Joe, My 43' antenna works very well on 160 and 80 as I have reported. In fact, it works so well that those DX stations that I work with it are amazed - quite frankly so am I.
Sorry, but your opinion is just that. 73, Bob W5OV > > > The 43' length is a convenient non-resonant length - nothing else. > > No, 43' is 5/8 wave on 20 meters (984/14.3*0.625 == 43). That is > the point (well, 0.64 wave if you want to be precise) that the > first lobe has maximum radiation in a vertical. That the 43' or > or 44' vertical happens to be generally non-resonant in all of the > HF bands is fortuitous but not necessarily by design. > >> I have a 43' vertical with one of AD5X's 160 and 80 matching systems >> at the base fed with an UN-UN and it works great. > > Without base matching and a decent ground system, the 43' vertical is > terribly inefficient on 160 and 80 meters (substantially less than > 1/4 wave and extremely reactive) due to very high SWR losses in any > practical feedline (using coax) length. > > One would be much better served to use two radiators, one longer than > 43' (perhaps 85 feet) for improved efficiency on 160/80 and one shorter > (perhaps 25 feet) to reduce the substantial amount of RF that is lost > at take-off angles above the critical angle on 15/12/10 meters, along > with an automatic tuner at the base of the antenna. > > An untuned (un-un fed) 43' vertical is the 21st century equivalent > of an Isoloop or Gotham vertical ... nothing but snake oil designed > to fool the unwary, those who don't understand electromagnetics, and > those who believe in something for nothing. > > 73, > > ... Joe, W4TV > > > On 3/8/2011 6:47 PM, [email protected] wrote: >> None of these old wive's tales are true. >> >> The 43' length is a convenient non-resonant length - nothing else. >> >> The balun was chosen originally because the 43' vertical was originally >> planned to have one or two elevated radials only (making it balanced), >> and >> it would load fine with a balun. >> >> The problems came to be when full-blown radial systems were attached and >> station grounds were connected to the radials, which again, were >> originally intended to be elevated - i.e.; not grounded. What this did >> was >> to short one side of the output of the balun to ground. So, when you >> ground the radials, an UN-UN is preferable and works very well. >> >> I have a 43' vertical with one of AD5X's 160 and 80 matching systems at >> the base fed with an UN-UN and it works great. >> >> I use it on all bands - 160 through 10m. Check out the ZL8X online log >> with my call to see how well it works. >> >> 73, >> >> Bob W5OV >> >> >> >>> I've heard quite a few people use balun, when they meant impedence >>> transformer or unun. >>> >>> I heard somewhere (and the tapes have been erased) that the 43' length >>> came about >>> because it was the most economical length for a manufacturer to cut >>> stock >>> with the >>> least waste to meet shipping limitations. >>> >>> 73, Mike NF4L >>> >>> On 3/8/2011 5:29 PM, David Herring wrote: >>>> Here's a follow-on question to the reflector... >>>> >>>> Vernon's set-up brings a question to mind. He says he's using a 4:1 >>>> balun on his vertical. At first brush that seems counterintuitive, >>>> doesn't it? Isn't a vertical unbalanced? Certainly the coax is >>>> unbalanced. When you're mating an unbalanced feedline with an >>>> unbalanced antenna, wouldn't one be better off using an unun rather >>>> than >>>> a 4:1 balun? >>>> >>>> In further support of my line of questioning, I've read numerous, >>>> albeit >>>> anecdotal, reports of people being displeased with the performance of >>>> their vertical, particularly the untuned ones like Zero-Five for >>>> example. But when they add an unun they are then amazed at how the >>>> antenna allegedly "sprung to life." >>>> >>>> 73, >>>> Dave AH6TD >>>> >>>> On Mar 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, Vernon Mauery wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes. I can see the S-meter go from 3-4 down with static down to >>>>> nothing with quieter static. My best guess is that I am not trying >>>>> the right times at the right places. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks to everyone for the help. >>>>> >>>>> --Vernon N7OH >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Mar 8, 2011 at 8:12 AM, Ross Primrose N4RP<[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> Does the received noise decrease when you disconnect the antenna? >>>>>> >>>>>> 73, Ross N4RP >>>>>> >>>>>> On 3/8/2011 1:06 AM, Vernon Mauery wrote: >>>>>>> At the risk of exposing what a n00b I am when it comes to HF, I >>>>>>> really >>>>>>> need some help. I recently (last month) purchased a K3. First HF >>>>>>> radio I have owned. I got my license 2 years ago and have spent >>>>>>> most >>>>>>> of the time since playing with VHF. I have been trying to teach >>>>>>> myself CW and decided that it was time to step into the HF waters. >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> studied, ogled, and dreamed of my ideal HF transceiver. I finally >>>>>>> found the K3 and having looked (at least a cursory glance) at all >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> others, I was sold. I saved my pennies and purchased. I also got >>>>>>> myself a 43' untuned vertical antenna, balun, and radial wires. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My setup: K3/100 has 100 feet of low loss 400 coax out to the 43 >>>>>>> foot >>>>>>> vertical on the hill in my back yard. It has 8 25 foot radials and >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> 4:1 balun. The K3 has the KATU3, KPA3, KTCXO3-1, KFL3A-400, and >>>>>>> default 2.8KHz filters. I assembled it and did followed the >>>>>>> calibration instructions as well as I could. I think I got >>>>>>> everything, but obviously I missed something. Or maybe I just need >>>>>>> an >>>>>>> elmer to tell me what to do. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I cannot seem to find any signals that make the S meter go above a >>>>>>> 3 >>>>>>> or 4. I have the RF gain turned up a fair ways (mostly to the >>>>>>> top), >>>>>>> and I can hear static. As I tune up some of the bands on SSB, I >>>>>>> can >>>>>>> hear a tone that changes higher in pitch as I tune up in frequency. >>>>>>> I >>>>>>> have tried listening for CW, but I am hearing nothing as I scan >>>>>>> through the bands. I had a 10m horizontal dipole taped to my wall >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> a while until I found time to run the coax out to the back yard. I >>>>>>> had hoped that since it was resonant on the 10m band, maybe it >>>>>>> would >>>>>>> be able to pick up something, but it was no better (or worse) than >>>>>>> my >>>>>>> vertical. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As far as I can tell, the radio seems to transmit. I can see the >>>>>>> power meter moving and the SWR meter moving. The ATU seems to be >>>>>>> able >>>>>>> to find acceptable settings on most of the bands with the vertical. >>>>>>> But I can't hear them. You can't work them if you can't hear them, >>>>>>> right? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This is a desperate plea for help. Is it the radio or me? Please >>>>>>> have pity on the n00b and walk me through my first HF contact. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> --Vernon N7OH >>>>>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>>>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>>>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> FCC Section 97.313(a) At all times, an amateur station must use the >>>>>> minimum transmitter power necessary to carry out the desired >>>>>> communications. >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>>>> >>>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>>>> >>>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>>> >>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>> ______________________________________________________________ >>>> Elecraft mailing list >>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>>> >>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> ______________________________________________________________ >>> Elecraft mailing list >>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >>> Post: mailto:[email protected] >>> >>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >>> >> >> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> > ______________________________________________________________ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:[email protected] > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > ______________________________________________________________ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:[email protected] This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
