From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of John Clark
On Sat, Mar 1, 2014 Chris de Morsella <[email protected]> wrote:
> With power stations you don't need to worry about the same factors
(energy density etc) but you do need to worry about other things
>>And one of those other things you need to worry about is dimwitted and
hypocritical environmentalists who don't want power stations of ANY sort
built, ANYWHERE regardless of if they are renewable or non-renewable:
I am curious how my comment above that energy density is of lesser
importance in fixed site utility scale batteries than it is in batteries for
automotive/transport and portable electronics applications triggered your
tirade against environmentalists. How did we go from the importance of
energy density as a factor in weighing the merits of various battery
systems designed for the utility market; to shouting from the pulpit?
Land development issues are always going to be litigious in this country.
That litigation is occurring should not surprise anyone; that is how the
process works here.
*At the urging of environmentalist groups Sen. Feinstein of California has
tried to put 500,000 acres of solar drenched land in the Mojave desert off
limits to any solar development.
*Environmentalists tried everything they could think of to block a 2.1
billion dollar solar plant in Ivanpah California.
* The same people are trying to block a 680 million dollar solar plant in
Owens Valley.
* They were successful in killing a solar power station in Fresno County
California that would have supplied enough greenhouse free energy to power
75,000 homes.
* Environmentalists are trying their best to stop Obama from extending
permits to build wind farms from 5 years to 30 because they kill little
birdies.
*And to quote directly from their website:
"The Sierra Club opposes geothermal leasing or development in the following
areas:
1. Lands included in or adjacent to federal, state, or local park
systems or in wildlife refuges and management areas;
2. Areas known to provide habitat for rare or endangered species;
3. Areas designated as valuable for archaeological remains;
4. Units of the National Wilderness preservation System;
5. Units of the Wild and Scenic Rivers System;
6. Units of the National Trails System;
7. Areas reserved by the Secretary of the Interior or the Secretary of
Agriculture for ecological, scenic, natural, wildlife, geological,
educational, historical, or scientific value, including Primitive Areas,
Roadless Areas, Natural Areas, and Pioneer Areas;
8. Areas of de facto wilderness under study by the Secretary of the
Interior or the Secretary of Agriculture for reservation as part of one of
the preservation systems listed above; and
9. Areas of de facto wilderness which are the subject of intensive
study by recognized citizen groups or coalitions, resulting in formal
proposals to the agencies and/or Congress for reservation as part of one of
the preservation systems listed above."
>>As I said the prefers solution to the energy crises according to some is
to freeze to death in the dark.
That is your own personal opinion, and as always you are a highly
opinionated man - and the extremes - and liberal use of pejorative
adjectives -- in which you phrase your statements suggests that when it
comes to the environment your opinions are filled with ideologically driven
emotional content and are not the product of a reasoned level headed thought
process. Really man, what does this tirade have to do with energy storage
systems for the grid? It's so out of left field; it is a non-sequitur into
cable news shout shows.
Chris
John K Clark
- load balancing, etc - which is why non-renewable sources are unlikely to
go away completely for power stations (unless we get something like a
world-wide power grid, which I don't suppose is very feasible). But they
could still do a lot better than they are now.
A mix of renewables and gas turbines (which themselves could increasingly be
fueled by algae bio-gas sources). Gas turbines achieve 50% efficiency, are
relatively clean and are able to be spun up or spun down quite rapidly
making them the best choice for spinning reserve - along with hydro, which
can also take on the role of spinning reserve.
LFTR could provide a portion of baseload power that coupled with a much
larger energy storage capacity (that acts to decouple supply from demand and
smooth it all out) and the available spinning reserve could ensure grid
stability 24X7X365
Some - varying from place to place - mix of renewable sources + baseload
sources + spinning reserve + energy storage capacity will gradually supplant
the current power generation mix dominated by large dirty unsustainable coal
fired thermo-electric and an aging fleet of increasingly scary reactors
(such as the one in Florida where they have just discovered that its high
pressure steam tubes are worn up to 30% for example) a fleet of nukes that
are operating well past their design specs - routinely getting relicensed,
with SFP getting filled far beyond original intended capacity - by tight
packing the spent fuel.
Speaking of baseload power sources; there is another baseload source that
has a massive potential to scale, but also is saddled with some potentially
serious problems - of the kind that is a terrible PR nightmare. I speak of
engineered dry hot rock geothermal, using a similar fracking approach to
engineer a steam permeable reservoir in a deep volume of hot dry rock. It
would inject high pressure water/poppant slurry into the micro-factures the
very high pressure fluid creates in the rock mass, but without all the toxic
solvents, surfactants etc. present in the witches brews the gas companies
are pumping down dissolved in the fracking fluid used by the kerogen and gas
fracking plays. It has been tried a few times and famously in Basil seems to
have triggered a fairly noticeable tremor - which ended that experiment
immediately. For some reason the earth tremors are "acceptable" and little
mentioned when it comes to fracking for gas or kerogen, but become large
point headlines for dry rock geothermal.
It is a problem, but perhaps it is not that much of a problem in many
geologic formations. A much improved understanding of how the forces and
stresses at work in the deep hot bottom of the crust dynamically behave and
what effects fracking will have could address this. If this issue can be
addresses this form of geothermal energy has a pretty big upside potential
for supplying baseload power - it gets very hot beneath our feet a few miles
deep. and good deep rock formations are very widely available.
Chris
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