> The point is I've had absolutely no luck in convincing anyone to move from MACH3 or any other CNC 'package' to LinuxCNC. Why?
I spent a good few days trying LCNC, as I was intrigued and wanted to try out EtherCAT, as I like the idea of a simpler setup (no step/dir wiring/issues, less wiring, and the drives give IO reducing the need for additional IO boards), however as it stands, I'm probably going to pay the money for a Vital systems EtherCAT board to go with Mach 4. In terms of LCNC issues I faced. RPi4 eventually worked, but if you updated the available image, it bricked the installation. Also for some unknown reason, you couldn't open Chrome on the LCNC install. I bought an Odroid H3+, but due to being new hardware required Bookworm to fully work (earlier kernels didn't support the graphics). I couldn't get the EtherCAT libraries to compile on the H3, and there were issues with any LCNC screen that used Python (appeared to be a dependency issue change with Bookworm) I eventually removed the mini-ITX board from my little CNC mill (runs a Dynomotion KFlop setup), which let me install the stable LCNC release, and get EtherCAT working. However, there is an issue in the EtherCAT stack, which prevented the drives from enabling correctly, unless I started LCNC then plugged the CAT cable in. Not a major issue for initial testing, but nobody could really answer why it was doing that. But if I also coded in a Berkhoff module, without the CAT cable connected, LCNC wouldn't start due to error generated by the Berkhoff module not being connected. I spent a good amount of time trying various options, but the big issue I kept coming back to is LCNC is *very* fragmented. Documentation is spread across various places (official website, wiki, stickied forum posts) Although there appears to be a 'core' development team, there appears to be quite a lot of people doing their own thing. For me, for LCNC to become a valid option, it needs the entire project rationalised. Develop it so it works well on one set base OS. Reduce the number of screens, and make the screens that are kept far more functional and polished. Make configuration easier (editing basic configurations, shouldn't involve manually editing files. There should be a GUI setting editor that covers 90% of common machine setups - I'm happy with manual files, but the majority are not) To use Mach as a comparison on a basic machine. You take a Windows computer. You install Mach. You open Mach. You open some settings windows to set up the controller and assign pins. You open another window and configure machine parameters. You should now have a functioning machine. If you don't, you re-open the settings windows and change what you need to. If you want to change screen, you can change screen. If you want to edit the screen, you can edit the screen with a screen editor. Now think about all the steps involved in setting up a similar basic machine in LCNC, and then what you need to do if you want to swap screens or even edit a screen? Download a quite large ISO. Install the ISO and hope it works with your chosen PC hardware. Load LCNC. Select one of the plethora of screen options. Realise you need to run a totally separate configurator (assuming you're going PP, or MESA). Hope you enter the settings correctly. Re-open LCNC. If you want to change any settings, you need to close and re-open LCNC. If the configurator hasn't done/can't do what you need, you then need to learn to manually edit the settings file. Eventually you get a machine running. Then you want to edit or try a different screen? You can see where I'm going with this. LCNC is not currently beginner friendly. As it stands, LCNC feels like there are lots of people doing their own thing, with no thought to a more overall plan to make LCNC a more mature product. The comment that springs to mind is "Jack of all trades, master of none". Moray On Tue, 24 Jan 2023 at 20:12, John Dammeyer <jo...@autoartisans.com> wrote: > Hi Rob, > No. I use AlibreCAD and the now old and discontinued AlibreCAM which is > the integrated Mecsoft VisualCAM. > > As for I/O I think you might be missing the point. I've certainly had > enough people stress to me the ease of setting up their Centroid system. > They are happy with 3 axis and possibly 4. > > The almost vitriol resistance to LinuxCNC is really quite amazing > considering how powerful it is. But it's not easy to set up. As the > tutorial on Tormach's install shows, get the wrong MESA version and it > resets and updates and you lose everything. Handy if you have a Tormach > and don't want to think about the underlying OS. Difficult when you get > into asking users to start editing files on non-Tormach machines. > > So here's a suggestion since you were originally asking about Tormach. > Why not create a tutorial with diagrams for a simple 4 axis system using > the Raspberry Pi4, 7i92 from MESA (7 in stock today) and two of the > Chinese BoBs. (I reverse engineered them so I have the schematic). > > Of course this should also specify exactly how to set up one of the common > smaller mills. Maybe something like this: > > https://www.busybeetools.com/products/milling-machine-with-digital-readout-cx601.html > Drawings for the brackets. Motor selection. Power supply. The works. > > Or even just AXIS instead of Tormach. > > The point is I've had absolutely no luck in convincing anyone to move from > MACH3 or any other CNC 'package' to LinuxCNC. Why? That's the question we > need to answer. > > John > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rob C [mailto:rclandro...@gmail.com] > > Sent: January-24-23 11:04 AM > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Running PathPilot on non-Tormach Machines > > > > have you tried nativecam? > > > > easy to add to axis (when you've done it before). > > > > centroid acorn is nice, but very expensive and has very few iOS (compared > > to Mesa hardware and linuxcnc) and only 4x step and direction ports...... > > your choice. > > > > On Tue, 24 Jan 2023, 18:42 John Dammeyer, <jo...@autoartisans.com> > wrote: > > > > > > From: Andy Pugh [mailto:bodge...@gmail.com] > > > > > On 24 Jan 2023, at 15:38, ken.stra...@sympatico.ca wrote: > > > > > > > > > > But seriously, in my opinion a major impediment to the widescale > > > adoption of > > > > > LinuxCNC is the lack of an appealing and intuitive UI. > > > > > > > > There are around 12 user interfaces. Are you saying that they are > _all_ > > > terrible? > > > > > > > > > > I'll jump in on this one. They are _all_ great and they are _all_ > > > terrible. > > > > > > Imagine your average home shop machinist. His kids are finally out the > > > door and he's at an income level where he's got his lathe with a DRO > and he > > > just bought a small mill. He starts looking at CNC. > > > > > > At work and at home he uses Windows. And he's bought into the free > Fusion > > > 360 con job for CAD/CAM and is now looking at how to add CNC to his > mill. > > > > > > OMG. What a hodge podge of systems. > > > > > > So he starts on the various groups looking for what is available > including > > > even AliExpress which has CNC boxes for $300. > > > > > > Not having used CNC before and not knowing anyone local the youtube > videos > > > become his other source of information and education. The most > interesting > > > ones appear to be ones with 10's of thousands of subscribers that in > fact > > > are really long mostly to have multiple advertisers. But at the time > he's > > > not aware that the videos are short on information, long on con for > > > supporting lots of advertising. > > > > > > IMHO, the more advertisements in really long videos the more likely the > > > poster is there to monetize than to actually provide useful help. How > > > interesting to watch a milling cutter for 2 minutes go back and forth > > > making chips. Oh, and now another advertisement. > > > > > > So someone on a forum recommends MESA. > > > > > > > http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=83_84&product_id=215 > > > Hmm. Out of stock. And even if it were, there's no diagram like the > > > ACORN one. So no idea where to start... > > > > > > Oh but then someone suggests > > > > > > > http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=381&search=7i92 > > > > > > Now I need to wire to it. A suggestion comes up for two of these and > > > cheap too. > > > https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33015669728.html > > > > > > Next motors and power supplies. What to buy? People rave about these > new > > > step-servos. One brand in particular. But what size? Direct coupled > or > > > with belts and pulleys? > > > > > > So back to the internet and youtube. Ah, this guy has a mill like > mine. > > > He used the Leadshine step servos and ACORN. Ordered, installed as > per > > > the youtube video. Making chips. > > > > > > And he doesn't have to wade through deciding which of _all_ 12 or so > LCNC > > > user interfaces to use. > > > > > > The above is I think the typical thought processes. > > > > > > I'm still using AXIS. Can't be bothered to spend the time trying to > > > figure out whether I should spend $400 for a touch screen HDMI 21" > screen > > > or some other user interface. Really miss the MACROs from MACH3 > though. I > > > think that's what's called the conversational interface on Tormach? > > > > > > John > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Emc-users mailing list > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Emc-users mailing list > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > > > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
