Paul/Russ As they say, there is no bad weather, just bad gear! Don Sent from Don's iPhone 3GS...
On Jan 3, 2010, at 8:31 AM, [email protected] wrote: > Paul: > > I, like you very much enjoy extreme cold ....there is something > perversely enjoyable about being outside at temps close to zero or > below with a gentle wind that feels like a laser on your cheeks. As > I've gotten older and reached the point where I am almost always > working alone, I no longer go out for more than six or eight hours > in the woods if the temperature isn't going to get above zero. > > I agree about layering and how you mix them is so incredibly > important. The general availability of good mixed material boots > like Sorels with removable felts makes many aspects of extreme > weather much more enjoyable today than 30 or 40 years ago. > > I'd like to offer a tip for heavy physical effort and perspiration > in extreme cold weather. In almost any circumstance where I am > going to climb up a big mountain or expose myself to a substantial > period of serious effort in very cold temperatures, I'll carry a > spare T-shirt. At the point where I decide that the period of most > severe effort has ended I will immediately stop in as calm a point > as possible and strip down my top layers down to bare skin and take > off the wettest bottommost layer of my shirts and completely dress > back up with a dry shirt on the bottom. Such a change has always > been refreshing and nearly always prevents me from developing a > chill. Also, if I plan it carefully and I am able to make the > wardrobe change before my body starts to recover from the strain of > the climb and begin cooling off I have an extremely good chance of > remaining comfortable at whatever the temperature is for several > hours. > > One question, for everyone who spends a lot of time in the woods > during the coldest part of winter....have you noticed that there is > a time in the afternoon when something changes to make the air > suddenly "feel" colder. In Western Massachusetts during January I > usually found that time to be between 3:15 and 3:30 on the coldest > days. Other people were the first to point this change out to me > and it seems to be most readily noticeable in forested locations > that are on north or east facing areas (out of any sun). > > Russ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Jost <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Sat, Jan 2, 2010 2:30 pm > Subject: Re: [ENTS] Cold is good > > Bob, > > As I get older, I also have reduced tolerance for the cold. The key > is to have proper clothing and to keep moving. Conventional cold > weather gear is woefully inadequate. It is a significant investment > to outfit one's self with the proper clothing. From years of deer > hunting, moving slowly or not at all for several hours at a time in > subzero weather, I have evolved a clothing arrangement that allows > me to do so relatively comfortably. Few people that I have come > across in winter are dressed in winter clothing other than what is > available in the typical chain store or department store. It's good > for urban living but not rural stomping. Even most hunting clothing > traps too much moisture. My cold weather midyear and outerwear, > boots and socks come mostly from Cabala's, thermal underwear and > glove liners from REI, glove-mitts and knit caps from anyone that > has them. > > Paul > ----- Original Message ----- > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 1:21 PM > Subject: Re: [ENTS] Cold is good > > Paul, > > I salute you my friend. I never thought about the dvantages as you > have described them. However, as one ages, tolerance to cold > diminishes. At least, that is true in my case. I am becoming a real > wuss. > > Bob > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Paul Jost" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Saturday, January 2, 2010 1:38:21 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada > Eastern > Subject: [ENTS] Cold is good > > I disagree. The best time to search some sites is when it is below > zero, as > long as the wind is nearly calm. About 10 years ago, I spent a > three day > weekend in fresh snow in the Cathedral Pines and Giant Pine Groves > in the > Nicolet National Forest. It never got warmer than -10F and was > mostly -15 > to -20F. The cold weather kept all people out of the woods (except > for one > individual on the December bird count survey day) and the fresh snow > allowed > me to track a real viewable grid pattern through the entire > Cathedral Pine > grove without having to refer to a GPS the whole time. This freed > up my > hands and eyes for quick on the fly rough-estimation scanning > through the > grove. The lack of other people due to the cold allowed me to refer > to my > footsteps in the snow for ensuring a thorough scouting of the > grove. The > lack of wind allowed me to not be burdened with a heavy winter > coat. I > generated enough heat by walking in the knee deep snow and crossing > blowdowns. I wore a light sweater, light vest, and light jacket > with light > gloves and a cap. It was refreshing to be dressed lightly and out > in the > brisk weather crashing through underbrush. However, if I stopped > for more > than a few minutes to measure a tree, I soon got too cold. I kept the > laser, GPS, and camera one layer deep within my clothes. Any more > would > have made them too warm and condensation would have damaged them > after their > periodic exposures to the cold air. The circumstances allowed me to > find > tall skinny 133 foot white pines whose crowns had been 25-35' higher > but had > at some time been bent horizontal by heavy snow loads. All of those > trees > have since fallen since then due to subsequent snow loads in > combination > with their arching bent over habit. Additionally, I covered an area > that I > normally would have ignored, but went into to stick to my regimen of > well > defined grids in the snow. As a result, I found 147' and 150' tall > white > pines adjacent to each other outside the main grove. Those are the > tallest > trees that I have measured in Wisconsin outside the Menominee > Reservation. > Both accurately laser measured in -22F weather in the dusky twilight > and > reverified within a half a foot on a 95F midsummer day the following > year. > That time, the grove was filled with tourists and nesting great blue > herons, > as well as mosquitoes! I preferred the colder day. > > Paul > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lee Frelich" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 11:08 AM > Subject: Re: [ENTS] Re: The Ramble Grove_Asheville NC > > > > Bob: > > > > Yes, keeping electronic instruments under your coat is pretty much > > necessary when its below zero. However, I don't do field work on > days > > when the high is predicted to be below zero. Its just not an > efficient > > use of time. 0-10 degrees is my minimum for field work, although I > do > > recreational activities at colder temperatures. > > > > Lee > > > > [email protected] wrote: > >> James, > >> > >> Well, north is relative. At my latitude, we grab opportunities when > >> they arise and just limit our exposure, time wise. Farther north, > in > >> Lee's neck of the woods, I think measuring gets suspended > entirely. He > >> and Paul will have to confirm that observation, but trying to get a > >> laser to work in sub-zero is not a smart idea. Maybe they have > >> techniques like keeping the laser inside a garment next to the > body, > >> whipping it out, taking a quick shot and submerging it again. > >> > >> Bob > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "James Parton" <[email protected]> > >> To: "ENTSTrees" <[email protected]> > >> Sent: Saturday, January 2, 2010 9:26:16 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada > Eastern > >> Subject: [ENTS] Re: The Ramble Grove_Asheville NC > >> > >> Bob, > >> > >> I was hoping for an outing tomorrow, but cold hands may be a real > >> problem. How do northern ents cope? That button on the Nikon 440 is > >> too small to use adequately with heavily gloved hands and try > writing > >> down data with heavy gloves on. I have learned that pulling off > your > >> gloves, even for a short time is not usually a good idea! > >> > >> James. > >> > >> > >> On Jan 2, 8:20 am, Bob <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > James > >> > > >> > Good job. I sympathize with you on the freezing hands > problem. > >> > That was what curtailed my tree measuring in Montpelier. > >> > > >> > Bob > >> > > >> > Sent from my iPhone > >> > > >> > On Jan 2, 2010, at 12:35 AM, James Parton > <[email protected]> > >> > wrote: > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ENTS, > >> > > >> > > Today I finally got back to do some measuring of a nice White > Pine > >> > > grove that I found while on another hike back in January > 2009. The > >> > > grove is located between the Blue Ridge Parkway and > Hendersonville > >> > > Rd ( Hwy 25 ) near where the parkway crosses over 25. I call > it the > >> > > Ramble Grove because of the nearby Ramble housing development > >> > > located nearby. > >> > > >> > > > >> http://www.nativetreesociety.org/fieldtrips/north_carolina/20090125-b > ... > >> > > >> > > The grove is dominated by Eastern White Pine but also contains > >> > > Tuliptree and Pitch Pine with American Holly as an understory > tree. > >> > > A few oaks and shortleaf pines are found here too, especially > near > >> > > the borders of the grove. Large Poison Ivy vines also climb > to great > >> > > heights into the trees. I found one huge vine that was two > feet in > >> > > circumference! Why do some forests have large Poison Ivy > vines while > >> > > others lack Poison Ivy all together? Poison Ivy seems rare in > most > >> > > older growth forests I visit while it seems more common in > younger > >> > > forests. Especially near populated areas. Does anyone know > why? I > >> > > would guess this grove to be young judging by the trees > youthful > >> > > appearance and many branch stubs on the trunks of the pines. > I would > >> > > guess the grove at 60-80 years old. > >> > > >> > > The tallest tree found today was a respectable White Pine > that was > >> > > 143..2 feet tall and 6' 3" in girth. Tall and slim. The largest > >> > > overall was a Tuliptree that was 138.3 feet tall and 8' 9" in > girth. > >> > > >> > > Also a hollylike plant was found in the forest that I believe > is an > >> > > invasive species. Can anyone identify this " mystery holly " > for me? > >> > > I have seen it as an ornamental in people's yards. I think my > dad > >> > > has one.. I don't think it is a true ilex. > >> > > >> > > Here are todays measurements > >> > > >> > > cbh Height > >> > > >> > > White Pine 6' 3" 130.3' > >> > > >> > > White Pine 8' 0" 122.6' > >> > > >> > > White Pine 6' 2" 136.5' > >> > > >> > > Tuliptree 8' 9" 138.3' > >> > > >> > > White Pine 6' 3" 143.2' ! > >> > > >> > > Pitch Pine 5' 6" 114.3' ! > >> > > >> > > It was a good day but my hands were about frozen when I got > out of > >> > > the woods! > >> > > >> > > James Parton > >> > > >> > > -- > >> > > Eastern Native Tree Societyhttp://www.nativetreesociety.org > >> > > Send email to [email protected] > >> > > Visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/entstrees? > hl=en > >> > > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > >> > > <Ramble_ Woods.jpg> > >> > > <Ramble_Grove.JPG> > >> > > <Poison_Ivy.JPG> > >> > > <Mystery_Holly.JPG> > >> > > <143.2ftWP.JPG>- Hide quoted text - > >> > > >> > - Show quoted text - > >> > >> -- > >> Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > >> Send email to [email protected] > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > >> To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > >> -- > >> Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > >> Send email to [email protected] > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > >> To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > > > > -- > > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > > Send email to [email protected] > > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > > > > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] -- Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org Send email to [email protected] Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en To unsubscribe send email to [email protected]
