I'll change the title for the different discussion.
First a question: does the version number mean what I think it means, or
does it really not mean much?
My guess/expectation is that
0.21.0 start with new features
0.21.x gets tweaks and bug fixes
0.21.11 is the last from that featureset branch and the most stable of that
branch (at least ideally)
0.22.0 start over with brand new features and bugs
etc..
Does that sound correct?
> > 1) never had time to even get anything building until today
> > 2) 0.22 has too many different bugs for me to want to keep trying to use
> > it.
>
> well then we are at an impasse. nothing is going to change or be fixed because
> there is no way to know what to change or why, so you will be on 0.21 forever
> and we'll move on. sorry. we've been through this before. :(
We have. The problem here is that I've literally never, not once,
upgraded E because I wanted new features. I've only ever upgraded it
because I absolutely had to for a reason or another (bugs,
incompatibilities).
I'd have stayed with 0.18.5 forever if it weren't for it not working
with chrome anymore, and so forth.
Hell, I'd likely still be on 0.16 if I could ;)
However, every time I've upgraded E, I got unwelcome to very unwelcome
new bugs, making me regret my upgrade :-/
Yes, you're going to hate me for saying that, sorry :)
Basically E has done what I needed for a long time. It's not adding any
features I need (although I'll admit that the pulse sound slider per
window is actually a nice new feature in 0.22).
I know I've come off as complaining and not contributing. Sadly, it's
because my WM has to work, it's not a hobby for me, it's like X, it has
to work because all my other work depends on it.
I actually spend a lot of time contributing patches to projects,
finding bugs, reporting them in details if I can't fix them myself, and
help test the new code. I also maintain my own projects and code. But to
do all this, I need linux, Xorg, and E to work. Neither I'm interested
in beta testing because I don't have another machine I use just to test
them, I only use them on my production machines where they have to just
work.
Last week, I show up for a work meeting, I open my laptop, everything is
hosed/hung. I try to restart E, it won't restart. I forget why but that
time I actually had to restart X. Time lost, people looking at me.
I restart X and chrome and as chrome starts, one tab start blazing noise
and I can't quickly find which one. The E speaker volume slider is
broken on that start, I can't change the volume or mute quickly.
I excuse myself, leave the room, go debug all this outside while looking
like an idiot.
Lesser but not uncommon scenario: I open my laptop in the plane with all
my stuff pre-loaded. If E wedges itself and I can't fix it/restart it
without crashing X (usually I succeed thankfully), I lose all my
preloaded work and then no wifi to recover during the flight, I'm hosed.
So, that's why linux, X, and E just have to work and why I don't to ever
upgrade E unless I must, as it's pretty much been pain and
disappointment every time (except that usually I was also leaving
another version with other pain and other disappointment).
I so so so wish for an E branch that just stabilizes and works forever,
or almost forever. I however know you don't have a release team like
linux with a person responsible for maintaining the 4.9.x kernel for X
years.
But having people follow the bleeding edge and git forever is not a
solution for people like me either. I hope you understand.
In my ideal life, I want neither new features nor new bugs, just fewer
bugs until they're few enough that I can live with them. Until I'm
forced to switch to wayland, or some other chrome comes up with new
stuff that breaks older versions of E and then I'm hosed again.
> 0.22 has this fixed... so either move to 0.22 and try what i suggested or go
but it has new features and new bugs, and I need/want neither :)
> we don't try to put stuff in e or efl that is broken for us - in our testing,
> but not all distros and hardware are the same. they contain different versions
(...)
Yeeh, I totally understand that. I totally understand that the problems
I see may not be E's fault, but they appear after I upgrade E. At work
when stuff breaks, you revert the last thing changed, regardless of
whose fault it really is in the end. Same with E.
To be fair, I tried to upgrade Xorg + intel drivers and all I got for
that effort is that now xscreensaver is unable to turn my screen dark
before locking. Sigh :( (not E's fault of course)
If I don't get new features I don't need, I won't get new bugs I don't
need either ;)
Makes sense?
Any chance we can have a stable E branch? It's super vexing if I'm
forced to go to 0.22 to get fixes to know bugs in 0.21, and 0.22 is
totally not stable for me, nor is it apparently going to be anytime soon
(and even less so without my helping you, which isn't very realistic due
to what I explained above).
This is why I built 0.21.11 with wishful thinking that it would be the
last set of bugfixes to a known stable branch. Seems that it's not
though :-/
Marc
--
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
Microsoft is to operating systems ....
.... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | PGP 7F55D5F27AAF9D08
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
_______________________________________________
enlightenment-users mailing list
enlightenment-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-users
