Peace.
Well I have been reading all the responses. Yes teachers are also a problem but the fundamental problem is that the availability of qualified people to teach. It is unheard of to have fresh grads teaching students. Normally we don't even let fresh grads fix bugs without supervision. Lack of enough PHDs, no research and to top it all of a slow and incompetent administration that thinks that they are embarking the best education that can be provided. That marijuana joint must feel really good. puff puff.
Here is a simple story. Mr Stanford who was unable to get his son admitted to an Ivy league school decided to open up a university in his name which is now known as the Stanford University one of the most elite schools in the USA.
As far as I am concerned the hope for NED getting better are close to none. I am not willing to waste my time on sometihng that is unwilling or not receptive to new ideas or thinking out of the box. Heck I will work with any university that is willing to entertain ideas and willing to incorporate the recommendations.
I have some emotional baggage when it comes to NED as it is the one that I graduated from but that can count for so much and after that I would care less. I will work with other institutions in Pakistan and if not work with other institutions in other countries.
Peace to everyone.
-Regards.
-Nofil
>From: Saqib Ilyas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [email protected] >Subject: RE: ECN: NED University Deteriorating Standards >Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 17:29:20 +0000 (GMT) > >Every year, I am amazed at the amount of knowledge a few students in my class come with. They are already prepared. Sometimes they know just as much as I do, sometimes they know more, about the subject matter being taught. As teachers we are not here to prove anything. While a student might know more about a certain thing than myself, I might know more about something else. I'm not defending myself or that guy who taught you in final year, it's just a side point on the point that you mentioned. >One benefit that I have seen with young faculty is that students are a little more comfortable with us than with the more senior faculty. Plus, as you get more senior, you usually start taking things for granted and dont really come down to the level of the students and explain certain things because they are "so obvious." Again, there are exceptions. >Yes, most young teachers are misfits. There for the wrong reason. Most of them are teaching at a dozen other institutes throughout the day as adjunct faculty members, doing justice not to a single one of them. Please forgive the rant if someone is offended. But even with two undergraduate courses, I myself do not feel that I am doing justice, so I can not imagine anyone teaching 6 different subjects at 16 different places, with all due respect. >Unfortunately, there is big money in teaching these days. You dont find a job with a starting salary of Rs. 5000 in the industry, but you can easily find a teaching job with a starting salary of Rs. 15000 and then some more as mentioned above. Commercialism. Not professionalism. >I believe that teaching engineers is not an easy job and must be done with the approach of how things are practiced. For that, as I might have mentioned before, teacher's internships are going to help, and are beginning to help, too. That is, until we have quality PhDs who are devoted to teaching. That's a debate in itself. >Once again, my apologies if I offended anyone. This email is meant as a few points to mention, only. >Regards > >"Zia-Uddin Shaikh (AC/EDD)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Hi >Sallam >Just to add regarding fresh graduate hiring. I remember in my batch some of the student knew more about subject then a fresh graduate teacher who completed his studies just 1.5 year ahead of us and was teaching us in final year BE. I don't know , how can university allow such person to teach. Obviously I don't want to mention his name. > >Brs >Zia > >-----Original Message----- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Monday, January 03, 2005 5:34 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: ECN: NED University Deteriorating Standards > > > As'salam u Alaikum(wrwb) >Well, I will not appreciate the complete blame on the students for not being active or sincere to their studies nor on the teachers for their irresponsible behaviour. Ofcourse problem lies at both the ends and most importantly the infrastructure of our Education System. Anyhow......still something is really missing in NED teaching staff section. My experience as a student of NED answers me that missing item is "Professional Approach". Professional approach can really change the attitude of student towards the Engineering subject. Teachers must be very well hand on trained to link theoretical concept with practical approach. Atleast, the feeling must be developed in the mind of student regarding the subject lecture deliv! ered in classroom. This can be done with the help of practical labs linking the theory, working on simulation software, subject related projects, complete debugging of project, practical results presentation on applets, details of industrial design features! > and some > practical sort out literature from datasheets. > >Apart from this, new trend of hiring fresh graduates as a lecturer is increasing a lot in NED. From one aspect it seems to be a good strategy because this young blood will be more enthusiastic as well as completely aware of the hard core problems faced by the students. But -on the another end I personally feel this is not at all professional attitude or the fair deal with the students as well as with the subject. Each and every Engineering subject demands in depth experience and practical touchy style. > >It might be much beneficial if the hardware and software project responsiblity is given to this young blood rather than class of 60+ students with any professional Engineering subject. > >Best regards, > >Faisal (EL 98-99) > >Arsalan Jawed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Dear All, salams! > >Students unwilling to put their faith on the teachings >of NED, is indeed a fact. Students do not usually >realize that the stuff they are being taught is very >practical until they see some of its applications. On >the part of the students, its quite legitimate to feel >this way! No wonder they have no idea that the >CAO-2(Computer Architecture and Organization) sci-fi >parallel processing literature can actually be put to >some implementation (there are some companies in >Islamabad working on this). > >NED used to have two kinds of teachers in my times. >First kind, purely theoretical teachers having nothing >to do with any sort of industry and would make you >memorize some awkward EMF(electromagnetic field) >equations. Other kind included pure-researchers who >never believed that teaching is an excercise which >req! uires disciplined effort and they teach in the same >haphazard manner they do research in some domestic >industry. By no means, i mean to offend our respected >teachers! > >Students usually do not like both kinds, because none >of these them can keep a balance between theoretical >and practical learning curves. To keep students >interests kicking, hardcore theory should always be >backed up with some implementation examples etc - for >this purpose its teachers responsibility to have >persistent contacts with local industry, atleast. >NUST-EME and UET-Lahore have implemented the same >thing successfully. > >By the way, the EMF equations can come in really handy >when one picks to do something in areas like >microwave! > >best regards, >Arsalan Jawed >CS 1996-97 > > >--- Saqib Ilyas wrote: > > > There is a reason you couldnt blame NED here. Myself > > beiing a teacher here, even if I try to make my> students realize the importance of a certain > > subject, or a certain study technique, most of them > > are stubburn and unwilling. I accept that many of my > > co-workers here are and have been irresponsible. > > However, a certain amount of responsibility lies > > with the student as well, to do justice to his or > > her studies. > > Flames to /dev/null. > > Regards > > > > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" wrote: > > Assalam alaikum > > > > I am really impressed by Dr. Aamir thoughts,I myself > > an > > NEDian and I have studied MS Engineering here in > > US.I have > > done BE in Computer Engineering from NED .You have > > mentioned > > all those issues what I think,but I am very sorry to > > say > > that no one will pay attention on these issues in > > Pakistan. > > The problems what I am facing here at present,I > > think 60% to > > 70% of it just becoz I ! havent done any thing > > significant at > > my undergrad level except memorizing the stuff and > > filling > > many copies in exams to get good marks,although I > > have > > completed all relevant courses in my BE which are > > required > > to go for my Engineering major.I was in top ten in > > my final > > year BE result but now I am hardly maintaining GPA > > 3.0 at > > grad level.I have started research in wireless > > communications but after one semester my professor > > told me > > that I am not meeting his standards and therefore he > > cant > > allow me to continue research with him.It hurt me > > personally > > and financially as well.I was unable to get any > > RA/TA.I am > > an orphan and not from any financially sound > > family.Someone > > sponsored me from Pakistan for first semester in US > > becoz of > > my good grades and thats y I am here.I have worked > > hard but > > becoz of financial depression of paying the fees and > > lack of > > good background I have just completed my MS here > > with > > payable loan which I am still unable to pay fully so > > now > > university is not awarding me the masters degree. I > > had a > > plan to go for PhD but I think in this situation no > > school > > will accept me for PhD. These r the facts which no > > one > > realizes.Every one beats his own drum.I have seen > > Dr.Aamirs > > email on ECN so I thought to share my thoughts with > > all of > > you. > > Thanks > > Manzoor > > _______________________________________________ > > ECN: Electronically Connected NEDians > > http://nedian.org.pk/mailman/ecn > > [email protected] > > > > > > Muhammad Saqib Ilyas > > Assistant Professor > > NED University of Engg & Tech > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even > > more fun! > >________________________________________________ > > ECN: Electronically Connected NEDians > > http://nedian.org.pk/mailman/ecn > > [email protected] > > > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. >http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 >_______________________________________________ >ECN: Electronically Connected NEDians >http://nedian.org.pk/mailman/ecn >[email protected] > > > > > > > > >Muhammad Faisal >Master Student, Winter semester 2004 >Electromagnetics, Optics & Microwave Engg. >Technical University of Hamburg-Harburg >Germany > > >--------------------------------- >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less._______________________________________________ >ECN: Electronically Connected NEDians >http://nedian.org.pk/mailman/ecn >[email protected] > > >Muhammad Saqib Ilyas >Assistant Professor >NED University of Engg & Tech > > > > > >--------------------------------- > ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! >_______________________________________________ >ECN: Electronically Connected NEDians >http://nedian.org.pk/mailman/ecn >[email protected]
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