Hi Sage, Thanks for this.
When I thought of why to provide laptops for interns, I thought of the challenges of compiling a large code base. I thought of a possible solution, which is using virtual machines (managed by the mentor organization) to do the heavy lifting. Obviously, this would mean that the intern would need a laptop and internet access but would not need a fully up-to-date laptop. I'm not quibbling, just looking for more insight. Thanks, Craig > On Jun 30, 2019, at 7:04 AM, Sage Sharp <[email protected]> wrote: > > The short answer is yes, the ASF could provide laptops to selected interns. > > I'm setting the boundary that this thread *NOT* devolve into a discussion > of where the funds for those laptops come from. Please create a *separate > thread* for discussions about that. Let's keep this thread on the topic of > what sending laptops would look like, what incentive that provides, and the > known pitfalls. > > Mozilla already provides laptops to selected interns. It's the only > Outreachy community to do so. Mozilla provides laptops because compiling > the massive Firefox code base is very slow and/or impossible on older > laptops. I'm not sure how they work around that issue in the application > phase, but I can ask the Mozilla coordinators. > > Word about how the Mozilla interns get a laptop seemed to spread quickly to > applicants from Indian universities (Outreachy's largest demographic). > Applicants are very excited about the possibility of getting a laptop, so > much that they often search for Mozilla projects to apply to first. Mozilla > also has several other things that make them one of the more popular > communities for applicants, including a welcoming community, mostly web > development projects, and accepting a large number of interns. > > There are some issues on Mozilla's side with sending a laptop. They often > get held up in customs. One intern from India did not get the laptop until > the internship was over. > > That means Mozilla wants to lock down their intern selections as early as > possible in order to get their interns' address for laptop shipping. They > have to bend Outreachy's rule about not talking about intern selections > until the intern announcement date. They send interns an email asking for > their address to send "some Mozilla swag". I say it's bending the rule > because some applicants may guess asking for their address means they were > selected as an intern. > > Giving the laptop to an intern directly is a way to avoid long customs > delays. If all the interns attend an ASF event during their first weeks, a > laptop could be given to them there. It also has the added benefit of > immediately connecting interns to the community. > > The only problem with in-person events is getting a visa in time. That's > impossible enough for Indian interns that Mozilla has simply stopped > inviting them to events on a short notice. > > I've thought some about what it would take for Outreachy to provide laptops > for all 40+ interns. Sadly I think that budget number is out of our reach. > If it was possible, we could try to work with a laptop supplier that ships > directly within India. Or give interns enough of a stipend to buy one > themselves. > > A laptop itself may not solve all the barriers interns face. Some Indian > schools impose an evening curfew for all women students, in order to > protect them from gendered street violence. However, that means they have > less hours in the computer lab than the male students. Some of the women's > dorms do not have wireless internet. Interns from both India and Africa > often face power or internet outages. Outreachy mentors are expected to be > lienent when that happens. > > That's a brain dump of what I know about sending laptops to Outreachy > interns. Let me know what questions you have! > > Sage Sharp > Outreachy Organizers > > > On Sat, Jun 29, 2019, 7:47 AM Alex Harui <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Can I get a summary of all of these Outreachy threads? I'm not on >> private@diversity and I think I've read every email on this list, but I'm >> seeing numbers like $10.5K being discussed and I have no clue where that >> number came from. I'm on fundraising@ as well and still don't recall any >> source for those numbers. Also, I thought that there was more than one >> entity that was willing to donate directly to Outreachy and there was only >> one or two ASF sponsors who were unable to redirect their money directly to >> Outreachy, so I don't understand why we are still having these long >> discussions. >> >> I thought that if some entity was to donate money directly to Outreachy >> that there were no objections from anybody even if it benefited one or a >> few ASF projects and not others. I would hope that would be the >> recommended workflow. >> >> If it turns out there are some entities that are ok with the money they >> donated to the ASF going to Outreachy but for some reason can't directly >> donate to Outreachy, I would hope that we would make it clear that this >> workflow is not our recommended workflow but we would redirect some of >> their money to Outreachy and either let Outreachy pick which ASF project >> gets an intern, or can we document somewhere that this money was donated >> "on behalf of Entity X". >> >> And then, IMO, the ASF is not paying for code. Can we all agree to that >> and get going on Outreachy? >> >> It was interesting to see it pointed out that there is a financial barrier >> to entry at the ASF. It would be nice if the ASF could find a way to help >> lower that barrier without "paying for code", but maybe we should put that >> in its own thread and spend more time brainstorming on that while we get >> going on Outreachy. IMO, the ASF has other barriers as well. Every ASF >> project I've looked at is huge compared to many of the projects I've seen >> on Github, so the learning curve may be tilted against inexperienced >> programmers and they may need a more expensive computer to build the source >> without it affecting the interns productivity. But even then, the >> entities donating directly to Outreachy could fund that more expensive >> computer. The ASF should not feel obligated to take on smaller projects >> just to make Outreachy interns more successful. Contributing code to the >> ASF is more like becoming a commercial truck driver, contributing to GitHub >> is more like becoming a ride-share driver. >> >> One thought on the financial barrier before I forget: the ASF offers VMs >> to projects. Could they offer laptops as well? >> >> Thanks, >> -Alex >> >> >> >> Craig L Russell [email protected]
