On 10/3/2012 4:20 PM, John Mikes wrote:
Stephen:
are you compofrtable to imagine yourSELF and the warehouse of your MEMORIES - /*_all excluding any relations to your body_*/? Then what? I think the complexity *_"WE"_* includes the part thought of as body and bodily feelings so an abstract transport would not result in 'ourselves'. Even the (oriental) 'experts' in reincarnation deny memories of the previous format. The 'ant' does not remember what kind of 'man' he was, nor does a 'man' remember his former life-form.
Why should the 'expert' teleportation differ?
JM


The following is purely speculative. In reincarnation, we lose the information body completely (and all the classically encoded memories) and plunge back into Aris, in teleportation we keep the record of the body and reconstruct the states of it somewhere else, thus preserving the connection. All motion that is occurring now is teleportation, just in very small distances. The environment is both measuring us and reconstructing in the next location.


On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 8:50 PM, Stephen P. King <stephe...@charter.net <mailto:stephe...@charter.net>> wrote:

    On 10/2/2012 5:57 PM, John Mikes wrote:
    Stephen (and Bruno?)
    What I called The Aris - Total- meaning Aristotle's maxim that
    /the 'whole' is bigger than the sum of its parts/ - means
    something else in MY agnosticism. Originally I included only the
    fact what Bruno pointed out now: that the PARTS (as accounted
    for) develop relations (qualia) adding to the totality they
    participate in. Lately, however, I added to my view that beyond
    the accountable *_parts _*(forget now the relations) there are
    participant 'inconnu'-s from outside our (inventoried)
    model knowable as of yesterday. So whatever we take inventory of
    is an (accountable) *_partial_* only.
    Beyond that - of course - Aristotle's 'total' (/_"material parts
    only")_/ of his inventory was truly smaller than the above
    *_TOTAL_* in its entire complexity.
    The fact that complexity-parts extracted, or replaced may not
    discontinue the function of the 'total' is my problem with death:
    how to identify THOSE important components which are inevitable
    for maintaining the function as was?
    (Comes back to my negative attitude towards transport - hype (to
    Moscow, or another planet/universe) - complexity has uncountable
    connections in the infinite relations. How much could we possibly
    include (in our wildest fantasy) into the tele-transporting of a
    "person" (or whatever) so that the original functionality should
    be still detectable?)
    Heavenly afterlife anybody?
    John Mikes

    Hi John,

        "Aris", I like it! One question is how much of one's sense of
    self and memories can be carried across. Function does not seem to
    do this alone as it is completely independent of the physical "body".




    On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Stephen P. King
    <stephe...@charter.net <mailto:stephe...@charter.net>> wrote:

        On 10/1/2012 1:00 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote:

                Physiological realities are mechanistic. Biologists
                and doctors are
                mechanists. Even if you claim that "the whole is
                greater than the sum
                of its parts" that does not mean that if yoyu replace
                the parts the
                whole will stop working.


            Yes. Anti-mechanist often refer to "the whole is bigger
            than the parts", but nowhere else than in computer and
            engineering is it more true that the whole is bigger than
            the part, if only because the whole put some specific
            structure on the relation between parts.
            We might simplify this by saying that the whole
            *structural complexity* grows like an exponential (or
            more) when the whole cardinality grows linearly.


        H Bruno,

            Could you source some further discussions of this idea?
        From my own study of Cantor's tower of infinities, I have
        found the opposite, complexity goes to zero as the cardinals
        lose the ability to be named.




--
Onward!

Stephen

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