Run JHS and check menu link|jhelp|sp (just a pointer to do sphelp). sphelp NB. noun that documents sp stuff
The idea of managed script execution is an alternative to labs. But having a script as an html document with tags makes it very easy to include material in a script that is not just code that could present differently in the different front ends. On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 12:33 PM, robert therriault <[email protected]> wrote: > Thanks Eric, > > I had not thought about spx as a replacement to the lab framework, in fact I > have not ventured into that part of the framework at all (aside from seeing > it as part of the ios when the ipad version came out). What would you > recommend as the quickest way to come up to speed on this? I've done a quick > look at the sp.ijs script but haven't found anything in the wiki. Your ideas > certainly give me some direction (handwaving ideas are the best for that!). > > The areas that I was working on were within the demo examples and > specifically demo9 (the multiframe demo) since it is possible to access video > in the frames by specifying the src as the video url. This allows video > instruction in one window while the J lab can proceed next to it in the ijx > window, while other windows can be used for navigation. It sounds as if the > spx provides a more general approach to this. I'll take a look at what you > have done with jd to see what I can see (expect more questions :-) ) > > I would be interested in participating in a lab workshop at the conference. > > Cheers, bob > > On May 27, 2014, at 7:14 AM, Eric Iverson <[email protected]> wrote: > >> The labs were great in their time. Rather than recreate that wheel it >> might be worthwhile to step back and look at the issues in current >> light. >> >> I think the labs structure is too restricted. I strongly favor the JHS >> spx approach that lets you treat any script (or any text file) as a >> lab. I think this is a compelling argument. Right now the spx facility >> is very simple but could be easily improved. Effort here might be >> better than on the old lab aurthor system. >> >> The other part of the solution (that would fit hand in glove with >> enhanced spx) is to take advantage of the fact the scripts are loaded >> (and spx managed) with J code. This means it is easy to make the >> source script much richer. I think html with custom tags is the way to >> go to have a single script that can be used to load an applicaton, run >> an spx lab, and to have a literate programming display. Lots of hand >> waving here, but a script that started with an <html> tag could be >> handled specially by various programs. Load would strip out all lines >> not in <code-load) tags. spx could have special treatment of other >> tags. Publish could do similar processing. And just showing the script >> in a browser would be useful. >> >> Lots of handwaving above, but I think this is the way to go. One nice >> thing is that it could be done in small steps with immediate benefits. >> For example the step to have load just handle the lines in <code-load> >> tags and to just treat the script as html for display would provide >> quite a few features. In fact, it might be best to just have html >> scripts that can be handled by load and spx. Maybe foo.ijs.html >> scripts. >> >> Note that spx is not specific to JHS. It works reasonably well in Jqt >> or Jconsole and could the rough edges in those environments can easily >> be fixed with a bit of J programming. The new release of Jd uses spx >> and works in all front ends. >> >> Potential lab authors are far better off to learn some html than a J >> specific lab authoring facility. >> >> Any interest in making the general issue of labs/literate >> programming/publishing the topic of a workshop at the conference in >> July? >> >> >> On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 10:23 PM, robert therriault >> <[email protected]> wrote: >>> Well, I am looking at it and I will keep everyone posted if I make any >>> progress, but I really won't feel bad if someone else wanted to take it on >>> (or even better join in). >>> >>> I am starting with the JHS system using Safari as my browser. Even though >>> the lab .ijt files are text files which any version of J would read, some >>> of the instructions to initiate events such as running video are dependent >>> on the J environment being used, so that generalization across the >>> different environments may be end up being a challenge. >>> >>> The first challenge is to get people to think that it is not a bad idea. :-) >>> >>> Cheers, bob >>> >>> On May 26, 2014, at 7:05 PM, Raul Miller <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Does that mean you are volunteering to do the update? >>>> >>>> ;) >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Raul >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 8:56 PM, robert therriault >>>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hey Raul, >>>>> >>>>> Developing a tool that can be used to create labs as they are imagined now >>>>> is mostly an update from the previous lab author, so most of the heavy >>>>> lifting has been done. The next level is to come up with what labs might >>>>> become; incorporating a number of communications methods that html5 makes >>>>> available with an interface that reduces the overhead to lab creation. I >>>>> would like to say it is the interface design that I find most difficult, >>>>> but really the biggest challenge is personal time management. :-) >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, bob >>>>> >>>>> On May 26, 2014, at 5:21 PM, Raul Miller <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Keep in mind that my "don't like video" is limited - I *would* like it >>>>>> under a variety of circumstances and I would not hesitate to recommend it >>>>>> for some purposes. >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm not trying to say it's bad or anything. But I guess I do avoid it in >>>>>> some contexts. >>>>>> >>>>>> Meanwhile, it can't be that hard to document the data format for labs. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Raul >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 4:36 PM, robert therriault < >>>>> [email protected]>wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hey Raul, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 1) One of the advantages of scripted video is that there is a written >>>>>>> artefact that could be included for search purposes. Similar to the way >>>>>>> that SVG includes its text as searchable content as opposed to bitmaps >>>>> of >>>>>>> words on canvas. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 2) This is a little trickier because it implicitly dives through the >>>>>>> levels that we interact with video. The pixelmator video example was one >>>>>>> that I was looking at as a viewer (because it is pretty) and as a >>>>> content >>>>>>> creator (by the way it conveyed information so efficiently). The level >>>>> you >>>>>>> are talking about is the level of the tool to create such a video or >>>>> image. >>>>>>> The reason that J doesn't have such a tool is probably because this >>>>> level >>>>>>> of UI is really difficult to get right and even when you do, the users >>>>> may >>>>>>> turn on you, such as when Apple introduced the new version of Final Cut >>>>>>> Pro. Also, there may not be reasons for J to manipulate video in this >>>>> way >>>>>>> when there are other tools already available, but you already referred >>>>> to >>>>>>> this when you talked of bringing other tools such as Blender. >>>>> Currently, I >>>>>>> am taking a hard look at the labs feature in J to provide this type of >>>>>>> glue. Amazingly, we lack a creation tool for labs in the newer versions >>>>> of >>>>>>> J and if there were a tool that would be >>>>>>> worth building, I think that would be it. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 3) In signing off (and even though you don't like video) I just opened a >>>>>>> link to this orientation/welcoming tutorial produced by >>>>> processing.orgthat also has content that involves the visual aspects and >>>>> power of >>>>>>> computer programming. Might be worth a look. >>>>> http://hello.processing.org/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, bob >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On May 26, 2014, at 10:46 AM, Raul Miller <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I guess I have two thoughts looking at that: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> (1) I personally prefer reading over video. Video is really hard to >>>>> find >>>>>>>> using search, and it's slow to watch. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> (2) Why don't I know how to generate a UI like that, using J? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Of course anything worth doing takes time, and I have to allow for >>>>> that. >>>>>>>> But video is particularly frustrating for me, also because I don't know >>>>>>> how >>>>>>>> to manipulate the raw underlying data in J. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Raul >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 1:23 PM, robert therriault < >>>>>>> [email protected]>wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks Raul, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Another (albeit market driven) approach is the short video tutorial to >>>>>>>>> describe use of a specific tooll. These short tutorials for the use of >>>>>>>>> pixelmator software are good because they have actually provided very >>>>>>>>> precise instruction on use of a tool in about a minute. The amount of >>>>>>> time >>>>>>>>> required to create these tutorials is even more than writing, as it >>>>>>>>> includes video production, but the result is a just in time tutorial >>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>> does not feel too pedantic. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://www.pixelmator.com/tutorials/featured/transform-tool/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Cheers, bob >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On May 26, 2014, at 10:06 AM, Raul Miller <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Writing decent tutorial documentation can be hard. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> So here's an example of how one guy who has written a fair amount of >>>>>>>>>> documentation has approached things: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> http://www.xess.com/static/media/appnotes/FpgasNowWhatBook.pdf >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Personally, I'm not all that fond of pdf - I personally prefer >>>>> working >>>>>>>>> more >>>>>>>>>> directly with the underlying medium. But everybody has to make their >>>>>>> own >>>>>>>>>> choices. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Raul >>>>>>>>>> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> For information about J forums see >>>>> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> For information about J forums see >>>>> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>>>> >>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
