Hi, As we are heavy ExtJS and DojoToolkit users we've encountered quite a much problems since both frameworks do have their own toolchain and it doesn't seem to fit to webpack or rollup or anything like that.
So if such a feature is planned for core I really hope that non mainstream tools are left out, at least without possibility to make them work easily. On Mon, Feb 11, 2019 at 12:50 AM Josh Smeaton <josh.smea...@gmail.com> wrote: > For the vast majority of users, right now, Vue or React are the only real > options. Let's not try predicting the future, and just focus on what the > trends currently are. Users going for newer targets are likely more > advanced, and can figure out the necessary changes. > > Aymerics articles are fantastic, and our team has gotten a lot of value > out of them for our newer projects. Especially the customisations to static > files which removes the re-hashing of static content. I would be very keen > for Django to provide a first class integration method with Webpack, in > particular, but most popular bundler frameworks if the necessary interfaces > exist. > > - "Importing" static content that has already been bundled and hashed > - Automatic reloading of static content as it is being changed > - Visual debugging in editors > > I think the idea of a how-to that considers authentication and > communication between frontend and backend is also what we need. > > So while I don't think Django needs to bless a particular frontend > framework, I think we have to provide a really nice integration story so > that the most popular JS frameworks do not have to jump through a lot of > hoops, including copy and pasting large sections of code, to get their > existing tooling working with Django. I no longer think it's enough to > require 3rd party django libraries to make the frontend integration > possible. > > On Sunday, 10 February 2019 04:50:54 UTC+11, Dmitriy Sintsov wrote: >> >> Very nice tuturials! Although there is web components standard gradually >> being adapted by major browsers, which should bring custom tags / >> components not having to use the third party Javascript libraries like Vue >> or React. So, while in Python world the leadership of Django is quite >> stable and obvious one, in Javascript world it's not so easy to say whether >> Vue and React would dominate in a long run. Maybe Marko or Stencil.js are >> closer to the future vision of Javascript. >> >> On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 8:32 PM Aymeric Augustin < >> aymeric....@polytechnique.org> wrote: >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I wrote a three-part essay on this question last year: >>> 1. >>> https://fractalideas.com/blog/making-react-and-django-play-well-together/ >>> 2. >>> https://fractalideas.com/blog/making-react-and-django-play-well-together-hybrid-app-model/ >>> 3. >>> https://fractalideas.com/blog/making-react-and-django-play-well-together-single-page-app-model/ >>> >>> Even though I took a narrower view — I only considered React — I found >>> enough decisions factors to write over 2000 words in the first post, which >>> is too long for a FAQ :-) >>> >>> On one hand, I'm not sure the Django docs should go into this level of >>> detail and provide specific information about a particular JS framework. On >>> the other hand, it's rather useless to talk about integrating Django with a >>> JS frontend without discussing authentication and it's hard to discuss >>> authentication in less than 2000 words — which were just for justifying my >>> favorite solution, not for investigating every option! >>> >>> I think we need a how-to guide rather than a FAQ entry. I would find it >>> nice: >>> >>> *A. To describe the Singe Page App model — where Django only serves the >>> API* >>> >>> We need to explain CORS and CSRF in the clearest terms possible. Many >>> devs end up shotgun-debugging CORS or CSRF errors, which always results in >>> insecure deployments. >>> >>> My consulting experience suggests that we have a problem there: I never >>> did an audit where the client got that right, even though they're all smart >>> people trying to get things right. >>> >>> Perhaps a condensed version of my third post could do the job? >>> >>> Some may disagree with my recommendation against JWT, which may too >>> opinionated for the Django docs. Again, in my experience, people tend to >>> get security more wrong with JWT, which is why I prefer discouraging it and >>> letting those who know what they're doing ignore my advice. >>> >>> *B. To say something about integrating a modern JS framework with >>> django.contrib.staticfiles * >>> >>> It's perfectly doable and provides all the benefits of >>> django.contrib.staticfiles. However, it requires a bit of duct tape, as >>> shown in my second post. >>> >>> I'm a huge fan of this technique for simple website but I'm afraid I'm >>> biased by my experience with Django. This is unlikely to be a popular >>> option for those who are more familiar with a modern frontend framework >>> than with django.contrib.staticfiles. >>> >>> The docs should at least give the general idea of "compile your frontend >>> to somewhere Django can find the files, then run collectstatic". >>> >>> If someone starts writing documentation about this, I'm interested in >>> reviewing it. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >>> -- >>> Aymeric. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 5 Feb 2019, at 11:17, Carlton Gibson <carlton...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> I think this topic is very interesting. >>> >>> Two sides of it: >>> >>> * Static files handling >>> * APIs >>> >>> Curtis is right, there are other options but, Django REST Framework is >>> (whilst not perfect) pretty solid on the API front. I think Django has a >>> good story here. >>> It's pretty hard not to find DRF if you follow any guide, or any >>> searching at all. >>> >>> The static files story is a little different. It seems to me we don't >>> tell the best story there. >>> >>> Rails has two things which we could be envious of, even if we didn't >>> want to copy exactly: >>> >>> * The frontend framework integration that's already been mentioned. >>> * The very easy "Ajax your form", with controllers (i.e. for us "generic >>> views") automatically handling ajax form submissions. >>> >>> Both these features get users further quicker in these aspects than we >>> are able to offer. >>> >>> We struggle to think of areas for improvements (re GSoC for example) but >>> maybe here is an area. >>> >>> This ties into Claude's proposal here: >>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/django-developers/KYmNnvwXDUI/discussion >>> >>> My own story is, I've had lots of success with, and still use, Django >>> Compressor. >>> >>> - At it's simplest you just map a content type to a shell command to >>> run and then include your Sass/Less/React/Elm/whatever files in your HTML >>> (with script or link tags, almost in the old-school way). >>> - In development these are processed (& cached) per request. >>> - For deployment you just run an offline compression task >>> (management command) and then upload the files. >>> - That's it. >>> >>> It's not a coverall approach — a frontend engineer will come along and >>> totally replace Compressor with whatever is this week's Top Javascript >>> Build System™ BUT it is a good 80:20: it lets me do something (that >>> approximates) respectable, without knowing hardly anything about the latest >>> frontend hotness. (GNU Make FTW! 🙂) >>> >>> I think if we were to offer something out-of-the-box that got as far as >>> Compressor, or further, we'd: >>> >>> - satisfy most of our users, >>> - allow yet more to get off the mark quickly, >>> - and... well... those that need the full frontend toolchain would >>> still be free to use it. >>> >>> I worry we'd never get anything like this into core... but I think it >>> would be good. (As I say, I think it's one area where we are lacking/behind >>> the competition.) >>> >>> Kind Regards, >>> >>> Carlton >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to django-develop...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to django-d...@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/django-developers. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/49deee81-0230-48a0-8c2a-b12eb0956810%40googlegroups.com >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/49deee81-0230-48a0-8c2a-b12eb0956810%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>> Google Groups "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/django-developers/KVAZkRCq9KU/unsubscribe >>> . >>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>> django-develop...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to django-d...@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/django-developers. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/CBFA85F9-3EE1-4B74-B121-F178F551D9CD%40polytechnique.org >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/CBFA85F9-3EE1-4B74-B121-F178F551D9CD%40polytechnique.org?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to django-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to django-developers@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/django-developers. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/b36c1ba6-0473-47d3-87e5-6b2c5c9ecbf9%40googlegroups.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/b36c1ba6-0473-47d3-87e5-6b2c5c9ecbf9%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Jani Tiainen - Well planned is half done, and a half done has been sufficient before... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django developers (Contributions to Django itself)" group. 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