From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Telmo Menezes
Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 11:38 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Climate models
On Wed, Apr 9, 2014 at 8:18 PM, Chris de Morsella <[email protected]>
wrote:
_____
From: Telmo Menezes <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, April 9, 2014 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: Climate models
On Wed, Apr 9, 2014 at 5:06 PM, John Clark <[email protected]> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 8, 2014 at 1:04 PM, Chris de Morsella <[email protected]>
wrote:
Me: OK I'm going to go over this one more time very slowly and I'll try not
to use too many big words. First let's assume that solar cells work 5 times
better than they really do and the capacity factor is 1 instead of .2, then
worldwide solar cells would produce 1.5*10^11 watts of POWER. And in one
hour PV would produce 1.5*10^11 watt-hours of ENERGY. And in one year it
would produce 365*24 = 8760 times that much or 1.3*10^15 watt-hours of
ENERGY. And now lets see how much POWER would be required to run human
technology, it's 1.5 *10^17 watts of POWER. And to run it for one hour would
require 1.5*10^17 watt-hours of ENERGY. And to run it for one year would
require 365*24 = 8760 times that much or 1.3*10^21 watt-hours of ENERGY.
John,
Looking here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_energy_consumption
It seems that 1.5 * 10^17 is the total energy consumption of humanity in
watt-hours per year, not the power required. So the power required would be
almost 4 orders of magnitude smaller than what you assume (divide by 8760).
No?
Which is what I have been trying to tell him -- and being called an
ignoramus by him for pointing this out.
Chris
Hey Chris,
Try to take it lightly! If you look at the archives you'll see it's nothing
personal.
Maybe I'm a bit soft because my cat, that lived 12 years with me, died
recently. As long as we are all here in good health that shit really doesn't
matter.
Best,
Telmo.
I am sorry to hear about your cat - I know how hard it can be to lose a
loving pet - they become such a part of our lives that when they are gone a
hole is left inside of us that takes time to heal.
Chris
Telmo.
Now let's work on findings percentages. A percentage is a pure number with
no units and ENERGY and POWER have different units, so you can't divide
ENERGY by POWER as you did and expect to get anything meaningful, but you
can divide POWER by POWER and if you divide 1.5*10^11 watts of POWER by 1.5
*10^17 watts of POWER you get the pure number .000001. Or you could divide
the amount of ENERGY solar cells produce in one hour, 1.5*10^11 watt-hours
by the amount of ENERGY required to operate technology for one hour
1.5*10^17 watt-hours of ENERGY, and we still get the pure number .000001. Or
you could divide the amount of ENERGY solar cells produce in one year,
1.3*10^15 watt-hours of ENERGY, by the amount of ENERGY required to operate
technology for one year, 1.3*10^21 watt-hours of ENERGY, and we STILL get
the pure number .000001 And that is why I originally said photovoltaics
provide .0001% of demand. However you said that in the real world solar
cells are much worse than that and the capacity factor is not 1 but is .2,
and that seems about right to me, so they only produce 20% of the POWER and
20% of the ENERGY that I used in the above calculation, therefore
photovoltaics really only provide .00002% of what is required to run the
world.
> You: John you are so full of yourself that you cannot admit you mistook
capacity for output
Chris, 4 or 5 posts ago it became obvious to me that you are a ignoramus,
your total confusion between power and energy and your bizarre belief that
solar cells are better if they have a 20% conversion factor than if they had
a 100% conversion factor could lead to no other conclusion. However being a
ignoramus is not necessarily a devastating state to be in because sometimes
ignorance is curable; but more recently it became clear that you are also
incapable of learning, or at least learn at such a slow rate it is
unmeasurable by me. And unfortunately at the present day medical science has
no cure for stupid.
John K Clark
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