On 15-04-2016 01:49, Brent Meeker wrote:
On 4/14/2016 12:38 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 13 Apr 2016, at 19:30, John Clark wrote:
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 12:27 PM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]>
wrote:
> The general consensus that QM is not local applies to
QM+collapse, or QM+one-world. We know that this needs spooky action
at a distance since Einstein Podolski Rosen. Bell made this clear
and testable
Yes, bell proposed a way to test that and the experiment was
later performed, so now we know empirically that from any viewpoint
that can exist if things are non-local then things are either:
1) Not realistic (those who like pomposity
can call it " counterfactual definiteness
")
2) Not deterministic
3) Not either
It's true that from a point of view that
can
NOT
exist, like the viewpoint
of somebody
standing outside
of
the multiverse looking
back in
at it,
all 3 of those attributes, locality determinism and realism,
can exist together;
but as I said that is a viewpoint that can not exist
.
So I find that no more remarkable than saying if 2+2=5 then
2+2+2=7.
From the viewpoint of any observer anywhere in the
multiverse ( in other words from any possible observer) determinism
locality and realism cannot all be true, at least one must be wrong.
Yes no problem with this. That is the whole point, as QM explains why
determinisme and locality entails from the (sharable first person
plural) point of view of each observer in the multiverse things looks
indeterminate and non local, but nowhere is there any action at a
distance, nor any indeterminacy or event without "cause". Note that
here QM confirms computationalism which predicts the similar
phenomenological indeterminacy and non-locality.
I'd say the variable defining which branch you are experiencing is a
non-local hidden variable.
If you discard all the other branches and make it a single universe
theory. Otherwise, the concept of locality only applies to each separate
universe and if you have the entire set you don't need a variable to
specify which universe actually exists.
Saibal
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