Hi all, having listened carefully to all the voices from the community so far, I have come down to the following conclusion.
There are many professionals among us that have been working in the shadows supporting this project in diverse ways - evangelizing, advocating, integrating, etc. without the 'shoulders' of a bold-named company like Google or IBM (who has been the active maintainer of this project for a number of years now). My gut feeling so far has told me that - as has already happened with many other technologies - these companies usually invest an amount of time and money for experimenting with different types of technologies and if things don't go as planned in the long run, what seems to be happening is that some other company takes over on the experiment and so on, until no big name is really interested any more. During this lifecycle, many other companies are starting to adopt the technologies and they are indeed putting them into good use to serve their purposes. And this is exactly where we stand at the moment. I can totally understand the feelings coming from Ichiro and Darren and at the same time I get Ryan's point of view. So how do we handle this situation? Speaking for myself, as I come from Greece and I have to live and work in a country that is in crisis mode for quite a few years now, all I can say is that a crisis can be the mother of invention and change for a better tomorrow. And this is exactly how I see this situation - in a metaphorical way of course :) I think that now is the right time to make a change. Things have changed in our industry during the last 10 years and so have trends and communities. Maybe 10 years ago, the Apache Foundation was the place to be but now this is definitely not the case - of course this doesn't mean that the foundation is not the birthplace of great technologies. But all the action now is over at GitHub. So, since Ryan gave us the green light (from the foundation's perspective) that the project can be migrated, I'm outlining my proposals: - We break down the Shindig project into a number of distinct parts - personally I've never used the OpenSocial features and have no interest in them since I'm heavily focused on the gadget containment and rendering facilities. But there are people like Rene who have invested a lot of time and work on extending the OpenSocial features. - We give it a brand new name - never liked the name Shindig in the first place (speaking for myself once more). I think that this is very important since we want to make a bold statement to communities that this technology is active, we're using it and others should try it out because it may solve them a number of problems. - Create a modern web site on GitHub where we can all share our experiences through show cases, usage examples and tutorials - We start thinking around the concept of a gadget-centered marketplace - in the context of show casing stuff. If I remember correctly Darren's team has already launched a project which is very similar to the iGoogle web site so he could certainly provide some ideas. - Issues and feature requests can be handled directly though GitHub in a more agile and community oriented approach without any of the bureaucratic processes imposed by the Apache Foundation. Once the 'monolith' is broken down into different projects then it would be more manageable and people having certain skills could join forces - By utilizing technologies like Docker there is no need for hosting resources and sample material - we can bundle our examples, show cases, etc in self-sufficient Docker images and host them over @ DockerHub. The integration with GitHub is seamless so this is a no brainer - Reach out to Atlassian, Jive and the rest of the companies who we know for sure that they have invested a lot in this technology (and actively use it) to help with this effort - e.g. Atlassian has extended Shindig container & engine to meet their requirements and they definitely have devs who know the bits and pieces So the question now for me is really simple. How many of us want to move over to the next phase without getting into any sort of credibility issues regarding our choices? +1 from me. Kind regards, Chris On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 2:49 AM, Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@apache.org> wrote: > I completely understand. I can't speak to the continued support of vendors > who have adopted Shindig, but I would imagine that they can't just stop > supporting the products consuming Shindig. I am sorry that this puts you > in a tough position but this is a natural cycle of open source software. > With no community willing to support and enhance the project there is not > much we can do. If someone takes the code and the project regains life > somewhere else, that is great. > > On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 6:22 PM Ichiro Furusato <ichiro.furus...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Hi Ryan, > > > > While the code is stable and available I can't go to our CIO and > architects > > and > > advocate use of a project as the basis for our online delivery if the > > project has > > folded. We were planning to replace literally five separate legacy > portals > > (that > > have been accumulating like mold rather than serve as replacements) using > > Liferay, with our online widgets being replaced by Open Social Gadgets. > > With > > the demise of Shindig I assume Liferay's support of embedded Shindig will > > likely disappear, and therefore my ability to advocate for its use. > > > > It's not the availability of the code, it's the living status of the > > project. If the > > project is dead I can't very well suggest we base millions of dollars of > > online > > delivery over the next 5-10 years on it. As I am responsible for that > > decision > > I could hardly be said to be responsible in advocating for its use at > this > > stage. > > > > Sadly. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Ichiro > > > > On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 3:01 AM, Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Ichiro, while the project will move to the attic, it doesn't mean you > > can't > > > continue to use it. If it is stable enough as it is right now for you > > than > > > you should be able to continue to use it as is. > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 5:59 AM Ichiro Furusato < > > ichiro.furus...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > To add just one more voice to the chorus, I'm likewise very sad to > hear > > > of > > > > the demise of what > > > > seemed (until this notice) to be a functional and mature project. For > > the > > > > past nine months I have > > > > advocated replacing the four (!) existing (legacy) aviation and > > industry > > > > delivery platforms of the > > > > Meteorological Service of New Zealand (MetService) with a > > Liferay/Shindig > > > > based site. Over the > > > > past year we prototyped a replacement service and are currently > > awaiting > > > > the next project > > > > funding cycle. Having to go back to our executive management team and > > > tell > > > > them that the > > > > basic architecture of our proposed service is somewhat embarrassing, > > and > > > we > > > > will likewise now > > > > need to reevaluate and design a new solution. As the lead designer I > > have > > > > been quite happy > > > > with the Shindig/Open Social Gadget technology, and we had looked > > forward > > > > to a robust > > > > implementation cycle, replacing fifteen years of crufty service with > a > > > > shiny new Gadget-based > > > > solution. > > > > > > > > Sincere thanks to the development team for an excellent job, very > sorry > > > to > > > > hear about it being > > > > put into the Attic. There may have been inactivity in the dev side at > > > > Apache but we were actively > > > > using, and planning to use it for a substantial part of our online > > > weather > > > > delivery solution. > > > > > > > > Ichiro > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 7:31 AM, Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@apache.org> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi fellow Shindig Devs, > > > > > > > > > > I would like to let you all know that the Shindig PMC has voted to > > > > > terminate the Shindig project and move it to the attic. I have > > already > > > > > informed the Apache board about the termination in this months > board > > > > report > > > > > (below). > > > > > > > > > > As most of you have probably noticed we have seen a decline in > > > > > participation in all aspects of the project over the past months > and > > > the > > > > > downward trend has been happening for over a year now. This can > > > > certainly > > > > > be seen in our reports to the board [1]. > > > > > > > > > > If anyone has any questions please let me know, and I will be sure > to > > > > keep > > > > > everyone up to date as we transition the project to the attic. > > Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > -Ryan > > > > > > > > > > [1] > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/SHINDIG/Board+Reports > > > > > > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message --------- > > > > > From: Ryan Baxter <rbaxte...@apache.org> > > > > > Date: Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 9:29 PM > > > > > Subject: Terminate the Apache Shindig Project > > > > > To: bo...@apache.org <bo...@apache.org> > > > > > Cc: priv...@shindig.apache.org <priv...@shindig.apache.org> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > WHEREAS, the Project Management Committee of the Apache > DirectMemory > > > > > project has chosen by vote to recommend moving the project to the > > > > > Attic; and > > > > > > > > > > WHEREAS, the Board of Directors deems it no longer in the best > > > > > interest of the Foundation to continue the Apache Shindig project > > > > > due to inactivity; > > > > > > > > > > NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Apache Shindig > > > > > project is hereby terminated; and be it further > > > > > > > > > > RESOLVED, that the Attic PMC be and hereby is tasked with > > > > > oversight over the software developed by the Apache Shindig > > > > > Project; and be it further > > > > > > > > > > RESOLVED, that the office of "Vice President, Apache Shindig" is > > > > > hereby terminated; and be it further > > > > > > > > > > RESOLVED, that the Apache Shindig PMC is hereby terminated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Chris Spiliotopoulos Solutions Architect | @LinkedIn <https://www.linkedin.com/pub/chris-spiliotopoulos>| @Twitter <https://twitter.com/chefArchitect>
