You sounded like an "engineer want a be" and don't have an engineering
degree! What you say is true, engineering degree is just a piece of paper
with out experience, but it is a good start a very good start for someone
without experience. It takes hard work and dedication to get an engineer not
just a few weeks of reading a book from Cisco Press. Don't get me wrong, to
get to the CCIE level also takes a great deal of hard work and dedication
too, but it is minimal compare to getting an engineer degree.
Just my 2 cents,
mark,
-----Original Message-----
From: Baker, Jason [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2001 4:49 PM
To: Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: To CCIE's without a job [7:12805]
A true engineer is a person who knows what to do, and complete it
successfully.
not someone who can tell people they need to complete this or that. I have
seen plenty of so called engineers design software that is utter $%^^% and
too slow
and when given the project to a so called " plain coder" he has completed
the project
come out with software that is quick, efficient and how the software should
have been
designed in the first place.
It adds fuel to the fire......... what is valued more a piece of paper from
uni or a person
with real world experience ???
Why should someone who has a uni paper be called engineer and not someone
who has real world experience
and knows true engineering ?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, 20 July 2001 9:45 am
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: To CCIE's without a job [7:12805]
>
> My definition of Software Engineer is someone with an engineering degree
> and
> also does software engineering. A Developer/Coder just write code base on
> the engineering requirements and doesn't require a degree.
>
> my two cents,
>
> mark,
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Howard C. Berkowitz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2001 1:17 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: To CCIE's without a job [7:12805]
>
>
> >That's a scary thought: CCIEs who develop protocols. ;-]
>
> I know very few respected protocol or platform designers that ever
> mentioned having a CCIE. On the other hand, it only occasionally
> comes up that one has a PhD, which isn't always in a relevant
> discipline. I'm amused by the degree requirement--I could see an
> argument for a master's or doctorate, but the undergraduate computer
> science program gets into relatively little you need to know to
> design and implement protocols, other than as a coder.
>
> Personally, I'm a much better developer than I am a support person.
> There's overlap between the skills of product/protocol design and
> large network design, but much less with troubleshooting.
>
> Even quality testing is a somewhat different skill set than
> troubleshooting. For example, has anyone seen a Cisco exam that
> explored the differences among conformance, interoperability, and
> performance testing? The difference between a correct but boundary
> condition event, a syntactically incorrect event, and an inopportune
> event?
>
> >
> >They are looking for software engineers. They aren't going to find many
> >that have a CCIE? It's a different skill set and requires a different
> type
> >of personality.
> >
> >Priscilla
> >
> >At 09:41 AM 7/18/01, Ole Drews Jensen wrote:
> >>Forgive me for sending this here, I know there's a place for job
> >>discussions, but I noticed that there have been several e-mails about
> how
> >>CCIE's now have a harder time getting jobs.
> >>
> >>I received this e-mail (look at the message included after my signature)
> on
> >>another Cisco list I'm a member of:
> >>
> >>Hth,
> >>
> >>Ole
> >>
> >>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >> Ole Drews Jensen
> >> Systems Network Manager
> >> CCNA, MCSE, MCP+I
> >> RWR Enterprises, Inc.
> >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >> http://www.OleDrews.com/CCNP
> >>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >> NEED A JOB ???
> >> http://www.oledrews.com/job
> >>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >>
> >>Message: 1
> >>Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 15:11:26 -0000
> >>From: "JDO" >
> >>Subject: Looking for a Special Kind of CCIE
> >>
> >>Hello,
> >>
> >>My name is Johnna Smith and I work for a placement firm in Dallas,
> >>Texas. I am in desperate need of a CCIE that DEVELOPS routing
> >>protocols. I need them to have BGP, DSPF, IS-IS, and MPLS. The must
> >>be a software engineer and they must be degreed.
> >>
> >>If any of you could help me, please give me a call or shoot me an
> >>email at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or at
> >>972-991-7569.
> >>
> >>Just to take a look at someof our other positions please go to
> >>
> >>
> >>We also work with another agency that focuese more on IT, you can
> >>find their site at
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >>
> > >Johnna
Message Posted at:
http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7&i=13366&t=12805
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