Agreed, the whole purpose of a wiki is to provide and organize information. If we are going to worry about comments and "history" then we are using the wrong tool for that. History is the last thing I would care about, instead we should focus on having clean updated information.
On Aug 18, 2016 7:29 AM, "Scott Gray" <[email protected]> wrote: > Easy solution (if possible) would be to disable comments altogether. If > there's a discussion to be had about a page it can go to the dev list or > JIRA without risk of being deleted or creating any conspiracy theories > about censorship. > > Being able to comment directly on a page is handy, but if we're going to go > overboard worrying about comments being deleted/censored then it's better > to just do away with them. > > Regards > Scott > > On 18/08/2016 06:27, "Pierre Smits" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > You're correct. Not many deletions were done by non privileged > > contributors, and as far as I can tell no non-privileged contributor ever > > deleted the comment of another contributor. > > > > Mostly they were done by privileged contributors on non open pages (in > the > > OFBIZADMIN space, meaning PMC Members). While there is version management > > on content, there is no version managment on comments. > > > > With every deletion of a comment (done by anybody else) made by a PMC > > Member a piece of history is gone for ever. And it could be regarded as > > censorship. > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > Pierre Smits > > > > ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com> > > OFBiz based solutions & services > > > > OFBiz Extensions Marketplace > > http://oem.ofbizci.net/oci-2/ > > > > On Wed, Aug 17, 2016 at 4:06 PM, Jacques Le Roux < > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Jacopo, > > > > > > Thanks for the new thread creation. I wanted to relate the previous > > thread > > > with my suggestion because of, IMO, the needed merge between the 2 > > > "marketing pages". > > > > > > Good idea about keeping the old spaces as archives w/o entering links. > > > > > > With my suggestion I trust no Wiki space for the PMC should be needed, > we > > > just need to agree on removing delete permissions for contributors. > > > > > > If a contributor spot a page, a comment or an attachment to be deleted > > > then just by asking for it in a comment should be enough. > > > > > > So far I have not seen much deletion from contributors so it should not > > be > > > an issue. > > > > > > Jacques > > > > > > > > > > > > Le 17/08/2016 à 15:17, Jacopo Cappellato a écrit : > > > > > >> I am starting a new thread with a new subject in the dev list to > discuss > > >> the interesting topic about Wiki space cleanup/refactoring that was > > >> started > > >> by Jacques as an off topic (going off-topic is a bad habit that we > > should > > >> try to limit). > > >> > > >> In my opinion we could just have one Wiki space (open to contributors) > > and > > >> we could consolidate there all the content that is valuable. We could > > keep > > >> the existing spaces as an archive (removing all prominent links to > them) > > >> until the new Wiki is completed. > > >> > > >> As regards the separate Wiki space for the PMC, I would wait before > > >> creating it at least until there is a clear evidence that such space > is > > >> really required. > > >> > > >> Jacopo > > >> > > >> > > >> On Wed, Aug 17, 2016 at 12:51 PM, Jacques Le Roux < > > >> [email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > >> Sharan, > > >>> > > >>> Sorry to seem again out of subject, but you will see where I'm going > > to. > > >>> > > >>> The question we should ask ourselves, is when content/attachments in > a > > >>> page should be only accessible to the PMC. > > >>> > > >>> For content we have not problems. Only contributors are able to > modify > > >>> pages contents. Anyway this is not a problem because we (I at least) > > >>> monitor all changes in the wiki and if I see a change which should > not > > >>> happen we (I) can still restore a correct version from history. As an > > >>> admin > > >>> I can even restore a deleted page from the space trash. To be safe, > > >>> admins > > >>> should always agree about deleting a page from the space trash, for > > >>> instance to vacuum when necessary. I noticed both these actions are > > >>> extremely rare. > > >>> > > >>> So far contributors are also able to add and delete news, comments > and > > >>> attachments. We don't use news in the wiki, one issue less. Because > > it's > > >>> hard to retrieve comments and attachments, even as an admin (we need > to > > >>> ask > > >>> infra to look into an ASF wide backup), I suggest we remove the > > >>> possibility > > >>> for contributors to delete news, comments and attachments. Then we > are > > >>> safe from all changes and we no longer need a distinction between > open > > >>> and > > >>> closed wiki :) If nobody disagree I'd do that in few days. > > >>> > > >>> BTW while at it I noticed Amit Gadaley had no rights, I gave him the > > >>> needed. > > >>> > > >>> Jacques > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Le 17/08/2016 à 09:25, Sharan Foga a écrit : > > >>> > > >>> Hi Jacques > > >>>> > > >>>> This is an interesting idea and it might have been good to start a > new > > >>>> thread as it has digressed a little off topic again :-) > > >>>> > > >>>> In theory I agree that we do need to do some tidy up and > consolidating > > >>>> into 2 spaces sounds like it could work well. We just need to see > how > > to > > >>>> merge the data from the existing spaces and also add a good > navigation > > >>>> system so that people can find things easily. > > >>>> > > >>>> Back to original topic – I don't think that we can consolidate all > > the > > >>>> marketing information into a restricted space mainly because I think > > we > > >>>> will need to allow for the ability for any contributor to add new > > papers > > >>>> and presentations. As a first step though – we could remove the > > wiki > > >>>> page and move the data to the project admin space for now and see > how > > >>>> that > > >>>> works. > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> Thanks > > >>>> Sharan > > >>>> > > >>>> On 2016-08-17 07:41 (+0200), Jacques Le Roux < > > >>>> [email protected]> wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>> Hi Sharan, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I thought about that, and I believe we should not add a new page > but > > >>>>> rather complete the Material+for+Branding+and+Marketing page by > > using > > >>>>> what's > > >>>>> interesting in the General+Material+for+Branding+and+Marketing > page > > >>>>> and > > >>>>> then drop it. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> To answer Taher's message, I believe we face a mess and this > > remembers > > >>>>> me http://www.howtomakesenseofanymess.com/ Sharan suggested, I > > stopped > > >>>>> at > > >>>>> http://www.howtomakesenseofanymess.com/chapter/1/page/21/ > > >>>>> draw-your-mess/ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I think the right attitude when facing a mess, is to CUT in it. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> * We need to drop, or at least put a lot of wiki pages in > > archives. > > >>>>> * For that we could create a specific OFBiz archive space, not > > >>>>> linked > > >>>>> from the other spaces. > > >>>>> * I also suggest to have only 2 other spaces, one completely > > open, > > >>>>> where most pages should be. > > >>>>> * And one only accessible to PMC (and committers?) where really > > >>>>> sensible information should be, these last pages should be very > rare > > >>>>> and > > >>>>> only when > > >>>>> really needed. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Then we can improve the content of "Documentation" menu-link from > > >>>>> http://ofbiz.apache.org/ . Notably > > >>>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBADMIN/OFBiz+ > > >>>>> Documentation+Index (hint: this is also kinda an answer to Taher) > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Trying to improve navigation before cutting in the mess, will have > a > > >>>>> tendency to fail... What do you think? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Jacques > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Le 16/08/2016 14:58, Jacques Le Roux a crit : > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Hi Sharan, > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> I suggested at https://cwiki.apache.org/confl > > >>>>>> uence/display/OFBADMIN/Material+for+Branding+and+Marketing? > > >>>>>> focusedCommentId=65865874#comment-65865874 > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> to remove the page below because I tried yesterday to move the > > images > > >>>>>> from the page above to the one below. I wanted to merge the 2 > > pages, a > > >>>>>> reason > > >>>>>> I afterwards renamed the page above. Another reason I afterwards > > >>>>>> renamed the page is because when in Confluence you put special > > >>>>>> characters, > > >>>>>> like > > >>>>>> parenthesis, etc., in the title then you don't get a nice title > for > > >>>>>> the > > >>>>>> page, but a number :/ > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> But it's hard to *move* attachments in bulk in Confluence. You > have > > to > > >>>>>> do it one by one :/ > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> So I tried to download them all and upload them back to the page > > >>>>>> below. > > >>>>>> But the process failed in the middle. You might also notice that > > it's > > >>>>>> hard > > >>>>>> to *remove* attachments in bulk in Confluence. You have to do it > one > > >>>>>> by > > >>>>>> one :/ > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> That's why I suggested to put this page in archive (actually > > deleting > > >>>>>> it lets it in the space's trash > > >>>>>> https://confluence.atlassian.com/doc/delete-or-restore-a-pag > > >>>>>> e-139429.html) and to create a new one. I also tried to watch the > > >>>>>> Powerpoint there (on > > >>>>>> WIndows using the the Powerpoint viewer!) but it failed, so there > is > > >>>>>> nothing to keep there! I suggest to drop it and create a brand new > > >>>>>> page, > > >>>>>> inspired by the page below, for the ideas you rightly suggested. > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Thanks > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Jacques > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Le 16/08/2016 11:03, Sharan Foga a crit : > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> Hi Everyone > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> We currently have a page in the wiki that was used initially for > > >>>>>>> branding and marketing but has now has a lot of broken links. > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OFBIZ/General+ > > >>>>>>> Material+for+Branding+and+Marketing > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> The logo files don't need to be on this page as they are all > > >>>>>>> available > > >>>>>>> elsewhere. Rather than remove it I suggest that it could be > tidied > > >>>>>>> up and > > >>>>>>> that the page focus (and name) could be changed to make it into > one > > >>>>>>> that links to OFBiz white papers, OFBIz presentations, etc. > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> I'm not sure if we already have something like this or if it > > covered > > >>>>>>> as part of OFBiz in the news but I think having this type of > > material > > >>>>>>> available could be good for newcomers. What do people think? > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> Thanks > > >>>>>>> Sharan > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >
