Hi Patrick, Thanks for clarifying I think I get it now. So the issues is users having to migrate now to [email protected] and later to [email protected]? Thats less of a worry in my opinion. Because once the project graduates, the incubator list auto redirect to TLP list. Users will slowly change it themselves. I agree migrating from google groups to ASF list will be a big one.
I think we should have lots of lessons learned from Open Office dealing with magnitude more number of users. Suresh On Jun 28, 2013, at 5:20 PM, Patrick Wendell <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Suresh, > > The request here is actually to *not* use the Apache user list while in the > incubator. The issue is that we don't want to ask almost 1000 people to > migrate twice between two different lists in a short period of time. That > seems like the most confusion of all options. > > If there is a requirement that eventually we get all lists over to apache, > then so be it. But having a double migration is something I'd personally > strongly object to and I feel that others in the community would also > object to this. > > Let's just defer the migration of the users list until we graduate to a TLP > - this is a completely sensible option and will be easy to explain to the > broader user community. > > - Patrick > > > On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 2:12 PM, Suresh Marru <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi Andy, >> >> Its strongly advisable to have all the lists on ASF infrastructure. The >> only reason the incubators are not encouraged against users list is to keep >> the community together. But if spark already had a user base and the >> projects wants to have a user list, you should go for it. That will be way >> less confusing. >> >> If there are no objections, I can request a user list. >> >> Suresh >> On Jun 28, 2013, at 5:04 PM, Andy Konwinski <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> + [email protected] to loop in those who haven't >> subscribed >>> to [email protected] yet, (also because my emails are getting bounced by >>> Apache's spam filters). >>> >>> I wanted to respond here in the conversation about the mailing list >>> migration that was happening on the email thread called "Re: A wiki for >>> Spark (on Apache infra)"... >>> >>> Assuming that we Apache requires us to migrate from google groups to >> lists >>> on Apache infra, we might consider waiting to migrating the users list to >>> apache infra until after we graduate to a TLP, so that we only have to >>> migrate it once. >>> >>> Here's why. I assume with each list migration that requires subscribers >> to >>> do work, we will lose some subscribers. If we ask them to migrate to an >>> incubator user list now and then again to yet a different list when we >>> graduate to a TLP (which we hope to do fairly quickly), it seems like we >>> will irritate and lose strictly more subscribers. >>> >>> This requirement to migrate infra twice as part of moving to Apache >> seems a >>> bit hard on communities. It also seems like a requirement that will go >> away >>> if the changes you are pushing for to the incubation process (i.e. >> podling >>> TLPs) actually ever happen. >>> >>> Anyway, I see our options as: >>> >>> 1. Migrate only the dev list now (since this is a smaller core group that >>> is more likely to migrate with us) and wait to create an apache users >> list >>> until we graduate and migrate from the users google group then. Con: it's >>> confusing to have user and dev lists on different infra. >>> 2. Move the users list now, in which case we go with the migration plan I >>> proposed earlier. Con: migrating users list twice = more irritating to >>> users. >>> >>> Andy >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Jun 28, 2013 at 12:20 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J) < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Andy, >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> >>>> From: Andy Konwinski <[email protected]> >>>> Reply-To: "[email protected]" < >> [email protected] >>>>> >>>> Date: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 10:18 AM >>>> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >>>> Subject: Re: Apache Spark podling: Created! >>>> >>>>> This is great. >>>>> >>>>> Quick question about mailing lists: Spark also has a >>>>> spark-users<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/spark-users> >>>>> google >>>>> group. Can we also get a [email protected] mailing list to have >> somewhere >>>>> to migrate that group? Do I need to create an infra issue for this? >>>> >>>> OK, cool yeah I think I requested commits and dev as lists earlier, but >>>> didn't request a user one. To request a new list, you go here: >>>> >>>> https://infra.apache.org/officers/mlreq/incubator >>>> >>>> >>>> Did you request a list yet? Should i? >>>> >>>> (BTW sorry about the delay in responding was at a DARPA meeting all >> week in >>>> DC an am just back in California now catching up on everything). >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Also, we should discuss a strategy, and timeline for migrating the >> mailing >>>>> lists over to the new ones. >>>>> >>>>> As far as a strategy, here are the steps I can think of that will help >>>>> make >>>>> for a smooth transition: >>>>> >>>>> 1. Request users list on apache infra (done) >>>>> 2. Pick a day/time for the switch (how about July 1, assuming >>>>> [email protected] is set up by then) >>>>> 3. At Switch time: >>>>> 1. Make announcements on the dev and users mailing lists with links >>>>> to the new lists, instructions on how to subscribe, and a note >>>>> saying all >>>>> conversations are moving over to that list. >>>>> 2. Update the website with links to the new lists >>>>> 3. Enable an auto responders on those lists with pointers to the >> new >>>>> apache lists >>>> >>>> Perfect! That's correct Andy. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Chris >>>> >>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. >>>> Senior Computer Scientist >>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA >>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246 >>>> Email: [email protected] >>>> WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ >>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department >>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA >>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 5:03 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J) < >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> CC'ing [email protected]: our first email to the dev list! :) >>>>>> >>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. >>>>>> Senior Computer Scientist >>>>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA >>>>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246 >>>>>> Email: [email protected] >>>>>> WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ >>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department >>>>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA >>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: Henry Saputra <[email protected]> >>>>>> Date: Friday, June 21, 2013 4:51 PM >>>>>> To: jpluser <[email protected]> >>>>>> Cc: Matt Massie <[email protected]>, Reynold Xin >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Matei Zaharia <[email protected]>, Ankur Dave >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Tathagata Das <[email protected]>, >> Haoyuan >>>>>> Li >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Josh Rosen <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Shivaram Venkataraman <[email protected]>, Mosharaf >> Chowdhury >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Charles Reiss <[email protected] >>> , >>>>>> Andy Konwinski <[email protected]>, Patrick Wendell >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Imran Rashid <[email protected]>, >> Ryan >>>>>> LeCompte <[email protected]>, Ravi Pandya >>>>>> <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Ram Sriharsha <[email protected]>, Robert Evans >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Mridul Muralidharan <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Thomas >>>>>> Dudziak <[email protected]>, Mark Hamstra >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Stephen Haberman >>>>>> <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Jason Dai <[email protected]>, Shane Huang <[email protected] >>> , >>>>>> Andrew xia <[email protected]>, Nick Pentreath >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Sean McNamara < >> [email protected] >>>>> , >>>>>> "Ramirez, Paul M (398J)" <[email protected]>, Roman >>>> Shaposhnik >>>>>> <[email protected]>, Suresh Marru <[email protected]>, "Hart, Andrew F >>>>>> (398J)" <[email protected]> >>>>>> Subject: Re: Apache Spark podling: Created! >>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks for driving this forward Chris, awesome as usual! =) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The mailing lists are ready: >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can subscribe by sending email to: >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> [email protected] -> This is moderated >> and >>>>>>> only Sparks' committers, PPMC could subscribe to it. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hopefully we could start communicating using the dev@ list starting >>>>>> next >>>>>>> week. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> For those new to ASF, welcome! =) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Henry >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 1:41 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (398J) >>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Everyone, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just to double check: does everyone have an Apache Individual >>>>>>> Contributor License Agreement (ICLA) on file? If you don't please >>>>>>> head over to: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.apache.org/licenses/icla.txt >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Please fill that out and then submit to [email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'll make sure that everyone's account gets created and that >>>>>>> karma for the Git repo is set up based on that, working with >>>>>>> infra. I or any of the other mentors can help with this too. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> Chris >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. >>>>>>> Senior Computer Scientist >>>>>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA >>>>>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246 >>>>>>> Email: [email protected] >>>>>>> WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ >>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department >>>>>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA >>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: <Mattmann>, jpluser <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Date: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 10:16 PM >>>>>>> To: jpluser <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Cc: Matt Massie <[email protected]>, Reynold Xin >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Matei Zaharia <[email protected]>, Ankur Dave >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Tathagata Das <[email protected]>, >> Haoyuan >>>>>> Li >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Josh Rosen <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Reynold >>>>>>> Xin <[email protected]>, Shivaram Venkataraman >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Mosharaf Chowdhury >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Charles Reiss <[email protected] >>> , >>>>>>> Andy Konwinski <[email protected]>, Patrick Wendell >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Imran Rashid <[email protected]>, >>>> Ryan >>>>>>> LeCompte <[email protected]>, Ravi Pandya >>>>>> <[email protected] >>>>>>> , >>>>>>> Ram Sriharsha <[email protected]>, Robert Evans >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Mridul Muralidharan <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Thomas >>>>>>> Dudziak <[email protected]>, Mark Hamstra >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Stephen Haberman >>>>>> <[email protected]>, >>>>>>> Jason Dai <[email protected]>, Shane Huang < >> [email protected] >>>>> , >>>>>>> Andrew xia <[email protected]>, Nick Pentreath >>>>>>> <[email protected]>, Sean McNamara < >> [email protected] >>>>> >>>>>>> Subject: Apache Spark podling: Created! >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi Everyone, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Until our mailing lists are created, will have to just reply all >>>>>>>> to this list :) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Apache Spark (incubating) now is created! See: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://s.apache.org/yRh >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Yay! Thanks for the support in getting this started! I've gone >>>>>>>> ahead and filed the requisite INFRA tasks: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-6417 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> per: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.apache.org/dev/infra-contact#requesting-podling >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> You can follow the bootstrap process at INFRA-6417, by >>>>>>>> putting yourself on the watch list for the issue. Now >>>>>>>> I'll work with infra@ to get everything set up in terms of >>>>>>>> mailing lists, etc, and then I'd appreciate everyone helping >>>>>>>> in terms of letting folks know to migrate on the existing >>>>>>>> email lists, and helping to work with me to get Git version >>>>>>>> history transferred over, and to start moving the project >>>>>>>> into the ASF. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> One other thing, Matei: it would be really nice to do a >>>>>>>> software grant on this: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.apache.org/licenses/software-grant.txt >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> From maybe AMPLab (and anyone else). Can you help take >>>>>>>> the lead in getting that submitted to the Apache Secretary and >>>>>>>> CC me? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks guys! Progress :) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Our first Incubator PMC report is due in July. I'll prod and >>>>>>>> help put it together. Until then, time to start transitioning >>>>>>>> and helping to get the project moved on over. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>> Chris >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. >>>>>>>> Senior Computer Scientist >>>>>>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA >>>>>>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246 >>>>>>>> Email: [email protected] >>>>>>>> WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department >>>>>>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>
