HI All,
I've watched may people speculate about PED's and what they MAY do, so I
decided to go in the lab and make some measurements on my new iPad.
Obviously conducted is not an option, there's no power cord.
For radiated emissions to 1 GHz, the device is as quiet as a mouse. It
was only a quick look see, so I set it up as if I were reading a book: I
have no movies loaded yet.
Clearly there are other options, so if any one would like to chip in as
to the way it should be running when tested let me know and I'll run
when I get a second and post results.
I'm thinking either playing a game with lots of video or a High
resolution movie.
Passive headset inserted also, cord unbundled.
Anything else?
Cheers,
Derek.
L F Research
On 3/23/2012 9:37 PM, Ken Javor wrote:
Here are the problems with that, from my original post., dated 18 March:
But even given all that work, how do we know that all iPads (not picking on
them, but just a name with which I'm familiar) are all the same? Do they
all have exactly the same processors/RAM/what have you running at all the
same frequencies? If a clock changes from one in which harmonics were
out-of-band to a radio but now they are in-band, there could be a problem.
Or if an IC has its internals modified, but is a form/fit /function drop-in
equivalent, that can change the emission profile as well, and the device
manufacturer wouldn't even know, because the IC manufacturer didn't change a
part number.
The fix here is EMI qualification testing of every variant that is sold, as
longs as the manufacturer is aware of any and all changes to his internals.
But even that isn't enough, because unlike regular aircraft avionics, these
PEDs are not under the control of the airline. They have likely been
dropped, immersed in or at least come in contact with liquids and the bottom
line is that an initial qualification of one unit does not necessarily
qualify all units sold over their usable lifetimes. One would have to look
at the design to see what specific EMI reduction methods were used, and how
they might be affected by ordinary misuse over a typical life.
We have to remember here that while ordinary EN55022 type qualification
protects the turf of licensed broadcasters, and thus their means of making a
living, with the aircraft COMM and NAV systems, we are putting lives and
property at risk.
Ken Javor
Phone: (256) 650-5261
From: "Grasso, Charles"<[email protected]>
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 21:51:35 +0000
To: Ken Javor<[email protected]>, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]>
Conversation: [PSES] New immunity testing by the FAA in the future?
Subject: RE: [PSES] New immunity testing by the FAA in the future?
Wouldn't it be safer to have manufacturers of portable devices pass the DO160
requirements?
Best Regards
Charles Grasso
Compliance Engineer
Echostar Communications
(w) 303-706-5467
(c) 303-204-2974
(t) [email protected]
(e) [email protected]
(e2) [email protected]
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ken Javor
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 2:24 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [PSES] New immunity testing by the FAA in the future?
Well, that's a humorous take on it, but it wouldn't have to be that way.
Also, it wouldn't take a scanner for every row. It takes a sensor (antenna)
for every few rows (recall we are looking primarily at 108-152 MHz, and that
means an antenna of significant length) to get usable sensitivity with a 50
Ohm input scanner). But a lot of sensors could be multiplexed into a single
scanner, with the scanner switching between different sensors continuously.
When a level in the problem frequency range is registered above some limit,
the system would check if that particular signal was at a frequency that was
going to be used on that approach or take-off. If not, it is a false alarm
and doesn't matter. If the signal frequency is close to that being used by
the various comm/nav devices, only then would the crew have to interact with
a scofflaw passenger.
With this system, it can be made clear that the problem isn't just a
bureaucratic snafu, but is a clear and present danger. As in, "Ladies and
Gentlemen, in violation of aircraft safety rules, a personal electronic
device is a being operated in row 15, and it is interfering with our
navigation homing device, which guides the aircraft to a safe landing." We
must delay/abort our approach until this device is secured by the crew until
the aircraft has safely landed."
And "shaming" a passenger by delaying a take-off or landing could be a
powerful incentive for both the guilty party to never let it happen to
him/her again and the other passengers to resolve that they don't want to it
to happen to them, either.
Ken Javor
Phone: (256) 650-5261
From: "ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen"<[email protected]>
Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2012 21:00:33 +0100
To: John Woodgate<[email protected]>,<[email protected]>
Conversation: [PSES] New immunity testing by the FAA in the future?
Subject: RE: [PSES] New immunity testing by the FAA in the future?
This scanner thing might be possible technically,
but not possible to implement in the organizational structure
the flight crew is working.
"Please Ladies and Gentleman, someone in this row
might have a PED operating. Please stand-up so our
lovely flight attendant can help you switch off
the device. " No it's not the kindle, but may be your galaxy
or your camera, oh no is can see, it's your Ipad.
And that for 40 rows on a total of 80 or so.
Just before takeoff..
" Sorry ladies and gentleman, but our flight has delayed another 10
minutes
because on row 57 a operating PED has been detected."
Or while landing:
" Ladies and Gentlemen, here is your Captain speaking; normally we would
have landed
on Luton Airport. Unfortunately our scanner has detected a working
Personal Electronic Device, so we have to postpone our landing for 34
minutes.
Please be patient while our crew throws the owner out of the window..."
And after a few tries:
....captain speaking: In spite of a potential interference problem with
one of the passengers
Personal Electronic Devices operating, due to lack of fuel
we are obliged now to initiate a possible failing landing procedure
Please adopt the official crash position as instructed...brace brace"
Gert Gremmen
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Namens John Woodgate
Verzonden: maandag 19 maart 2012 18:12
Aan: [email protected]
Onderwerp: Re: [PSES] New immunity testing by the FAA in the future?
In message<cb8cca2f.1c27e%[email protected]>, dated Mon, 19
Mar 2012, Ken Javor<[email protected]> writes:
Broadband rf detectors can see a signal on the order of 1 V/m, which is
good enough to catch an intentional transmission. Unintentional
emissions are controlled to levels between 24-60 dBuV/m, in order to
protect aircraft radios, and those levels cannot be measured with a
cheap and reliable rf detector.
Sure, that's why I wrote:
The 'detector' would need to be a scanner, to get enough signal-to-noise
ratio.
I should think scanners these days are quite reliable and not too
costly. How about 1 per row, rather than 1 per aisle seat?
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. Try www.jmwa.demon.co.uk and www.isce.org.uk
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK
If 'QWERTY' is an English keyboard, what language is 'WYSIWYG' for?
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