On 14 Aug 2012, at 18:19, John Clark wrote:

On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 6:30 AM, Russell Standish <li...@hpcoders.com.au > wrote:

> But he[me] agrees and even proposes a compatibilist definition [of free will]

> I'll let him speak to that, but its not the impression I get.

All I said was that the only definition of "free will" that is not gibberish is the inability to always know what you will do next even in a unchanging environment, the meaning is clear and its not self contradictory.

OK. We agree on that.



I also said my definition was rarely used by anybody, is intellectually shallow, and has zero value;

Not wen you succeed to formalize it. Then you can show, with computer science that notion like free-will, or consciousness, can have a role in the speeding of the evolution processes. This is done with all details in my long french text "conscience & m├ęcanisme".



but even so that makes it vastly superior to any other definition of that two word phrase.


OK.

Bruno



  John K Clark







> >No, but it does need 1-randomness
>
> Imagine the iterated WM-duplication. Why would the resulting peoples
> have more free will than the same person not doing the experience?
> It seems to me that if a decision relies on a perfect coin, it is
> less "free" than if it relies on my partial self-indetermination,
> which itself is a deterministic process, although I cannot see it.
>

Assuming the coin is operating inside the agent's body? Why would that
be considered non-free?

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