and routing out the bigots. >>>> >>>> >My > > >>>> > > > > faith is as important to me as anybody else's lifestyle. >>>> > Saying that >>>> > > > > war is all due to the Christian Bible is like saying that >>>> > poverty is due >>>> > > > > to the blacks, or that all Muslims are looking to bomb your >>>> > workspace. >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > I'm not upset, I just want the respect that every other >>>> > lifestyle seems >>>> > > > > to enjoy. It seems like bashing Christians for their faith >>>> > is ok these >>>> > > > > days. >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Matthew Small >>>> > > > > IT Supervisor >>>> > > > > Showstopper National Dance Competitions >>>> > > > > 3660 Old Kings Hwy >>>> > > > > Murrells Inlet, SC 29576 >>>> > > > > 843-357-1847 >>>> > > > > http://www.showstopperonline.com >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > -----Original Message----- >>>> > > > > From: Mark Smyth [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>> > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 11:13 AM >>>> > > > > To: CF-Community >>>> > > > > Subject: RE: Warning: This may offend if religious >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > i for one agree totally >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > -----Original Message----- >>>> > > > > From: cfhelp [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>> > > > > Sent: 05 December 2002 16:22 >>>> > > > > To: CF-Community >>>> > > > > Subject: RE: Warning: This may offend if religious >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > It's no wonder the world is at war. One chapter say's this >>>> > and the next >>>> > > > > contradicts but nobody can get the point. >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Well there was a South Park episode that got it right. This book >>>> >>>> >was > > >>>> > > > > meant >>>> > > > > as an example not as law and certainly not a prelude for war. >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Expecting Flames >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Rick >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > -----Original Message----- >>>> > > > > From: Philip Arnold - ASP [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>> > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 9:19 AM >>>> > > > > To: CF-Community >>>> > > > > Subject: Warning: This may offend if religious >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > http://justdrew.net/Biblical/ >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > This guy basically goes through the bible pointing out >>>> > inconsistancies >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Some are pretty funny/strange, but damn interesting none the less >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Oh, and the links he points out goto a site that only has the New >>>> > > > > Testament, not the Old, so quite a few don't work >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > Philip Arnold >>>> > > > > Technical Director >>>> > > > > Certified ColdFusion Developer >>>> >>>> >>> > > > > > ASP Multimedia Limited >>> >>> >>>> > > > > Switchboard: +44 (0)20 8680 8099 >>>> > > > > Fax: +44 (0)20 8686 7911 >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > www.aspmedia.co.uk >>>> > > > > www.aspevents.net >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > An ISO9001 registered company. >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > ********************************************************************** >>>> > > > > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and >>>> > > > > intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom >>>> >>>> >they > > >>>> > > > > are addressed. If you have received this email in error >>>> > please notify >>>> > > > > the system manager. >>>> > > > > >>>> > ********************************************************************** >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>>> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=5 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribe&forumid=5 Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.5
