On Tuesday, April 23, 2013 5:16:44 AM UTC-4, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 22 Apr 2013, at 20:41, smi...@zonnet.nl <javascript:> wrote: > > > Any "aesthetic phenomena" or for that matter anything else we > > experience is described by the known laws of physics which tells you > > what matters is the way information is processed. > > > > So, I'm not conviced there really exists a well defined problem here > > with consciousness. We're told by philosphers that there is a > > problem and for a long time I believed there was a problem but I've > > recently come to the conclusion that simply identifying > > computational states with experiences solves the problem. > > > This is a confusion between Bp & Bp & p. You are correct, from God's > eye view, but no machine can see that, and this will explain the mind- > body difficulty, but with a price: physics becomes a branch of > machine's bio-psycho-theology. But that's a nice price, as it makes > comp testable and thus scientific in the usual sense. > > You cannot identify a computational state (a 3p relative notion), and > an experience (an 1p absolute notion). But, yes, from the truth point > of view, they will be equivalent (with some nuance, as a unique > computational state does not makes sense out of a computation, and > thus out of universal machine). Also, consciousness will be related to > infinities of computations. >
Consciousness is that which not only limits infinities, it replaces them. Universe rather than multiverse and gestalt wholes rather than ceaseless approximation. Vision allows us to see circularity, but a computer cannot conceive of circularity, it can only compare discrete values in a way which imitates circularity or continuity. The imitation is figurative however, not literal. The computer is not actually imitating continuity, any more than a flip book cartoon is imitating the natural flow of time awareness. It's interesting, Bruno, that you recognize the value of questions over answers, theories over physics, but with Bp & Bp & p, you are implicitly framing the 3p view as the Bp & p. I would think that you should agree with my view that the 3p view is a Bp within the total of all 1p. Belief is a type of awareness, as is physical interaction, but awareness itself can neither be a logical nor a physical agenda. No belief or physical substance can 'exist' without being held together by aesthetic sense of some kind. Craig > > Bruno > > > > > > > > Saibal > > > > Citeren Craig Weinberg <whats...@gmail.com <javascript:>>: > > > >> > >> > >> On Friday, April 19, 2013 6:59:28 PM UTC-4, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: > >>> > >>> It is whatever an algorithm is computing. All the information is > >>> in the > >>> computational state. If you have pain in your knee then exactly what > >>> you are experiencing must be unambiguously present in the > >>> computational > >>> state of your brain. > >>> > >> > >> Why would the computational state of your brain be associated with > >> any kind > >> of aesthetic phenomena though? That's Explanatory Gap. The Hard > >> Problem is > >> really about "why is there any such thing as aesthetic phenomena?" > >> > >> Craig > >> > >> > >>> > >>> Saibal > >>> > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> Groups "Everything List" group. > >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > >> send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > >> To post to this group, send email to everything- > >> li...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > >> Visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en > >> . > >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > Groups "Everything List" group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > > send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > > To post to this group, send email to > > everyth...@googlegroups.com<javascript:>. > > > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en > > . > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
