On 31 May 2018 at 03:38, Brent Meeker <[email protected]> wrote: > > > On 5/30/2018 11:38 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > Le mer. 30 mai 2018 à 20:29, Brent Meeker <[email protected]> a écrit : >> >> >> >> On 5/30/2018 3:18 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> 2018-05-30 11:27 GMT+02:00 Lawrence Crowell >> <[email protected]>: >>> >>> On Tuesday, May 29, 2018 at 1:25:19 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> You miss my point that no one, no physicists, no philosopher, starts out >>>> by defining "primary matter". It is your invention as a straw man to be >>>> defeated by computationalism. Some physicists and some philosophers may >>>> suppose that the stuff described by physics is enough to explain the world >>>> we observe; but most also suppose that it is not "primary". They look for >>>> a >>>> deeper more unified ur-stuff and many physicists have followed Wheeler and >>>> Tegmark in thinking of the equations of mathematical physics as simply >>>> defining the ur-stuff. >>>> >>>> Brent >>> >>> >>> This and other old philosophical ideas are of no utility in physics. >>> There is no physical meaning to terms such as primary matter. >> >> >> Primary matter is a metaphysical idea about the reality... so of course it >> is of no utility in physics... but physics don't tell us anything about what >> is reality. >> >> >> Yet it tells us about how the world works and what we can and can't do. >> So what exactly would it add know "what is reality". This is exactly like >> my point about consciousness. When we can predict, construct, manipulate, >> consciousness the way we do the physical world, then the "hard problem" of >> consciousness will be as irrelevant as elan vitale is to biology and >> "primary matter" is to physics. >> >> >> Everythingism are metaphysical idea about what is reality... so if your >> concern is only in utility, philosophy doesn't concern you... >> >> Materialism, physicalim, computationalism, deism etc are metaphysical, >> philosophical and about what reality is... physics is about prediction on >> the reality, not about what ultimately reality is... it answers how, not >> what and why... >> >> The problem is with people equating physics whith physicalism... they're >> not the same, one is a metaphysical idea about the nature of reality. >> >> >> But I'm suggesting to you that this metaphysical idea is empty if it has >> no consequences, but if it does have consequences then it's physics and not >> metaphysics. > > > > That is your point of view which I do not share... You're like people who > don't like arts and find that empty... As long as you're not imposing your > view, I'm fine with it. > > > As I am fine with those seeking the elan vitale and primary matter. Just so > they don't use my tax money.
You're a bit naughty Brent. You sometimes use this maneuver of nonchalantly listing something that is being discussed -- but that you don't like -- along with something else that is obviously outdated or silly. "Oh you think that quantum mechanics and consciousness might be connected? How are those Deepak Chopra teachings working for you?" etc... So, forgetting the elan vitale, I would like you to make you position more precise. Do you think that tax money should only be applied to research that is obviously and immediately useful? Or are you ok with trusting tenured academics and peer-review to decide what gets funded? In the second case, I guess we must all have some tolerance for ideas that we don't agree with, right? Telmo. > Brent > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
